The Funding Zone Scoreboard

2017 Football Forum

Written by: on Sunday, January 1st, 2017


Are you ready for some football?

Welcome to the official forum on high school football for the 2017 season.

During the off-season let’s talk about players, recruiting news, teams and everything about high school football.

During the season each week let’s talk about match-ups and how teams did. Let us know what player(s) stood out each week.

2016 Football Forum

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781 Responses to “2017 Football Forum”

  1. David Mika says:

    Happy New Year!

  2. Mike F says:

    New year, same discussion of private vs public to take place in 3,2,1

  3. SC says:

    Want the discussion to go away? There’s only one anser:)

  4. SC says:

    With a lot of key seniors graduating from perennial state champ teams…are all 6 classes wide open? Whole Central Line is gone besides david green. Whole SJP line is gone. SC lost almost everyone. McDowell lost almost everyone. Could Williamsport be an actual contender for 6A? Potts and some very big lineman returning. 5A has harrisburg coming back loaded..but an always competitive Wood team. An there will definitely be a wildcard from the WPIAl in conention. 4A CP loses two d1 lineman, but returns Bauer, Mischler and Scruggs. Imhotep returns justin johnson and Isheem Young. Dont know much about 3A…2A we got all of steel valley graduating besides nas west. Southern Columbia will probably be back in full force. What happens with single A? Clairton loses wade…BG loses a lot of key players but returns most of that line. Will be interesting to say the least.

  5. Jack1234 says:

    I feel like it will be open but we will still see the usual suspects. Central has enough coming back to contend, sjp probably does too and some of their faithful claim that the upcoming groups will be better than this past state title team, I doubt that very much. Losing a player like swift is big, but they have their QB and a D1 wideout coming back on offense. Their defense returns alot too. Not sure anyone in the east could compete besides north penn maybe. Central loses essentially their only playmakers on offense in justice evans on the outside and jj younger as a runningback, along with that line. Their line next year will be similar size wise just from seeing their JV play before and looking at their rooster. The experience won’t be the same however, and I highly doubt they will be able to produce all 5 D1 starters again. In the WPIAL I don’t see a team being able to beat them again besides pine richland, who returns a majority of their team from this past year. Their defense has 3/4 returning in the secondary and I assume some of those kids might double up on offense. Also a few other kids I know that played besides green cant remember names though. 5A west A has some guys coming back like kenny white brandon lipford and others I don’t know enough about 5A though. Id assume harrisburg having parsons and others makes them a favorite along with wood who always is in the mix. Alot of these schools like PCC SJP wood ect reload every year so I never count them out. In 6A I have a really good feeling about pine richland though if they’re healthy, they should end up being preason number 1

  6. sausmann9 says:

    Well I guess in keeping w/ the topic of private schools (I know Mike F. you’re smiling) I will throw this out to start my new year of posting regarding private schools and their players;

    Congrats Kolton McGee from Bishop Guilfoyle on being the ONLY rep for PA on the soph, junior, senior all american teams from Max Prep. Great job kid and keep it going!!!

  7. sausmann9 says:

    @Mike F – hey if you come across five or six of those games on that list you want to see, just get back to me via email or this site and I’ll send them, no cost of course. Enjoy the list and the off season.

  8. SC says:

    Erie private schools combining football teams, proposition has been sent to PIAA.

  9. B Powell says:

    Private schools?

  10. Billy Splain says:

    Incorrect’s the Erie public schools.

  11. M says:

  12. sausmann9 says:

    @ M – good article link. this quote from PIAA is what I find most hilarious/most disturbing;

    “The PIAA prohibits two or more schools with enrollments of more than 300 students each from merging sports programs. The rule is designed to prevent the creation of “super schools,” Iacino has said.”

    but the PIAA has nothing to do or say about schools bringing in star athletes from other states which in a sense creates “super-schools” or “super-teams” by default. Allentown School District in D11 wanted to do this a few years back and the idea was shot down. Sounds like the PIAA DOES NOT have the best interest of the students/schools but instead the best interest of their “friends” schools. This leads to kids NOT playing because they see no benefit/no playoff/no prize at the end of the season b/c who wants to practice all season long only to face a loaded up private team w/ kids from all over. Make the field more level and I bet more kids play on public teams.

    Talk about the blind leading the blind.

  13. B. Powell says:

    You’re right and a good post and good article.

    It’s also hard to catch up to the “have” schools who have it going ON. For instance, the Bishop Guilfoyle SR’s got (60) games in, I believe. 60!
    This was created from their success, but that’s essentially (6) years of high school football time. 15 X 4 = 60 where many schools are getting just (40) games in. 10 x 4 = (40).

  14. SC says:

    Meant public, sorry it was a brainfart

  15. SC says:

    Yeah that rule doesn’t make a whole lot of sense. As if having a large school indicates a level of success. Reading & McCaskey are two of the biggest schools in PA, no one complains about reading high having 3500 male students in grades 9-11, because they aren’t very good. Cumberland Valley is much bigger than state college and Harrisburg but their lineman are half the size of sc and hburg, I would have no problem with the Erie pubs combining, it’s not like they will beat CP or McDowell

  16. B. Powell says:

    Within their own high school sports region (Erie) there isn’t much complaining from the 4A sized teams having to play the larger schools. They have been doing this for years even before the realignment took place.
    So if Erie gets sanctioned for 6A they give McDowell some competition for a few sports. ECP will always be ECP and General McLane and FLB seem to be ok with things. They have been used to the “Big Boy” league for quite some time.

  17. Billy Splain says:

    Big changes for the BIG33 >> Click here

  18. Mike F says:


    Reading has 3500 boys in their school and they cannot find 22 players good enough to compete at a top level? Why is that?

  19. Billy Splain says:

    When Al Wolski was there they had a decent program. From 2000 – 2003 they made the D3 playoffs. They were there again in 2014, lost to CD and ended up 8-3 Most of it is coaching, a good staff can get a program rolling. Some schools just don’t put a priority on some sports…Reading is a basketball school

  20. SC says:

    Honestly no idea, I mean usually when you get a very big school in the suburbs they have considerable success, North Penn NA and CV for examples. But reading high is a city school so they probably don’t have a culture of football so the kids who would be talented at it never even try to play football, I’m pretty sure they used to be good a long time ago, they are a formidable basketball school, just need someone to turn things around there

  21. sausmann9 says:

    way to go Wade, Ford (keeping the wpial strong), and Frederick on repping Western PA football!!!

  22. chrisk says:

    Journey Brown’s PSU commitment is a win for a good kid and all of District 10. PSU’s only RB taken in this cycle. Little Exposure and less competition are obstacles that can be overcome. These high level successes lead the way for others in the fly over districts and counties to follow. Isaiah Manning from Meadville will be senior next year, for those who don’t know of him…expect D1 offers for him as well.

  23. sausmann9 says:

    @Chrisk – yeah so glad to see Brown going to PSU. Years back alot of us D10 fans loved when Gio Vendemia ended up at PSU as well. Good luck to Journey Brown for sure.

  24. Mike S says:

    Regarding Journey, I watch Meadville games on video and have seen a lot his games for 3 years. Gotten bigger and faster each year. I live in metro Birmingham, Ala. and go to HS games here, including games of Hoover HS, the 7A class champion and nationally ranked every year. I see great HS talent, and Journey ranks as high as any “speed back” I’ve seen here in at last the last decade. He has tremendous vision and cutting ability and get himn out of the Double Wing or whatever it is Meadville runs and put him in as an I formation tailback, bside a shotgun QB, or make him a jet sweep guy. He will show out when his chance comes. likely a RS year first. He’s got SEC type speed. And Chris is right, Izzy Manning is great, played much of the season with a shoulder injury, and he’s a strong power back. Would love to see him in an I formation.

  25. Mike F says:

    Let’s try something different here. How many players from WPA are still in the NFL playoffs.

    That I know:


    Jesse James South Allegheny


    The Gronk Woodland Hills

    Packers: a few coaches any players?


    Anybody know of anyone else?

  26. sausmann9 says:

    @ Mike F – for Grreen Bay I think they still have Mica Hyde and Corry Lindsay but both played for Ohio in either 08 or 09.

    as for Atlanta, they have Matt Schwab and CJ Goodwin.

  27. sausmann9 says:

    @ Mike F – sorry bud, I read your post wrong. CJ Goodwin only PA player left from WPA. Others from Ohio and Eastern PA. sorry, thought you meant for all Big 33 alum. my bad.

  28. chrisk says:

    Randy Fitchner, Steelers asst coach since Tomlin arrived. Played at Meadville, DB at Purdue.

    Paul Puz still plays
    B. Marshall
    Hawkins for Johnstown
    how about Heyward
    Brandon Marshall

  29. chrisk says:

    Hawkins retired, sorry

  30. chrisk says:

    only reason I can stomach Cowboys Sean Lee and Church from Penn Hills

  31. chrisk says:

    I will shut up! you said still playing

  32. M says:

    Tyler Boyd-Cincinnati Bengals

  33. Billy Splain says:

    the Bengals missed the playoffs M. By a long mile

  34. M says:

    Missed the playoff part, sorry.

  35. Mike F says:

    Screw it lets just list guys from WPA schools that are still on active rosters then.

  36. chrisk says:

    offseason holy war to commence in 3, 2, 1

    western pa Private vs Public Grads who play in NFL…hahahah

  37. Wpialfan says:

    Don’t mention gronk he had 1 year in Wpa caz his dad wanted him to play for a good high school team.

  38. Lions says:

    Mike hull with Miami
    Jordan Norwood Denver from state college
    Nate stupar New Orleans from state college

  39. Mike F says:


    I get that about Gronk but he still played his Sr year at a WPA school so that counts in my book. This is very WPIAL centric need help with the other areas.

    Woodland Hills:
    Gronk- Pats
    Rotnez Miles- Jets

    Revis- Jets

    Seneca Valley:
    Don Barclay- Packers
    Brandon Fusco- Vikings

    Pittsburgh Central Catholic:
    Stefan Wisniewski- Eagle

    Paul Poslusney- Jags

    Terrell Pryor- Browns

    Upper St Clair:
    Sean Lee- Cowboys

    Penn Hills:
    Aaron Donald- Rams
    Barry Church- Cowboys

    South Allegheny:
    Jesse James- Steelers

    Canon McMillian:
    Mike Hull-Dolphins

    Seton LaSalle:
    Gino Gradkowski- Panthers

    Pat McCaffe- Colts

    Will Clark- Bengals

    Tyler Boyd- Bengals

    AQ Shipley- Cardinals

    Chartiers Valley:
    Eric Kush- Bears

    JP Holtz-Browns

  40. M says:

    Update on the Erie School District combining athletic teams.

  41. phillyboy says:

    I hope like heck the PIAA approves the Erie public consolidation for sports teams. I don’t know how many teams would be shed but, man finally there should be a very legit public team in D10 that’s not called Cathedral Prep. I so hope this happens.

  42. M says:

    I’m not sure if it will as it has been sent back to District 10 as far as I understand. Here is an article as to how it may look if it happens at all.

  43. M says:

    Point of view of some previous Erie standouts.

  44. phillyboy says:

    Merge Baby Merge! I’m so tired of ECP waltzing and skipping to the state title game while everybody gazes at their greatness. If all those public teams consolidate should make for a very interesting roster.

  45. Ryan says:

    Hi my name is Ryan Kunz and I used to play football before I hurt my back and subsequently discovered the Buddha. After this discovery I quit football for the life of the party and for easier ways. Once I hurt my back I had a great abundance of free time and I watched this film called Prometheus and this one line really struck me, “nature doesn’t make straight lines” after that film and that line I realized I needed to be one with the trees, the river, and the Buddha. Now all I can think about is the Buddha – hahaha 😎 go Cleveland browns!!

  46. D10 Fan says:

    ECP waltzes and skips its way through D10, yes, but beating TJ and Berks Catholic does not qualify as waltzing and skipping. They also beat a Buffalo Canius (enrollment equivalent of a 6A team in PA) team that won the NY state title this year. They played a tough schedule outside of D10 that prepared them to do what they did vs Imhotep. I’d say tep waltzed and skipped their way to Hershey way more than ECP did.

  47. B. Powell says:

    Not only that, ECP will still be ECP and they will hover on the upper 4A to low 5A class size.
    For 2017 they are 4A, but the next official count we shall see if they remain 4A or go up to 5A. It ECP does move up to 5A for football in 2018 and 2019, expect the current D10 5A public school teams to drop down to 4A classification. That will continue like that, I believe.

    The new Erie school (Central?) would be 6A and would play against McDowell for post season.

  48. Mike S says:

    Don’t be surprised if 1 or 2 of those current D10 5A schools (4A schools that choose to play up to avoid CP) end up losing enrollment, fall to 3A for 2018.

  49. Mike S says:

    For example Conneaut boys enrollment was just 285, just over the 4A minimum of 283. Enrollment drops by 4 or 5 kids for 2018 and they could be a large 3A school while prep will always likely be just under the minimum for 5A, making it one of if not the largest 4A school.

  50. Tully says:

    ECP (and Imhotep on the other side of the state) should be ashamed of themselves playing 4a. Hollow state championships in my view. Not the kids in any way. They play who is scheduled for them to play and deserving. Administrations at fault clearly making trophy hunting the priority.

  51. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Yeah shame on them for playing in their classification……SMH.

  52. Drew says:

    Why even mention the kids? You’ve already said their hard work meant nothing by winning a “hollow championship.” Im sure the administration at CP didn’t lose any sleep over winning the championship and seeing their kids (who they don’t care about, only trophies right?) crying tears of joy.

  53. chris k says:

    1)Never been a ECP Fan…ever. Never been a Pats fan either. Millions HATE the Steelers as well. They all have a common denominator. They generally win.

    2)Generally speaking…if D10 didn’t have ECP are we suggesting that D-10 would be a powerhouse?

    3)Every year, there will be a D-10 school (not named ECP that) can at least “somewhat compete” with them. But ECP is the Standard in D-10 Football and Football only

    4)Powerhouse schools and powerhouse districts garner more attention for a reason. if your kid can play for one, it is “better” from a strictly football perspective. Journey Brown from Meadville. was only a 3 star back why???. Fastest Kid in the State, last week ran a 6.7 60m making it the fastest time in PA history, and 10th in the entire country. Add to that over 7,000 yards rushing. it has been widely reported that he lacked exposure and competition. Had he played at ECP or West Allegheny or PCP and the like there is no question that he would have been one of the top ranked recruits in PA and country. He may have only had 5,000+ yards playing against better competition week in and out…but still. PSU had 19 full rides available and he got 1. The come lately’s have arrived, he was named a Parade All American, all state and bla bla bla after PSU. Unfortunately, where you play and against whom matters. many Journey Browns, sadly, have passed through unnoticed.

    5) I urge all parents of players(I am not) and all coaches (I am not) to do right by their kids. Offer all the exposure possible when exposure is not a given. It is my belief that the PIAA and district itself should be charged with equal representation and promotion of its Players. too many kids don’t have the resources to do it alone. Boosters should be charged with promotion as well.

    when the wind stops blowing, row!

  54. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Great Post Chris K.

  55. B. Powell says:

    The Governor just brought forth his new budget and says it is balanced and is to be reviewed.
    Currently though, there is very little financial help for the Erie School District in that plan.
    Big changes will be coming for the public school system in Erie County if the Erie City schools cant make it.

  56. Tully says:

    I am talking enrollment, but you guys are probably right. I am sure it is complete coincidence that borderless school ECP is the biggest 4a school in the state. Smh……

  57. Mike S. says:

    Chris K — very valid points I’ve made to people as well. It really hurt Journey Brown playing in Crawford County, but also in an unconventional double wing offense.

    There was some talk of Brown playing his senior season at McDowell in Erie where he has some family but it just never happened. I’m in metro Birmingham, Alabama about 10 miles from perennial 7A state champ Hoover HS and have seen plenty of 4 and 5 star running backs in HS, including Rnell Williams who played at Etowah HS near Gadsden, AL, played Auburn and was the No. 5 pick in the NFL draft. I think Journey is a bit raw, never played a true tailback position, but he has as much ability as any “speed back” I’ve seen in Alabama in the 30 years I’ve been going to HS games down here. He needs a RS year, and then watch out for him in punt and KO returns before he gets a try at RB.

  58. Jack1234 says:

    Pine Richland is playing Wayne from Huber Heights Ohio on ESPN for their week 0 game next season. Original two year deal with Saint Edwards fell through because I guess ESPN didn’t want to do another saint eds game.

  59. Mcd 65 says:

    Jack 1234, Wayne/Pine Richland should be a great match. Too bad St. Eds fell through. Archbishop Wood played Wayne last year to a 21/21 tie weather shortened game that was a shootout after 1 quarter.

  60. Jack1234 says:

    Yes I remember that. It’ll be an interesting match up and a high scoring one going into it on paper.

  61. phillyboy says:

    Yo dudes, is Pine-Richland expected to have a pretty nice team this year, and what about North Allegheny? NA seems like the western Pa. counterpart to North Penn, a big, rich suburban school with a fair amount of support.

  62. Jack1234 says:

    Pine Richland might be the number one 6A team in the WPIAL heading into next season. They have all their starters but two linemen returning on offense, and most of their defense returns. The word I’ve heard a lot of in the community is this upcoming group of seniors might be better than the group they had that went to Hershey in 2014.

    NA is very big and they have close to 100 kids on their roster for foot I’d say that’s a accurate comparison. I know people that went to NA and they didn’t even know half their class. They lose a lot but just due to their size they always field a decent squad every year. They haven’t been the same as they used to be back when they won the state titles, but still pretty good. This season they might not be as good as they were the past few years however. They lose quite a bit on both sides of the ball including their big play QB, their go to wide out, and their best linemen who’s going to notre dame along with a bunch of other SR starters. I don’t know as much about NA or PCC as some of the other guys on here but I do know both are taking hard hits from graduation and PR might be the team to beat from the WPIAL in 6A.

  63. phillyboy says:

    @ Jack1234

    Thanks for that man. You fill me with some excitement in regards to the prospects of P-R this year as I’m enjoying a nice cup of coffee. Darn near feel like moving out to Pittsburgh now, my coffee’s talking. I’m an unabashed fan of the publics, baby. Pine-Richland and NA are great programs, hopefully they can bring it this year. I remember a couple years ago Darren was talking up Woodland Hills, and then they kind of petered out.

  64. Jack1234 says:

    I hope they can too, tbh sick of seeing the state title come down to PCC or SJP, and PCC winning the wpial title every year. Would like to see someone else get it or at least give them a more competative game.

  65. Chuck L says:

    I expect PCC to be decent to pretty good. How good, remains to be seen. They should be PCC like at the skill positions on offense. The back seven will be the strength of the defense with question marks on he defensive line. Been told that they feel good about 3 of the 5 O line positions with question marks at Guard. Their Freshman and JV teams were undefeated so there probably will be some good additions to the varsity from those squads.

  66. Jack1234 says:

    I would assume PCC has some size on thier lines returning which always is an advantage, when i saw their JV they looked pretty big. It will be interesting to see how they reload on some of their linemen they lose alot of three year starters.

  67. WPIAL Rules says:

    PCC Freshmen O-Line size average: 6′ 260 lbs. And those boys have been hitting the gym since then. They know there are big shoes to fill and they all want the opportunity. There were 54 freshmen last year. But I do agree, PR will be the team to beat this year giving how many starters are returning.

  68. Jack1234 says:

    No wonder their freshman team went undefeated. most freshman teams I know of would kill to have linemen in the 210-220 range and maybe 25 kids. Thats crazy having 54 kids. Thats more kids than some of the 4-5A schools have on their varsity, maybe even some of the 6A. Without beating the recruiting or unfair advantage from getting kids from different places arguments to death its pretty impressive and no wonder they dominate everyone with that size and depth.

  69. WPIAL Rules says:

    @Jack1234 I personally sent my boys there because the school district they live in sucks at both academic and athleticsee. My son was not recruited, and he started on both sides of the line. I only want the best for them.

  70. Jack1234 says:

    IMO that’s fine but I’ve always thought that PCC and schools like it should just play national schedules and play better competition on a weekly basis because they might get one or two competitive teams from their conference and the rest are over before the first quarter ends

  71. Chuck L says:

    Jack, if I was calling the shots at Central, that’s exactly what I would do, However, to pull that off they would have to recruit big time.

  72. Jack1234 says:

    Honestly if they left the wpial and became an IMG like school I’d be fine with that. It would make the 6A wpial scene more interesting and competitive and you would see different teams getting chances, the balance of power would be much more even. Sure the PR’s and NA’s would still be the top dogs but it wouldn’t be lopsided anymore in PCC’s favor

  73. Jack1234 says:

    Also it looks like erie mcdowell will be playing saint eds for their week 0 game now. Anyone know how good mcdowell is coming into next season? Saint eds was suppose to be pretty strong this year after a little bit of a down year this past season.

  74. Chuck L says:

    Read that Joey Porter’s 2 sons and 2 nephews along with Jason Guildon’s two sons are transferring to North Allegheny. They are waiting for WPIAL approval to play football. Just might be what NA needs to more than compete this year versus Pine Richland and Central.

  75. Jack1234 says:

    Yes I saw that too. Not entirely sure how good any of them are or how they will make an impact next season but truthfully i have doubts they will be ruled eligible for next season these transfers seem like they are athletic because they all left north catholic when guildon was fired as head coach

  76. WPIAL Rules says:

    @ Chuck and Jack, Do you both think that Tomlin’s kid will also be ruled ineligible for transferring to Shady Side Academy from North Catholic? They left at the same time for the same reasons.

  77. phillyboy says:

    That is awesome news about those transfers to NA! The WPIAL should absolutely allow this. Sincerely, bravo to Joey Porter and Jason Gildon for NOT transferring them to ‘you know where’ (give you a hint: they wear yellow and purple) but rather, sending them to the big time public program. Totally appreciate you guys for supporting the local public football program. North Allegheny is a prime time program, almost reminds me of a big time public from the Dallas or Houston area, and that’s saying something.

  78. Jack1234 says:

    Not sure if those ones will get eligbility either. One of tomlins kids is a basketball player I believe. @phillyboy if they transferred for athletic intent then they should not be elgible. Just because they didn’t go to PCC doesn’t mean they should be exempt. IMO this transfer crap has really gotten out of hand the past few years, it’s like high school free agency

  79. phillyboy says:

    I agree with you, Jack1234, ideally each kid should go to his local school regardless of extracurriculars, but look, as Billy Joel once said, ‘we didn’t start the fire’. You die by the sword….you live by the sword, can’t just sit idly by while your talent is getting pilfered. If the WPIAL and PIAA has such a laissez-faire attitude in regards to transfers, then it should absolutely be consistent–that’s the key.

  80. Chuck L says:

    IMO all these kids are transferring to NA for athletic intent. However, I would bet that all will eventually be ruled eligible to play football. If not by the WPIAL then on appeal by the PIAA. Of course I’m of the opinion that there should be no transfer restrictions so I’m ok with them playing. BTW, the last two NA state championship teams included the sons of a Steelers coach. This could be Deja Vue.

  81. Chuck L says:

    Failed to mention those two kids were also transfers.

  82. Chuck L says:

    I think the Tomlin kid will be eligible, too much pull to contend with. He’s supposed to be good. I find it interesting that they didn’t transfer to PCC. They live within walking distance to the school and Shady Side has been terrible.

  83. WPIAL Rules says:

    @phillyboy haven’t you been getting shut down and out on Easternpafootball? PCC are Blue and Yellow. We all know your dislike for PCC.
    Now onto an intelligent conversation, @Chuck, if they rule negatively on the boys going to NA, it should be the same for the Tomlins going to SAD. And yes they have gone down hill over the last 5 years. They even forfeited the last game of the season last year. And as far as transferring to PCC, maybe because of being a small fish in a big pond? Or the possibility lack of playing time? They could still transfer to PCC in June?

  84. Jack1234 says:

    They could’ve went to shady side to avoid having to playing porters kids and newphews and guildons kids if they went to pcc. The one that plays football is only a sophomore there’s more than enough time for him to end up pcc before he’s a senior.

  85. phillyboy says:

    Maybe Tomlin could send his kid to NA as well even if it means paying tuition. @ WPIAL Rules: I’m doing fine over on, they love me, I totally respect western Pa. football, trying to educate myself to it more. IMO the PCC template is corny; they fabricate a team from the Pittsburgh area and then beat everybody by what seems to be the same score every week, 45-7. Have to admit, their uniforms are strack, really sharp, but I prefer teams that are more organic so to speak.

  86. Chuck L says:

    WPIAL, was thinking the same thing about possible playing time at Central as in small fish in a big pond. I think Tomlin was a Soph last year, listed at 135 LBS. Tough to play for Central at that weight. Looks pretty fast when you look at his highlites, supposedly has an offer from Iawa St.

  87. WPIAL Rules says:

    Chuck, he is definitely a fast young man. I hope the best for his decision at SSA. Giving where he lives, he has limited options on school since CWNC is now out of the question.

  88. Billy Splain says:

    Looks like Erie consolidation will happen this year. Click here

  89. B. Powell says:

    You could see that one coming. You could just see it…
    Now, Strong Vincent and Erie East are to be middle schools.
    Erie Central will be a 6A school, I would think and the new, North region would probably be something like:
    McDowell, Erie Central 6A.
    GM, FLB and Warren 5A.
    Cathedral Prep 4A.

    I would think they shift Warren over to the north region to balance things out.

  90. B. Powell says:

    Actually, Warren is still 4A

  91. B. Powell says:

    Hey Bill,
    What happens if the PIAA won’t officially sanction Erie Central as 6A if they don’t fit within the rules? Can they just play in our region and not be allowed into post season?
    Or would they now be considered a large, merger school and not a co-op?

  92. Billy Splain says:

    no idea, this story is developing much faster that originally anticipated….more than likely they will be placed in 6A by PIAA

  93. WPIAL Rules says:

    Regarding Erie, how many boys are currently signed up to play football and how many will sign up after the merger? Will more leave and head to ECP? This merge could push ECP to 5 or 6A depending on how many of those boys are not happy with the new program?

  94. Billy Splain says:

    it doesn’t matter how many boys sign up to define classification, it’s total boys in school….they’ll be 6A, but it COULD push ecp to 5A if more go there. but that wouldn’t take affect until the 2018 season

  95. phillyboy says:

    That’s awesome news about The Erie publics consolidating. It doesn’t automatically mean they’ll have a good team, but it definitely helps their chances. I don’t know that it will effect the enrollment at ECP because many families may not be able to afford the tuition. Furthermore, I imagine there will be a bit of a buzz about the prospects of this public team so many kids will want to be a part of it in the same way that many kids in Philly go to Imhotep. I’m concerned that ECP might try to counter this by doling out scholarships like there’s no tomorrow.

  96. Billy Splain says:

    I can tell you flat out phillyboy that ECP is not that kind of school. I can also tell you this is NOT like the situation at Imhotep. There won’t be a choice. This will be the only public school they can play for in Erie unless they somehow get into CP. It is FAR from exciting news. It’s actually quite depressing and unwelcome but necessary. It will affect coaches, 2 whole staffs will be gone. It will affect cheerleaders, 2 squads gone.

  97. B. Powell says:

    It is not seen as good or awesome news up here. This is turmoil and it is close to a last resort.
    They are trying to find ways to keep their doors open, long term.
    This is the short term solution and a decent plan, so far.

  98. phillyboy says:

    I understand that it’s a bit of local crisis up in Erie for more important reasons (people losing jobs and being strapped financially), those things are obviously more important. Was just trying to point out that from a strictly football standpoint it bodes well since undoubtedly the starting roster should be better, it’s a numbers game. Just think what would happen if, say, CB West, CB East, and CB South went back to one high school or Downingtown East and West combined again — it would be like back in the day.

  99. ALLTUNA says:

    phillyboy…it’s nothing like imhotep, imhotep is a charter school which is publicly funded, with no district boundaries and no tuition. This merger school is just like any big high school, you dont choose to go there. They will not be good or a power, they have no history, they have large problems facing them, to equate them to a pop up power like Imhotep is insulting and shows your lack of knowledge…

  100. phillyboy says:

    ALLTUNA…dude, are you a woman? Intuitively I feel like I’m dealing with the fairer sex and that’s ok. Look, I was merely trying to show my enthusiasm over the prospects and potential of an all-star like public team in Erie. As an unabashed fan of the publics regardless of geography I’m pretty stoked about that. My viewpoint on this may be a lot of things but I don’t think ‘insulting’ is one of them.

    If it’s mandatory that all kids go to one high school without choice that’s better insomuch as enrollment is concerned. Generally speaking, the bigger the school the better the odds of having a more talented team. Still, this is no guarantee of success but it’s an intriguing advantage. I remember a few years ago South Phila. High (Southern) combined with former Public League AAA power Bok; ended up being a disappointment on the field. Coaching and support are always a huge part of it.

  101. Chuck L says:

    Kenny White of Wesr Allegheny transferring to Pine Richland. Tried to transfer to PCC last year. Very good player, indeed.

  102. Jack1234 says:

    Huge loss for west A and big gain for PR. That might put PR over the top as a favorite for 6A next season.

  103. phillyboy says:

    Yo Chuck L, that is killer news man. I googled that, interesting article, kid has an offer to Iowa State and Howard — are you kidding me?! The Pittsburgh area gets it, they have pride in their community public schools. Man, I might have to change my name to pittboy. Cannot wait.

  104. Billy Splain says:

    what does that even mean phillyboy? How does moving from one school to another show pride? Pride in schools would mean you stay where you are. Winning a state title don’t mean squat in the big picture of life. Your support for moving from school to school just to make a HS program better is disturbing. I find the whole subject depressing.

  105. Mcd 65 says:

    hillyboy, yes change your name to pittboy from now on.

  106. phillyboy says:

    Billy…whether you believe it or not I actually agree with the gist of what you said. Problem is the privates are already artificially effecting things so to speak. So you can just sit back and watch the privates gobble up all the state titles like the Sesame Street cookie monster or can at least appreciate when things go favorably for the publics in a similar way. At best you’re being naive, at worst a little hypocritical IMO, sorry.

    Go Pine-Richland, baby!!!

  107. Billy Splain says:

    public schools joining the free agent market isn’t the solution…we are working on that…Hopefully soon a clampdown on transfers is coming soon

  108. Doug Smith says:

    Billy, The PIAA is working on it NOT you.The real truth is Billy you can’t stand the Philly schools beating up your Western teams. Right?

  109. Billy Splain says:

    no Doug, the real truth is I work closely with the PIAA..I did a lot of research for the 6 classification proposal and I’m helping with a proposal for a transfer rules change. As for the Philly schools beating up on MY western teams…sorry to burst your bubble but I work on both sites, live smack in the middle of the state and I’m from Berwick so there goes that theory.

  110. Billy Splain says:

    No worries mcd I know who that crybaby is and he can keep cryin. Jealousy is all that person carries

  111. Chuck L says:

    Name to remember for Central Catholic , Luke Robson, RB. Luke will be a Soph this coming season. Should be a good one for the Vikings.

  112. Mcd 65 says:

    Billy, seems that there are several new posters here that don’t know their HS football near as well as you do nor will they ever. You have been very good at what you do and Do not find you biased east or west,private or public. I’m a real Philly PCL guy and appreciate you commentaries and knowledge. Some folks just try to push their agendas ,like special interest groups. Most of us just like good HS football. Havent heard from PCC64 recently,whats up ?

  113. Chuck L says:

    McD 65 , I took a break and decided to change my name to my real name. Thanks for your inquiry. Should be an interesting season in 6A this year in the west. Pine Richland ‘s addition of Kenny White should make them a fun team to watch and tough to beat. NA also got a handful of transfers which will add some needed speed to their roster. They should be pretty good also. They usually are. Was at a PCC alumni function at a Pirate game here in Florida on Friday. Nice turn out. Didn’t hear of any good tid bits re the football team other than all the skill players are running track.

  114. WPIAL Rules says:

    @ Chuck there are a few big linemen moving up from the freshmen team as well. 2017 will be a year for PCC, but 2018 and 2019 will be better!

  115. Chuck L says:

    WPIAL Rules, I think you are right about the next three years. Have you heard about any attempt by Central to schedule a week 0 game ? Maybe not, I heard second hand that the team and coaches were physically and mentally exhausted by year end. Back to back 16 game/ seasons is a lot no question.

  116. Jack1234 says:

    Part of the reason white left West A was because he didn’t like the way he was being used from what I heard. His specialty is defense as I believe that’s what colleges are recruiting him as and he was mainly seeing time at RB. Parents and him had toxic relationship with coaches. He’s a top 5 2018 wpial player imo. He’ll be a big upgrade to PR’s defense and I think you’ll see him in the backfield and lined up as a reciever on offense. Their offense will be loaded next season.

  117. WPIAL Rules says:

    @ Chuck, I think they are looking about staying local for this upcoming season. And you are correct, this current senior class played 61 games over 4 years. Nothing wrong with that just gets them a little beat up.

    @ Jack1234, if the WPIAL/PIAA makes the boys sit that transferred from CWNC to NA then the same should apply to him. If the boys do not sit from CWNC then White should be treated the same.

  118. Billy Splain says:

    I’m just tired of all the transfer talk. Not that ya’ll are talking about it, but that it’s happening SO much these last couple years. Some like to focus on it being a pub to private dilemma but lately it seems like a free for all. It’s getting ridiculous. Hopefully new proposal passes and this stops. The sad thing is it’s only high school football. These kids will get recruited no matter where they play. It is this mad recruiting push/fever that is driving all the transfers. In reality, no matter where kids go, 99% of the time end up where they belong. look no further than our commits page. So many are brainwashed into thinking their kids will get a better shot elsewhere and it’s false. The reality is, only about 1% of the players in PA are D1 players…but we have so many factions out there brainwashing the public. All these groups, combines, camps, so called recruiting gurus have recruiting fever at such a high level it seems it will never end. The overhyping of players is just at a ridiculous level.

  119. Jack1234 says:

    @wpilarules I agree with that. I don’t think he will sit because his family relocated to PR from what I heard tho

  120. Chuck L says:

    Jack1234 you are right but FYI, Kenny tried to transfer to Central last year to play DB. I heard Totten was all in on this move. Not sure why this move was shot down. My impression and this is not confirmed was that it was academics, for what it’s worth. That’s the first I had heard of Kenny White. I followed his exploits last year as a result and no doubt, he was and is a difference maker. Also heard that Totten blames himself for the Corrigan move to Pine Richland last year as in he blew it.

  121. phillyboy says:

    I remember a few years ago, the year Wood beat Central Valley in the state final, Wood had a stud senior FB who transferred in from Bensalem right before that school year. To the best of my knowledge he was at Bensalem for his freshman, sophomore, and junior years. Boy oh boy, I wonder why he went to Wood his senior year. It couldn’t be that he wanted to pick up a state title, could it?, nah, it couldn’t be that. Wood was already a stacked team as it was and probably would have won the state title anyway, but you never know, that actually could have made the difference. Football is a game of inches as they say, there might have been a few drives that were extended that might not have been if he were not there. I just thought that was a blatant specific example of a private kind of pilfering a state title from a public team, that was totally cheesy, 100% pure cheddar.

  122. Jack1234 says:

    @chuck L Yes I remember that kenny tried last summer but was denied. That would’ve been quite a CB tandem with Weathers and white if that went through. That’s interesting about carrigan too, considering if I remember he had applied to the school and everything. From what I heard is he wanted to be able to be a receiver and since central doesn’t throw the ball ever made more sense to go to pr. He started pines first game at Tackle then was predominately just defense and came in as a blocking receiver for screen passes and such. Rarely actually lined up as TE only for short yardage situations. Saw him a few times at H back. Surprisingly barely caught any passes at pine also, he also injured his ankle and missed significant time though. I think he was getting more involved in the offense and was in at receiver alot during the game against PCC but once phil was injured I only saw him on defense mainly after that. But that is also very interesting if totten blew it.

  123. WPIAL Rules says:

    @ Chuck with Corrigan, there are so many different stories on how his family landed at PR and moved to that area. That’s all water under the bridge. Now we can root for him at Pitt!
    Since these boys have moved schools before the start of the new school year, they should be allowed to play. But the WPIAL / PIAA need to be consistent on any punishments if any are handed down.

  124. Mcd 65 says:

    Billy,as moderator you can limit/eliminate those posts regarding ttransfers ,particularly most posts that posters do not know or just put their own spin on the whys a transfer occurred. Perhaps you can take the leadon this instead of posters getting into oh yeah ,well how about ….. It gets old fast.

  125. Billy Splain says:

    nah…I don’t mind it. my point was I’m tired of the transfers…if we could clamp it down, wouldn’t need the talk. I actually preferred it 5 or so years ago when every transfer received attention because they were the only ones happening…now, you can keep a conversation going every day due to so many

  126. Jack1234 says:

    I agree with you billy the transfer stuff has gotten out of hand, not just in PA but all over the country really. Like I said before it’s high school free agency. But at the same time I believe some transfers are right. For example a lot of kids at PCC are from bad areas and inner city schools, I think there shouldn’t be a issue if the kids are trying to get a better education and go to safer school enviornent. IMO the white transfer and the porters and friends going to NA are at least partly athletically motivated and I wouldn’t be surprised if the WPIAL made them ineligible. I could see the PIAA over ruling however

  127. Billy Splain says:

    Jack, you don’t know how true that is..Florida has open enrollment and it’s just getting flat ugly down there. I don’t buy the bad environment argument completely, but I do know it exists. HOWEVER..if it’s that bad, why wait till Jr/Sr year??? noooo…..if it’s a bad environment then they’d get them to another school WELL before the HS years..I’ve actually also heard people say the same about wanting catholic education and values…um, tell me why that’s important now that they’re in high school?? yeah right

  128. SC Football says:

    BREAKING: Rumors are swirling that you are now able to trade for players in HS football?!? With these new rules to the game expect State College to put a monster package and probably some cash together to bring GLOCK14, Micah, and Butts up from Harrisburg High. Those players along with some weapons SC already has could make them a Title contender next year.

  129. Jack1234 says:

    @sc I laughed harder than I should have at that

  130. Mcd 65 says:

    SC Football, what kind of team will you have this year ?

  131. phillyboy says:

    Notwithstanding any imperfections of Florida high school ball, they got it right in one area: they do NOT separate the publics and privates for the playoffs.

    We’re in the midst of a nasty cold stretch right now in Philly, I’ve been rethinking my dubious opinion of that state. Beautiful weather, no state income tax, big time high school football, they even got Wawas down there now….I don’t know, maybe just maybe.

  132. Jack1234 says:

    @billy I partly agree with that however if someone from sto rox or uprep for example can’t pay tuition all 4 years for a school like PCC then it makes more sense to go sophomore or junior year. The catholic values argument is BS for the most part tho lol, just some fluff added to transfers fighting their case.

  133. Billy Splain says:

    why just go for 2 years then? again, defeats the alleged purpose. if it’s THAT bad, you find a way. Financial assistance IS available.

  134. Chuck L says:

    Phillyboy, in Florida they have open enrollment. A kid can go to any play for any school of his choice or at least within their county of residence. Transfers are also allowed. I believe it’s the same way in Texas.

  135. phillyboy says:

    Yo Chuck L…I didn’t realize that Florida has open enrollment per county statewide, interesting. I thought it was just a Miami thing. I guess that’s why Miami produces some beast public teams that are frequently ranked in the top 10 in the nation. Some of their teams are like Imhotep on steroids. Other areas too, remember a few years ago Plant beat Bergen Catholic, no small feat and the last time Don Bosco was #1 in the nation they barely beat Manatee, they had to grind out an ugly win. Not sure, I think Plant and Manatee may be in the Tampa area.

  136. Billy Splain says:

    Actually they just went open enrollment a year ago

  137. Chuck L says:

    Manatee HS is in Bradenton which is in Manatee County. Last year one of the Sarasota schools lost 8 players to neighboring Riverview HS. They all transferred to play football.

  138. Billy Splain says:

    Have some friends down there and they say it’s a mess already. Participation is going down and many schools are already worried abouttheir teams due to low enrollment from transfers. But to be clear, The open enrollment in Fla is for all students, not just pertaining to athletes. It still has opened a pandoras box. We just finished preparing information to give to the PIAA for consideration on the new proposal that is going to be introduced. Not much changed, still looking for a 180 sit clause. We discussed a graduated scale, like 180 Fr, 90 SO, 60 Jr and 30 Sr but many felt it then wouldn’t address the problem.

  139. Lions says:

    Should Carlisle be hiring a former coach that went 6-34 over 4 seasons with team? Just curious. Thought they’d bring in some new blood.. Nothing against the coach. Not sure what is going on there. Interesting to see mcdevitt and Cumberland valley doing a week zero in 2018-19 per PennLive

  140. Mcd 65 says:

    I saw on the Eastern site that Imhotep wants to host a game on 8/26 at the supersite in Philly. This would be a great opportunity for a 6-A team like PCC to play out East to showcase their club.

  141. phillyboy says:

    Look at YOU Mcd 65, trying to play matchmaker, good call though, I’d totally be at that game if it happened. Imhotep against any big time program out in D7 would be fun to see. The beginning of the season has some of the sexiest match ups. Remember a few years back Wood went out to play PCC. That was when you could still live stream the ESPN games even if you didn’t have cable but somebody decided they could make more money by restricting it to cable subscribers.

  142. Jack1234 says:

    I was hoping that PCC could try to get saint edwards their game with PR fell through, but I think a imhotep PCC game would be interesting.

  143. Chuck L says:

    Guys, my guess is that PCC is not looking for a week 0 game. They played 32 games the last 2 seasons and 62 over the last 4 seasons. I heard from one of the coaches that the players and coaches were physically and mentally exhausted going into the State title game. I doubt that they go out of Western Pa to kick off the 2017 season. No inside information on this but that’s my gut feel. I have heard nothing about this kind of game.

  144. Billy Splain says:

    they are looking for a week 0 game

  145. ???? says:

    Facts Bout Imhotep
    1. They are a philly PUB school
    2. They can not recruite outside of Philadelphia
    3. There practice field is home to 3x time popwarner Super Bowl champion
    4. Northwest Raiders went to popwarner super bowl 4 out of last 5 years for age groups of 13-16
    5. Meaning most of the kids on that team are already 9th graders in Imhotep or upcoming 9th graders to become
    6. Do research on Northwest Raiders and tell me you don’t see a lil league Imhotep football team

  146. Billy Splain says:

    First let me state I am not criticizing Imhotep or it’s players, merely pointing out a few advantages they have that no “pub” school outside Philly has:
    Facts Bout Imhotep
    1. They are a philly PUB school
    —-yes, they are. but players can go to that school from an area larger than most conferences cover and do.

    2. They can not recruite outside of Philadelphia
    —1.5 million population to draw from, the closest is Pittsburgh at 305,000. Philly is 5 times larger.

    3. There practice field is home to 3x time popwarner Super Bowl champion
    —basically an all star team from 1.5 million population

    4. Northwest Raiders went to popwarner super bowl 4 out of last 5 years for age groups of 13-16
    —again, see above….

    5. Meaning most of the kids on that team are already 9th graders in Imhotep or upcoming 9th graders to become
    —how does a pop warner team sharing facilities mean the players at Imhoep are 9th graders?

    6. Do research on Northwest Raiders and tell me you don’t see a lil league Imhotep football team
    —-again, they can draw from the same 1.5 million that Imhotep has the privilege of drawing from.

    The fact of the matter as I’ve showed you is…if you get a good staff in place that players want to play for, you have an unlimited supply of great players upon which to build a team. This is an advantage that no school outside the Philly area has. If you’ve never lived in a rural area where 40 schools have a TOTAL population of 200,000 you can never understand the frustration this brings. Even District 3 which has nearly 500k in population but has 90 schools that are spread 100s of miles apart would not have the same advantage that a school in D12 has. 44 schools with 1.5 million. That’s a staggering difference. We can also use D7 which has 122 schools that share in a population of around 500k. Then you have to remember that ALL these school district DO have boundaries. This is a major factor. Solution: change the boundary definition. Make it the actual school building itself. If you transfer from one BUILDING to another you should face the same scrutiny as a player transferring from one district to another….

  147. Jack1234 says:

    I agree 100% billy. Especially the population statistic, this in general is why you see the philly schools kicking the west teams butts in Hershey a lot of the times. Way bigger talent pool to choose from

  148. Chuck L says:

    You r right Billy, upon inquiring, was told that PCC is working on a week 0 game right now.

  149. Billy Splain says:

    yep, been working with them to try and fill it…they’re talkin to 2 Jersey schools

  150. phillyboy says:

    Technically, Imhotep has geographic boundaries, the city limits, but granted for all intents and purposes it’s very similar to a private school which literally has no boundaries.

    But yeah, the schools with the biggest disadvantage are the suburban and rural ones that have tight boundaries.

    Imo the crux of the problem is how private schools are allowed to give out scholarships so kids will play ball there. Privates would get a reality check on the field if that were not permitted. I don’t know that that can be regulated though.

    When a kid transfers from one public (outside of Philly) to another public that doesn’t really bother me so much because it means they would have to necessarily move into the new district or pay tuition. Either way they ‘did’ something to earn that, whereas when a kid receives a scholarship he neither has to move nor pay tuition.

  151. Billy Splain says:

    most “private” schools don’t have scholarships for students. Few do, many offer financial assistance. Trust me when I say that the whole “everyone gets a free ride at Catholic schools” thing is a myth. I know for a fact McDevitt lost a very good player because his parents couldn’t afford it.

    No, the solution is to make the school the actual boundary.

  152. ???? says:

    @Billy Splain

    1. There is a boundarie any philadelphia PUB can get kids from ANY WHERE IN THE CITY cuz of open enrollment

    5. If you ever seen or watched Imhotep all there Top stars played for NW Raiders all those kids look at Imhotep as a trend to keep winning and when you have a winning lil league program why not go to the high school up the street that u share a field with and continue your winning ways that’s why I went to Imhotep from middle school tbh cuz I played for NW Raiders and everybody I played wit wanted to play for Imhotep and that winning tradition

  153. Billy Splain says:

    ???? — yes, that’s what I said…but where you’re not understanding is the 1.5 million. Good staff. If Tep lost that staff to another team there’d be a change. Tep has a huge advantage.THAT is the point. I also know that many of the top players there didn’t start there in middle school.

  154. B. Powell says:

    They are playing Erie Strong Vincent for the 4A basketball title this weekend.
    Let’s see what happens.
    Approx 100,000 population vs 1.5 million.

  155. B. Powell says:

    But basketball is much different and you can have a great team with fewer players and resources.
    I understand that.
    Still though… two public school systems with similar setups.

  156. phillyboy says:

    philly to Billy…you mentioned that “the solution is to make the school the actual boundary.” Must confess, it wasn’t crystal clear to me what you meant by that. Could you elaborate a little? Thx.

    You mentioned that you’re from Berwick. I’m a huge fan of the old CB West dynasty. Not only did they have incredible success, but it was totally organic or naturally occurring and legit; a select or all-star team it was not. That’s what was so great about it. Got to thinking though, what Berwick did in a lot of ways was even more incredible. I don’t think that will EVER happen again, what, was it 3 #1 national rankings for a public high school in a small town in the middle of nowhere?! I remember seeing a short documentary about Berwick back in the 80’s. Not sure, but it might have been ESPN’s Scholastic Sports America program with Chris Fowler. Things are so sophisticated and specialized now, in a lot of ways it’s better but in some ways not.

  157. Billy Splain says:

    It’s actually a proposal being worked on right now. Instead of defining a transfer by school district, the transfer will be defined by the school building itself. So, if a player from Abraham Lincoln wanted to transfer to Overbrook, he would face the same scrutiny as a player from Abington school district transferring to North Penn school district. Or to use a recent case, a player from Bishop McDevitt who transfers to Harrisburg (both in Harrisburg). It’s designed to protect charters, catholic and public schools by encompassing all players and making it more difficult to just transfer. Right now, transfer rules only apply to changing school districts, which in the case of Philadelphia, there are many high schools in one district.

    Yes, grew up 3 doors down from George Curry. He was way ahead of the curve. If you want to watch something good, check out it’s a great view. Proceeds go to ALS.

  158. Jamie says:

  159. Billy Splain says:

    PIAA looking at making changes:
    Good article. Possibly looking at move up clause/success factor as we’ve discussed

  160. chrisk says:

    From York Newspaper: Argument was essentially that 6 classes works on face for football but not hoops and that Private schools have advantages.

    16 out of 24 (67 percent) teams that competed for championships this weekend are either college prep schools, a religious academy or a charter school. 9 out of the 12(75 percent)champions were private schools.

    There are 952 public high schools, and 549 private high schools. (Wikipedia so who knows)but its at least 2 to 1.

    Dist 10 had 2 of those Public Schools (Mead and SV) and 2 Private (KC and VM). without six classes, it would have been Strong Vincent or Meadville loosing by 25.

    Its not the 6 classifications that cause competitive imbalance…it’s a combination of programs at private schools with resources for coaching, camps and facilities that attract talent and that southwest Pa is a Basketball region that produces NBA talent every single year.

    sprinkle in a few West PA destiny teams every year and that’s the Pa basketball Championships it in nutshell.

    The Phiily catholic league alone will win a disproportionate number of championships every single year regardless of classification.

    My argument and opinion changes like the wind, just tired of all state championships with an * asterisks in my mind and all the press with the ifs and buts.

    “we won districts!” yes but 6 classes

    “we won states!” yes but that was before the philly city and catholic league was involved

    “we won our region!” yes, but you moved up a class to avoid Father Football and Mary Basketball

    “we Lost districts!” yes, those damn recruiting schools….and on and on.

    public school champions and private school champions…at least today. HA

  161. Edgar says:

    This post is on behalf of the new PIAA committee. Would someone shed some light on this and tell us exactly what factor is being used in other states. Who was the mastermind behind this ?

  162. B. Powell says:

    I’ve noticed all the top programs that continually win also have very good coaching staffs and systems in place. So, what the PIAA ideally should want to control is spreading out “success” in better ways.
    It’s the programs that are continually winning that are being watched and have others wondering how and why?
    The next school number count is for fall 2018-2019 season. Ideas are out there and being discussed already and I’m sure they have some ideas.

  163. ???? says:

    @Billy Splain

    So your complaining bout city population …? How can people fix that ..? Imhotep had 3 different coaches in the last 3 years and still a dominate program. How bout the west side step up there competition. Expectionally PCC they play soft schedule year in and year out blowing out the same neighborhood schools but when they face some real talent they fold like wet bread we seen that twice last year against SJP N SAINT JOHN from DC

  164. Billy Splain says:

    I explained it below. The PIAA has set up a competition committee and they’ve already begun discussing the many things I brought up. As for PCC “folding like wet bread” that’s just a ridiculous statement about a team that won the title in 2015, and as for that “weak” schedule they played 2 teams that have been to the state title game 3 times in past 6 seasons..North Allegheny and Pine-Richland.

  165. sausmann9 says:

    I would have to agree that PCC folding like “wet bread” is kind of an exaggeration HOWEVER if any of you have looked out their record against out of state (OOS) competition, they’re not too far from that piece of wet bread. Beating in-state teams is NOT all that impressive since PCC is one of the “advantage” schools so looking at games of equal competition is the best gauge. They (PCC) are not that impressive in that aspect. I would have said the same of SJP but recently they have turned it up a notch or two verse OOS teams.

  166. Jack1234 says:

    @b powell I can agree and disagree with that. For example PCC imo wins off of pure talent. Their offense is something a youth league might run, they sometimes run the same 4-5 plays a game over and over again, You can’t stop it because they are better than you; faster, bigger, stronger etc. At the same time look at what coach Kasper from pine richland or art walker from NA or bob palko from west A, all great coaches that put together great systems and game plans for their players to succeed. They obviously have talent but these coach know how to implement a system to that they’ve been running and it can sometimes make up for a lack of talent.

  167. Chuck L says:

    Jack1234, so true !

  168. B. Powell says:

    Exactly, Jack.
    Now how does the PIAA foster a system where more schools and communities can also share in success and be competitive? Demographics and coaching aside.
    It’s all for the good and it’s nice when a high bar is set like that.
    But if a school continues to reach the finals or even a final (4) each year, they’ll be under the watch. How and why and if everything is good others can say, “Look at that program. There’s where we want to be someday, too.”
    Or not…many schools are very happy to win their district title.

  169. Billy Splain says:

    if you scroll through, you will see some of the ways the PIAA is interested in curving the talent glut. Things like reclassifying the “district” to the school building itself. The success factor, in a team is successful 2 years in a row, the will move up a class. While that does nothing for the 6A class right away, it will eventually top load that class, teams regularly there may not get there due to heavier competition in that class and may not be so desirable for transfers. But the main key is to slow down the transfers. That is one of THE MAIN goals the PIAA has.

  170. B. Powell says:

    And you’re correct about the pure talent.
    For example, look at Pennsylvania high school wrestling. It’s the best in the nation every year and it’s part of our culture. For years, many of these top wrestlers would spread out among the top D1 wrestling programs until Penn State hired Cael Sanderson. Look at the results Penn State has had since then: 6 of the last 7 national titles.
    When you have culture, talent, coaching and the community behind you that’s the best of times.

  171. phillyboy says:

    I like these ideas to make things more fair. The transfer rule should help, but it needs some muscle; kid must sit out a full year, otherwise it’s toothless. Maybe there could be some legitimate exceptions like if a family relocates from a different part of the state or country. In regards to the requirement that a school move up a classification if they continually dominate, at first I was skeptical because of the reason Billy mentioned, it doesn’t do anything to rectify the most prestigious 6A class. But it’s a definite improvement, schools like Wood, ECP, Imhotep can’t just keep hogging all the titles at the lower levels. Wood, for all intents and purposes, is a 6A level team. They should play against the big boys. One of the biggest examples of a great program hogging all the titles at a lower classification is that Curtis school in Louisiana. I believe they’re in the 2A level, are you kidding me?! They’ve won like the last hundred state titles in a row, it’s a joke.

  172. ???? says:

    I was referring to PCC (OOS COMP) of course they will be top western team every year but for them to be great they have to beat OOS teams for instance Imhotep played Trinity, Cardinal Monmey, Friendship Academy, Flash Academy MD outta the last couple years they are 4-2 playing Cardinal M twice 1st time blow out second more closer game then Friendship twice and blow outs both times lose to Trinity powerhouse in Kentucky 30-7 I think yep was leading going into 4th 7-0 then broke down but very winnable game for them, also they lost to Flash Academy not the name anymore but they played the kid David Sills (QB wiith USC offer in 8th grade) so Jus bcuz tep dominates doesn’t mean there great. All great teams look forward to protecting the state and as of PCC goes they jus like taking there talents to hammer the same squads over n over they don’t meet real comp till NORTH ALL OR PINE. There jus not good to me TBH no hate I rather like PINE over them for the western side

  173. phillyboy says:

    Yo ????….I appreciate your sentiments about protecting the honor of PA football. That’s been one of my mantras for a long time. I was giving Saint Joe’s Prep a hard time for a while for taking it on the chin way too many times by some of those North Jersey powers. But I give them some props for taking out Don Bosco last year and St. Joe’s Montvale the year before, two solid wins. And I give some props to Wood for pounding DeMatha Catholic a few years ago. Have to admit though, one North Jersey school that totally gets on my nerves is Bergen Catholic. They’re undefeated against SE Pa. squads. Back in 2010 LaSalle coughed up a game against them at Oradell, NJ. In the closing moments they had a chance to kick a short field goal to win but fumbled and lost by a point. In the rematch the following year at Plymouth Whitemarsh LaSalle got taken out to the woodshed. Then last year Bergen Catholic beat Wood relatively handily. Their student body is so pompous, they chant: ‘go Bergie, go Bergie, go Bergie go’ over and over again. Then they start heckling about how Jersey ball is better once they have the victory locked up. Anyway, here’s hoping some PA team will step up and stop the insanity lol. Hey, maybe Tep could take on BC, would love to see that.

  174. Chuck L says:

    To say that PCC just likes to hammer the same local teams over and over again is crazy. They don’t have a choice in the matter. WPIAL teams don’t have the schedule flexibility of the three powerhouse Philly recruitment teams. The week 0 game opportunity was New last year. Other than week 0, the WPIAL makes their schedule. PCC does not have much choice in the matter as to who they play.

  175. Bob Hines says:

    Chuck, did you just try to suggest PCC doesn’t recruit??? You’re kidding right

  176. Jack1234 says:

    @??? These past couple teams PCC has had had enough talent to compete with national teams. I think a lot of it has to do with their coaches and schemes, specifically their offense. That youth league stuff I mentioned earlier doesn’t necessarily fly with the other big boys, that’s why saint joes has had their number and saint johns. Also when you got a walking 15 yarder in CJ thorpe that doesn’t help either.

  177. ???? says:

    Only way I can see there being peace in PIAA playoffs is by implimating a Texas type bracket where each divion has a 6a D1 where all Top 6a teams play N have 6a D2 and let there be 2 6a champions battle it out to be crowned 1 overall 6a champ or we can implicate Cali high school football way where they still have 6 divisons but it’s option to create the most effiective competition is to have a 7 division we wouldn’t call it 7a it would be called Open division where the state Top teams fight to the right to say they own there state remember this is a optional choice to every team. So let’s jus say Imhotep dominates 4a 3 years from now but everybody wants to see them play big boys in 6a the open division will help that by letting Imhotep go into a playoff bracket wit SJP WOOD ROMAN LASALLE IMHOTEP PCC PINE ECP put all the big boys in one division and let them hammer each other out of the bracket great quality games week in and week out

  178. chris k says:

    I wish we all could just discuss football from time to time…like what a game between x and y, and good for that kid from nowhere who got a scholarship.

    I am as guilty as anyone else.

    Sadly, we allow the 100’s of games played on fields that we never go to, and the thousands of kids that think life cant get any better for them go unnoticed. I am officially done discussing who transferred and who recruited and who changed a class. We all know exactly what happens and we all know exactly how and why…don’t we? We all know who has an advantage and who does not. The NFL and NBA and homerun records and every other sport is filled with asterisk’s. I refuse to contribute to adding hs football to the list. Half of the kids don’t even shave yet…

    so in honor of those skinny peach fuzz faced warriors, those 194 lb noseguards and tailbacks that run a 4.85(friend clocked) flat 40… I will report in detail on a game a week this fall that happens in the west. I will cover a team that doesn’t make the local paper vs a team that hasn’t had new game jerseys in 3 years.

  179. Jamie says:

    Billy, Maybe you should open 2 discussion pages. One to discuss recruiting/public vs. private topics and one that talks football. Well said chris K!!

  180. Billy Splain says:

    We used to have a multi topic forum, people just stopped using it.

  181. WPIAL Rules says:

    Well, I’m changing both topics. The Pens are in the play-offs and Bucco season has started. I feel that the Buccos are going to be below .500 this season and Cutch will be traded before the July deadline.
    Da Pens win the cup in 7 games!

  182. chrisk says:

    Billy, u do a hell of a job…super objective, and always trying to be factual. My point is/was is that its been this way since the 1980’s, at least! Then championships became state wide(not just district) and the competitive gaps get more obvious. Add extra classes, and again…more obvious. I held true to form and used words like “it” in reference to the forbidden topic. Anyways, thanks Billy keep up the objective and INFORMED good work.

    Bucs miss playoff’s
    Pens make deep run
    Steelers will have only 1 or 2 suspensions and will appear to be ready to finally win a game at Foxboro in afc championship game, but Tom Brady plays after sitting the last 3 games of regular season(clinched) and having to only play in 2 total quarters throughout the playoffs(blowout). The Steelers 17 The #@&***%!! 27. No biiger fan of Steelers than I, but am I the only one who feels like Ben is the Sergio Garcia of football? super good, but always 1 guy a little better. Sergio back when Tiger played was THE 2nd best golfer in the world! for years and years and years.

  183. Billy Splain says:

    it was never really an issue before the state football playoffs except in basketball and maybe wrestling. It only became glaring when the philly league joined the PIAA.

  184. Jack1234 says:

    @chrisk if only bryant and bell could put the reefers down, bryant has the potential to be a top 5 WR in the league too

  185. Chuck L says:

    CJ Thorpe of PCC had 330 yards in penalties in 2016 and yes some of those were in the State Championship game. Heck of a football player but come on man !

  186. Jack1234 says:

    @chuck L honestly thats on the pcc coaches too. He should’ve been benched for games if he’s gonna do that. If they’re are gonna let clowns run wild out on the field just because their skill is too good, then in the big games that will bite you. I can think a lot of other coaches that would’ve benched him for a while. Totten must drive you PCC fans crazy I’d imagine.

  187. Chuck L says:

    Jack, Differences of opinions among the staff re the penalties and the offense in general. As for Totten, he was just inducted into the Central Hall of Fame so obviously, it is what it is. I’m always hopeful that he will see the light. Can’t play national teams and win in this day and age with his grade school offense.

  188. Jack1234 says:

    @chuck L they are just so predictable. Imagine if they ran a spread shotgun offense with zone read running similar to pine richland, with the team they had this past year. Unstoppable if you ask me.

  189. phillyboy says:

    Yo B.Powell…so you’re a wrestling fan, huh? Me too dude. Good point about how all the top talent from PA, NJ, etc. for years was getting siphoned off to places like Iowa, Iowa St., Oklahoma, and Oklahoma St. For a while there it seemed Penn was having more success than Penn State which is a little ironic. It was an injustice, finally the Northeast is getting its due. I tell you what though, I grew up in South Jersey, went to high school there, NJ high school wrestling is prime time. If NJ in any given year formed a team comprised of its state champions from each weight class, I’d like their chances against any state in the country.

    Btw, what’s up with Franklin Regional’s Spencer Lee not going to Penn State. He almost reminds me of a lighter David Taylor. That’s a big loss, might have something to do with the fact that they already got Bergen Catholic’s Suriano who is around the same weight class.

  190. B. Powell says:

    Thanks for the reply, Phillyboy.
    It’s true, PA has long been the hotbed for high school wrestling and NCAA DI individual titles. In years past, Penn State was good but always on the edge of “almost” and it’s been frustrating to see several PA boys winning titles for other schools.
    Coach Cael Sanderson is changing this and now PSU has won 6 of the last 7 NCAA titles. Just watching the NCAA finals one could see PSU is making it fun for these kids, but also getting the most out of them, too and they are getting a good education. You can’t just cruise through PSU and skip classes and not care. They simply don’t allow it.

    Spencer Lee put his commitment to Iowa in ink and if he transfers now, it will cost him a year of eligibility. His good friend and practice partner just decommitted from Iowa and is coning to PSU this fall, but the difference was, that kid never signed his deal, just a verbal.
    Yes, Siriano might be a reason Spencer Lee chose Iowa and they would be the same weight if at PSU.

    Also, word is PSU is having a good football recruiting class for 2017 signed and also 2018 verbals.

  191. B. Powell says:

    Also, Billy-
    High school Football:
    What could be the scenario this fall in Erie when they decide to close both Strong Vincent and East high schools and combine those kids who still want to play football with Erie Central?
    And, lets assume the PIAA lags behind and doesn’t get everything approved before the start of the fall season. In our minds, Erie Central is now a 6A team, but nothing is official until those PIAA powers say so.
    I’m guessing Central could still start the season somehow and play within the 4A-6A region like the have been and maybe would have to skip the post season if things aren’t on the books yet? Otherwise, it would be an automatic sub-region playoff berth in 6A vs McDowell each year.
    Seems simple enough to me, but a lot of things need to happen in a few months.

  192. Billy Splain says:

    all very fluid right now, hard to say what will happen in Erie. Last I heard, they are working hard to avoid putting them all together. We’ll know tonight, they are voting.

  193. Billy Splain says:

    Last night the ESD voted to consolidate it’s three teams. We’ve now lost Strong Vincent and Erie East in addition to Youngsville. Schedules will now be changed…stay tuned.

  194. B. Powell says:

    Thanks, I thought that’s what they would do.
    Erie Central, D10 class 6A.

    I think D10 will move Warren? into the Erie County 4A-6A region in the short term to balance out 2017-2018 schedule -some-.
    ECP – 4A
    Warren – 4A
    FLB – 5A
    GM – 5A
    Erie Central – 6A
    McDowell – 6A

  195. M says:

  196. Jack1234 says:

    Pine Richland might be starting next season without their top wide reciever Falcone

  197. Billy Splain says:

    oh no, what happened? Falcone is doing well on recruiting trail.

  198. Jack1234 says:

    Tore a meniscus, just had surgery I’m hearing recovery time is 3-4 months. Will miss the start of the season, including the ESPN wayne game. Hopefully he picks up from last season when he returns to the line up, he’s a stud. Will be interesting to see how PR does without him, from what I’ve heard and seen this is the deepest group of skill players they’ve had in a while.

  199. Chuck L says:

    Kenny White should be able to pick up the slack.

  200. Jack1234 says:

    @chuck L if he’s ruled eligible which is next month. Also hearing PR likes him at RB so I wouldn’t expect him catching many passes

  201. Jack1234 says:

    A name to keep an eye out for this upcoming season from pine richland is luke meckler. Freshman DB and WR-RB. Started the second half of last season as a safety. hes the fastest kid on the team and just recently broke the school 100m track record as a freshman.

  202. Chuck L says:

    Yep, white can play any number of positions.

  203. Jack1234 says:

    @chuck L not nessacrily true. He’s a great athlete but his strong suit isn’t receiver on offense, it’s running back. If he was a good enough receiver he would be playing reciever, this is what I heard

  204. M says:

  205. M says:

  206. phillyboy says:

    Can you say Erie Central, BABY!? There’s potential for a beast program, potential. They got to get an excellent coaching staff in place even if the superintendent has to splurge a little bit. Otherwise, they could become another Upper Darby, a high enrollment school whose football team is total mediocrity. It could get even better too; some talented kids who would have otherwise gone to ECP might now go to Erie Central. Now the District 7 6A champ won’t have a de facto bye in the next round.

  207. Billy Splain says:

    first..not an exciting thing…right now its a punch in the gut to MANY. Second, splurge on a coaching staff? do you understand WHY this had to happen? Third, this won’t stop anyone from going to CP. They go there for reasons other than football. This is NOT a reason to be excited.

  208. Jack1234 says:

    Joey Porter jr and amosis porter have been ruled elgible to play football at North Allegheny next season. Michael Tomlin is elgible to play at shady side academy next season. Kenny White hearing is the 13th

  209. WPIAL Rules says:

    @phillyboy, you need to learn how to read. They are in D-10 not D-7! And since they are merging, they will have a lot of growing pains. 3 schools into one. Many kids in any sport will now lose an opportunity to play. Going from 3 schools into 1.

  210. Billy Splain says:

    WOW!! Monster match up for 2017 opening weekend!!! Central Catholic will travel to Erie to face Cathedral preparing !! Place/date/time TBD

  211. Jack1234 says:

    That should be a great game billy. I’m interested in seeing how central matches up after losing alot of starters

  212. M says:

    Where will the game be played? The Prep field is far too small seating-wise to handle the potential crowd that would be going. I hope it is played at Vets Stadium for that reason.

  213. Chuck L says:

    Looks like I ‘ll be making the drive up to Erie. Should be a big crowd up at Veterans Stadium (I think that ‘s what it’s called). Not certain that Totten will have Central ready after one scrimmage but it will be interesting to say the least. Hear that they will have skill players, a few good running backs, receivers along with Sr QB Troy Fisher. He seems to be leaning Ivy League. I think that Totten may have to pass more because that potentially is a strength this year. DB’s will be the team strength. Will need to rebuild their offensive line for sure. Not as many D1 players this year but that may be a plus.

  214. Jack1234 says:

    All three returning starters in the secondary have D1 offers. Maybe not D1 guys but i know they definatly got some size from what ive seen on the line, plus david green on defense

  215. Chuck L says:

    David Green, FYI, is getting looks from LSU.

  216. Mcd 65 says:

    IMO david Green and #10 from st Joe Prep were the best players on the field in the stste championship game last year. He is a player!!!!

  217. D10 Fan says:

    Looks like CP/PCC will play at Prep’s event center. Veterans Stadium is hosting the Central Tech/Meadville game. Hopefully something can be worked out, but I doubt it.

  218. Chuck L says:

    D10 Fan, thanks for the info. BTW, what is seating capacity (approx)at Prep’s stadium. Assume around 1500 so I’ll use my pull at Central to get a couple of tickets, if possible.

  219. Lance says:

    Could this be the season that Someone takes the D10 Crown from Hickory? Sharon Tigers maybe.

  220. Jack1234 says:

    What’s the date on that game? PR is playing wayne on a sunday its good to know its possible to catch both games if they are the same weekend

  221. Billy Splain says:

    friday, aug 25….you’re good to go Jack

  222. phillyboy says:

    Dag, I would love to check out that PR/Wayne game. Wayne got it goin on, they tied AB Wood last year and had a chance to take the D1 Ohio title but one of those pesky private schools got in the way and tripped them up. I think the last public Ohio D1 state champ was Hilliard from the Columbus area about 12 years ago. Hilliard beat St. Joe’s Prep one year in the Kirk Herbstreit Classic (what ever happened to that?). But I digress, a 600 mile round trip is a bit much, I’ll have to live audio stream it on that killer Pittsburgh area website that specializes in high school sports.

  223. Jack1234 says:

    thats good. Who does prep return? I know they had that LB going to notre dame and their QB coming back, I also remember that really good soph RB and some other junior receivers in the state championship. I saw them play at the PR 7v7 tournament last summer too

  224. D10 Fan says:

    @Chuck L
    I’m not sure exactly, but I’d guess between 1500-2000. There’s also a grass hill on the visitors sideline and a decent amount of standing area.

    CP will be loaded again. Return all skill players and a a few starters up front. LB going to ND, OL/DL Scruggs getting a ton of D1 love (OSU, LSU, PSU, MICH just to name a few). QB and another Dlineman just picked up a few Ivy League offers. Also got a transfer from McDowell (for wrestling) that started both ways for the Trojans last year. Not sure where he’ll end up but he was a safety/KR last year.

  225. D10 Fan says:

    Also forgot to mention that McDowell hosts St Ed’s from Cleveland on the 26th. Should be a good weekend if you’re a HS football fan in Erie.

  226. Jack1234 says:

    Yeah i remeber that mcodowell was playing saint eds after the game with PR fell through. Shame PCC doesnt have any high profile national recruits for next season or else ESPN mightve considered picking the game up

  227. SC says:

    Lol phillyboy, the district 7 6A champ does not get a de facto bye. PCC was the best team on the western side of the state by far, and that was a rare collection of talent, no team in the state with the exception of fellow parochial school could compete with them. SC, McDowell, CP in the past and D3 have given D7 plenty of good games and beaten them. Please learn your history before you open your mouth

  228. phillyboy says:

    SC….when I said that the D7 champ has a de facto bye in the next round I was referring to the largest classification. Please learn my history? ….what are you talking about? Without doing any research, off the top of my head since 2001 hasn’t D7 represented the west every year except 2009?

  229. phillyboy says:

    Yeah, 2011 also.

  230. WPIAL Rules says:

    Central Catholic Freshmen football meeting tonight! 67 boys signed up to play for the Vikings!

  231. Jack1234 says:

    @wpial rules thats more than some 6A teams have on their varsity

  232. Jack1234 says:

    You gotta think with that many kids alot must leave due to not having starting opportunity with that crowded of a roster

  233. Chuck L says:

    Actually, Jack a lot of kids leave for multiple reasons., playing time, grades, behavior, tuition cost, travel etc. A lot of good players leave after their freshman year. in any case having that many kids signing up is a good thing (for Central ). I’ll have to take in a few freshman games this year. BTW, their excellent freshman coach left Central to coach CWNC”s varsity backfield.

  234. WPIAL Rules says:

    @Chuck the former 9th grade coach (A wonderful guy and coach) Took the job to be closer to home and his family. I wish him the best at CWNC! The new coach was last years QB coach and I believe he will do a great job with the kids and program! Last years freshmen team have 46 out of 56 that played last year! This upcoming freshmen (C/O 2020) could possible see states in the 2018 and/or 2019! There is great chemistry with-in that group. Just like the C/O 2017! I think this may be the re-building year for CC with how stacked PR is! NA lost to many great players as well that were multiple year starters. But my heart is with PCC to win their 3rd WPIAL in a row! And you heard it first… the WPIAL 6A champ will go to States to represent the West!

  235. Mcd 65 says:

    Can any team in the West challenge Harrisburg in 5 A this year? They sure look as though they can be a dominate group with Parsons leading the way . Their QB and WR are both very good players also. Archbishop Wood will be solid again in the East if they come up with good RBs.

  236. Billy Splain says:

    Somewhat big news tonight in WPIAL, Kenny White lost in his hearing to play for Pine Richland. He transferred in from West Allegheny

  237. Billy Splain says:

    also, maybe bigger news…Malik Shepherd also ruled ineligible to play after transferring to Quippa, his mom testified at hearing that Aliquippa assistant Sherman McBride called her to recruit her son…

  238. Jack1234 says:

    White lost 5-4. Will appeal to the state. I’d expect the same from shepard. Interesting the porter and tomlin cases were ruled eligible.

  239. Jack1234 says:

    That is very interesting about shepard, the decision was unanimous by the board. I don’t think he stands a chance getting appealed by the state now that its known aliquippa tried recruiting him. Don’t know why anyone would want to go to aliquippa if they don’t already go there, it’s not a very pleasant area at all.

  240. Chuck L says:

    Don’t know the specifics but I expect the PIAA to overturn the White ruling. That is unless Pine doesn’t want him.

  241. Billy Splain says:

    Interestingly, PR did not sign off on the transfer, wanted the hearing

  242. Jack1234 says:

    Billy I thought that was interesting too. perhaps to prove he wasnt recruited possible. hes a impact player so if he cant play thats a huge loss for pine.

  243. Southern D10 says:

    Does anyone know if these kids and their families moved into the school district they intended on going to. If they did, then I definitely see both winning their appeals.

    Also update on the Erie school district consolidation. New name for the high school to be announced sometime later in the week

  244. Billy Splain says:

    Both had A parent move and they moved with them. The Aliquippa kids mom actually said that a coach recruited him so that one will stick. The Pine Richland kid May have a chance to get it overturned

  245. Southern D10 says:

    @PAfootballFan2006 should be some good teams out of AA in the west. Just a lot of the same names IMO.
    D10-Wilmington/Sharpsville D9-Kane/Clarion D5-Berlin/Chestnut Ridge? Wpial-Steel Valley/Neshannock/North Catholic

  246. Jack1234 says:

    My guess is I think whites gets overturned and shepards doesnt. Also D10 I don’t think north catholic will contend, they lost like 8-9 kids to NA and shady side after there coach got fired. I think there QB went to aliquippa too. Steel valley has that RB returning who had that insane run in the state championship

  247. phillyboy says:

    Yo Jack1234 ….I sure hope you’re right dude, that better get overturned for White. Let me ask you a question, sounds like you got your hand on the pulse, if you were to pick the top 4 teams in D7 6A right now that have the best odds of taking the WPIAL, assuming the White ruling gets overturned, what would you pick?

  248. Jack1234 says:

    In order I’d pick pine richland (with or without white), Central Catholic, North Allgheny, and then Seneca valley. Basically the usually suspects now for the past 4 or so years. Penn hills is loaded with skill year in and out it seems and they finish with losing records, when I saw them play they had no discipline and a bad line on both sides of the ball. They can make some noise if they can find a good line

  249. Richie says:

    Western Pa, hot topic on transfers & recruitment. Heard a few hearings went down. There is a team out east loading up. By the bus loads.

  250. Jack1234 says:

    I’d say the transfer stuff is way more worse in the east

  251. PAfootballFAN2006 says:

    Who this team out east that’s loading up Richie?

  252. M says:

  253. M says:

    “Erie High School” is the chosen name for the consolidated Erie Schools.

  254. M says:

  255. SC says:

    Transfers are rampant in philly and harrisburg, every year there is a trasnfer list a mile long of kids transferring to mcd on pennlive

  256. B. Powell says:

    Another substantial setback for the new Erie School District. There was a fire at Central High School this morning with extensive damage and this is to be the main school building for the new consolidation. Nobody injured and the fire seems to be accidental and not foul play. School has been closed for the remaining school year at Central Tech.
    Very discouraging as they have been trying very hard to make this consolidation work and to have the financial means to move forward. An emergency meeting has been called to held figure and sort things out.

  257. Billy Splain says:

    saw that….looks like they’re still moving forward. Tough deal though.

  258. WPIAL Rules says:

    So the whole coaching staff has resigned from Shaler and went to Penn Hills! I feel.bad for the Shaler boys since that program was turning around and getting more kids!

  259. Gunner says:

    Journey Brown, setting the New PIAA State Record in the 100m dash. Leroy Burrell has held the record since 1985.

  260. Jack1234 says:

    Shaler doesn’t have talent at all. It’s really surprising they are surrounded by NA and PR and those schools have talented players, then you go right up the street to shaler and they have nothing. A coach can only do so much if he has nothing to work with. If they do have talent then it leaves to the surrounding schools. If I remember phil jurkovec used to go to shaler as a young kid, imagine if he stayed. Doubt he’d be the player he is today

  261. Billy Splain says:

    PA Athletic Oversight Committee to hold public hearing on separate championships/classification of high school sports June 20. Not sure what this will entail. This is apparently a preliminary fact finding hearing brought on by a legislator urged on by former Manheim Central coach Mike Williams. The PIAA wasn’t involved initially. They are having a meeting tomorrow to discuss and will be involved in the hearing. I will know more Friday morning.

  262. M says:

    Wow, please put an update when you have more info. Thanks for the heads up!

  263. Billy Splain says:

    Update: From what I gathered, this is just an informal discussion about the current recruiting/boundary discussion brought on by a couple coaches. The PIAA nor PSFCA is involved at this time though those involved have invited those groups to the discussion. So basically, not much is known at this point what the discussions will entail. The PSFCA is having a meeting next week to discuss. FYI, here is the bill that put the PCIAA into the Piaa picture in 1972:

  264. Billy Splain says:

    Purple and Gold Erie Royals it is…

  265. Jack1234 says:

    Pine Richland 19′ OL-DL Andrew Kristofic just picked up an offer from pitt today. Very good linemen player to watch this upcoming season.

  266. Chuck L says:

    I have been next to him and his family at church (St Alphonsus ), I do believe. He looks like he needs another 40 to 50 lbs to play at the next level. With his height, assume it’s no problem. He is a Pitt legacy player as his dad played at Pitt.

  267. Jack1234 says:

    No doubt chuck, I believes he’s at the 240-250 range but he’ll be a junior so plenty of time to get bigger. Very athletic though, was a key player for PR’s basketball team that made the state finals.

  268. Chuck L says:

    Jack, saw him yesterday. He’s more stout than he was last season when He looked like a basketball player and not an offensive tackle. I Can see it now. BTW, just got back from 6 months in Florida. Just saw where that good looking Freshman RB left Central for Westinghouse. The word was his mother was wanting him to stay at Central but he wanted to be with his friends at Westinghouse.

  269. Jack1234 says:

    Yes He’s defiantly bulked up since last season ended. Pine’s line was undersized last season for a 6A besides one kid. They had a lot of young guys play and they’ve been bulking up since the end of last season. If I remember correctly didn’t central have two freshman running backs that saw varsity time last year?

  270. Chuck L says:

    Yes, there were 2. The kid that left has D1 speed. He (Noel) was the taller of the two. There also was a RB who was impressive on the undefeated freshman team. He will share carries with 2 other kids. All 3 should be pretty good.

  271. John G says:

    How do I submit a player preview for one of my top guys?

  272. Billy Splain says:

    coach, send me an email

  273. Jack1234 says:

    The one on the freshman team was robson correct? the freshman RB on the varsity was jones if I remember, he took carries against pr in garbage time in the wpial semifinal. Who else is expected to get carries?

    Also I believe PR will have the best backfield this upcoming season barring white being ruled ineligible by the state, white crawford and jurkovec with an experienced line will be very deadly.

  274. Chuck L says:

    Khalil Weathers !

  275. phillyboy says:

    Yo Jack123456789, oh shoot got carried away there. No seriously, was wondering when the PIAA appeal for the PR kid will be, any idea? Sure hope they do the right thing and overturn the WPIAL, kid deserves to play there. Btw, saw some highlights of that high powered PR team a few years ago; it’s too bad that team didn’t win it all, their passing game was awesome — looked like the high school version of ‘the greatest show on turf’. Prep won that game because of their “secret” weapon which was definitely no secret.

  276. Jack1234 says:

    Not sure phillyboy, I remember the last major hearing was justice Evans a couple years ago and I believe that was near the end of July. The 2014 PR team was a fun team to watch that’s for sure, very close to 16-0 too. They couldn’t stop the prep running game and Dandre swift. That prep team was a juggernaut especially in person to see, they had speed everywhere and were huge. It’s no surprise swift led them to anouther title this past season. I think this upcoming PR team could have a chance to be like the 2014 team or better, jurkovec will be better than dinucci was as a senior and they’ve got talent everywhere.

  277. phillyboy says:

    From what I’ve been hearing, on the eastern side North Penn seems to be loaded despite the loss of Udinski and Johns to graduation. You know what I’m suggesting — that’s right, Pine-Richland vs. North Penn for the state title, BABY! That would be a dream matchup, old school D1 vs. D7. They both have some tough early games so we’ll see how things stand.

  278. Jack1234 says:

    White will be eligible to play at pine Richland this season, PIAA overturned the wpial today. Malik Shepard will be ineligible to play at aliquippa, PIAA upheld the wpial ruling. Watch out PR this season.

  279. Chuck L says:

    I read on another site. Kenny White was approved by the PIAA to play for Pine Richland thus overturning The WPIAL’s ineligible ruling.

  280. Chuck L says:

    I made add that this Kenny White info needs confirmation.

  281. Billy Splain says:

    it’s confirmed

  282. Chuck L says:

    Yes, this should be PR year. Looking forward to the season and seeing Jurkovec against Central at Pine Richland early in those season.

  283. Jack1234 says:

    Seneca valley, NA, and penn hills especially all have young talent this year. That conference is gonna be no joke. If PR or central isn’t careful they could easily be upset. I’m currently on vacation but PR has been having a lot of 7v7 lately. From what I’ve heard so far is that the passing attack is deadly, they’ve got multiple guys that can catch and run, then add in a few studs and jurkovec and it’s hard to stop. You also gotta add in Crawford out of the backfield, he’s one of the best receivers on the team and he’s a running back. That’s a huge mismatch against linebackers with his speed and open field ability.

  284. phillyboy says:

    But Jack, what about the injury to Falcone, that a huge loss, do you think he’ll be back in full form come playoff time?

  285. Jack1234 says:

    I forgot to say, but what I heard is falcone will be cleared in July and will be ready to go for week 0. I was wrong before. The thing is they are still loaded at receiver, they’re are a number of kids that can come in and play well. Falcons is just a stud that makes them that much better

  286. Billy Splain says:

    Listen to this live on , should be a very important show to listen in on!
    Bob Greenburg
    PIAA is considering the Indiana HS Success Formula. @JordanAMorey,Sports Editor of the @SeymourTribune (Ind),joins us Monday at 6pm to discuss

  287. Mike F says:

    Haven’t been on since the end of the season. Glad to see all the usual debates going on.

    While with the graduation of my nephew and him moving on to college and my own son being only in 4th grade I decided it was time to become a football official. I recently submitted for it, and I received the rule book last Friday. I now have 2 options, wait till October 2 and test at a school or take the online test whenever I feel ready. As much as I want to test at the school, I want to be able to start when the season starts so I am going the online test route. I am assuming I will start in the pee-wee leagues and work up to the HS games.

    I must admit I am excited and looking forward to it, as I want to be involved with the game again as more than a fan, and coaching is too much of a time constraint. My understanding is that there is a shortage of sport officials in all sports and in all areas of the state, some worse than others though. I encourage you that if you don’t have family responsibility to at least think about becoming a ref.

  288. Billy Splain says:

    CUDOS to you Mike! Hope to see you in stripes along the field this fall!

  289. Billy Splain says:

    great info on the success factor Indiana uses and PIAA is considering:

  290. phillyboy says:

    Yeah that was a pretty interesting interview with the dude from Indiana regarding the requirement that a team move up in classification due to continued success. I wouldn’t have a problem with that. The flaw is that 6A teams can’t move up since they’re already in the top tier. One thing about that though, it makes the 6A tournament that much better since it would also include the some of the best teams from 5A, 4A whatever. Btw, that Bob Greenburg guy, is he from New York or what (lol), thought I was listening to Tom Leykis for a moment there.

  291. Billy Splain says:

    Bob reports from the erie area

  292. Mcd 65 says:

    I noticed that Pittsburg Central Catholic only has 6 games on their schedule. Can anyone shed light on why the holdup of the rest of their games schedule? I hope they are scheduling an out of state game as they did last year. Their program should look at this every year IMO.

  293. Billy Splain says:

    Because we aren’t done entering them

  294. Chuck L says:

    No out of state opponent for Central Catholic this year. They open the season with Erie Cathedral Prep. ECP should be quite the challenge for rebuilding Central Catholic. As stated here earlier the game is at Prep which has a limited seating capacity.

  295. Jack1234 says:

    They’re playing Erie cathedral prep week 0 this year

  296. D10 Fan says:

    Looks like the ECP/PCC game is moving to veterans stadium, instead of CPs events center. Don’t know if it’s official yet but it’s definitely pretty close.. That would be a great change of venue for a game of the magnitude.

  297. Billy Splain says:

    it’s official, Meadville/Erie moved to Saturday

  298. WPIAL Rules says:

    Central Catholic vs Shaler will be held at Shaler. They are hosting. I know what the WPIAL site states. But this is the schedule the school have out.

  299. Drew says:

    Just read that Imhotep/Harrisburg are playing week 0 on ESPN. I just think they’re trying to one-up the ECP/PCC matchup haha

  300. D10 Fan says:

    That would’ve been great if CP,PCC,TEP,HBURG were playing in some kind of pa showcase. West showcase Friday, East showcase Saturday. Play it at some neutral site in the middle of the state. Great exposure for the kids and the state. Definitely would’ve paid to see something like that.

  301. Mcd 65 says:

    D10 Fan, Yes, that would be a great event and well attended I would think. The Tep/ Harrisburg matchup between the two of them , have the most Division 1 players that will be matched up this year. If both teams keep penalties to a minimum this one should be a classic. Run vs pass,and Parsons vs Isheem Young ,two of the best players in the state.

  302. Lance says:

    AAA Preseason..1.Scranton Prep 2.Central Valley 3.Aliquippa 4.Danville 5.Martinsburg Central 6.Sharon 7.Loyalsock 8.Middletown 9.Notre Dame-Green Pond. 10. Hickory

  303. Lance says:

    Keep an eye on the Riverside Panthers(North Sewickley) in WPIAL Class AA. Lot of Veteran players returning there.

  304. Jack1234 says:

    It looks like brandon lipford from west A transferred to montour. Interesting to see how west A does after losing all those seniors along with white and lipford.

  305. Mike F says:

    Wow I have to wonder why the exodus out of West Allegheny? Palko is a great coach, and I never heard of him being a jerk unlike some other top coaches in the area. Anyone know the story over there?

  306. Jack1234 says:

    Heard a few different things with white. Him and father having issues with coaches, didn’t like way being used, even something that his dad was banned from all west A sporting events. Either way they’ve lost some major talent that’s gonna hurt their chances to repeat as wpial champs

  307. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    I see ECP QB Joe Mischler has committed to the University of Ohio. I feel like the MAC will be a good conference for him.

  308. Xavier says:

    AAA Preseason..1.Scranton Prep 2.Central Valley 3.Aliquippa 4.Danville 5.Martinsburg Central 6.Sharon 7.Loyalsock 8.Middletown 9.Notre Dame-Green Pond. 10. Hickory

    Wow, who makes these up? Central Martinsburg has nothing coming back, will be lucky to have a winning record this year

  309. Billy Splain says:

    We didnt

  310. Lance says:

    Martinsburg Central will be just fine.If u check their roster u will see they have several solid players returning.Huntingdon,Tyrone and Bellefonte will make it a Very competitive District 6.

  311. Xavier says:

    Lost 80% of their offense From last year. Really didn’t develop any young players because it was cool to run up Alex’s stats to get him a walk on offer. Lost a pair of studs on the Oline. They will be fine = .500 record. But no way they are top ten in the state. But after they start 0-3 , then we can rediscuss

  312. Lance says:

    2 of their first 3 games are against Bigger schools and if they lose to Tyrone then The Golden Eagles will move into the rankings. I coached in the PIAA semifinal(Beaver Falls)against them and can see how they are Good every year. Tough Kids.Jared Smith should run wild this year!!

  313. Billy Splain says:

    Lance, are you still on the BF staff?

  314. Lance says:

    No I’m not Billy I retired after 15 years.Just doing some scouting now for some PSAC schools. I have a couple friends that coach and I help them out.

  315. Billy Splain says:


  316. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Anyone headed to the Save-A-Eye game tonight in Erie?

  317. Billy Splain says:

    it was my plan to cover the game but work got in the way!

  318. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Two kids from Fairview tried transferring to Mercyhurst Prep (Both D-10 Schools) and were denied. Both will miss there SR season. MP’s coaching staff is seriously playing with fire with there recruiting violations. I cant help but think that the PIAA will be investigating MP soon.

  319. SC says:

    The hypothetical PA showcase could take place at mansion park or memorial field

  320. One who Knows says:

    Knowing the MPS staff you ECL / Metro Fan are way out of line with your accusations. Absolutely no chance in hell anyone from that staff ever once spoke to or recruited those players. That was stated by Fairview clearly in the D10 hearing. Ask anyone who knows. You’re barking up the wrong tree. Stop spreading lies. That staff goes by the book period!!

  321. LHACfan says:

    what is going on at south fayette? pretty late in the game to be looking for a head coach.

  322. Billy Splain says:

    South Fayette is looking for an assistant coach. Rossi is still there

  323. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    One who knows, Don’t kid yourself. They have pulled out every and all stops to try to get kids into that school to get them on the field. If there were no recruiting violations and the transfers were NOT for athletic intent, then why were they denied? If the PIAA did a deep dive, you would be surprised with everything going on at MP’s. Just like the in 2012 with Boys Soccer.

  324. One who Knows says:

    ECL / Metro Fan. You are completely wrong. It’s easy to place blame and target a coach, but Fairview without a doubt made certain in the D10 meeting that these players transfer had zero, nothing at all to do with MP Coach tampering and this is fact. Denied because the school claimed the families had issues with the Fairview coach fact. I challenge you to speak to the MP staff. Great guys, great coaches, and no wrong doing at all, period.

  325. Route54 says:

    Anyone want to take their picks. Who will make it out of District playoffs for both east side and west side for A,AA.

  326. Come on man! says:

    Route54 no one has a chance against Neuman Goretti in AA. As long as PIAA does not enforce transfer rules and boundaries to private school then public schools can not fairly compete. NG was 0-9 last season and could barely field a team. This year they are loaded with transfers. How does that happen with no investigation from PIAA? If a public school did this, how many kids would be ineligible?

  327. Route54 says:

    @ come on man. Neuman Goretti, never really heard much about them. Sounds interesting. What about Southern Columbia?

  328. Route54 says:

    Come on man. Can you shed more light for me on these transfers. What schools did they transfer from. Thanks

  329. Come on man! says:

    Imhotep and Perkiomen. I heard others but can not confirm. So I will not guess. How do you go from 19 kids last season, to 50+ this year.

  330. LHACfan says:

    Nobody is beating BG in A. Transfers in include a legit 4.5 running back from Altoona and offensive lineman who weighs 250 from Huntington.

  331. ???? says:

    Please stop worrying bout transfer in philly long as the kid lives in ANY REGION OF PHILADELPHIA they are eligible to attend any school WITHIN PHILADELPHIA BOUNDARIES. Now for NG Albie got #9 Chris Wells RB and 6’7 tackle Justin Johnson there plus a hand full of kids from A LOCAL HIGHSCHOOL that shut down. This highschool that got shut down had promising potential to become state champs in a year or 2. So all this complaining bout transfer stop it cuz at the end of the day these kids live in Philly where there are more than 5 high schools in each region of philly. It’s different ball game from burb highschool N city football. In Burb areas there are only 1 or 2 high schools separated by miles. So you have to get clearance to go to that school because it’s not your neighborhood school. In philly let’s say north philly for instance there are about 10 high schools Jus in north philly alone so if a kid wanna transfer he can transfer to any of those 10 schools. Also in Philadelphia all schools are not as high in academics as others so you can send your kid to another nieghborhood school jus off that the education is not where u want it to be for your child. Plus community plays a major role in it also why send ya kid to a dangerous community school when u can send them to a school in a less dangerous part of philly. It’s many factors to this for philly

  332. ???? says:

    Imhotep is going to beat Harrisburg without a sweat. Harrisburg struggled with wood badly don’t see how they can tuff it out with Tep if they got blow by wood.

  333. Mcd65 says:

    Come on man. as usual people like you provide just enough information to give an impression of OMG . Just stop! Neuman Gorretti has a fooball coach in Albie Crosby that many teams would appreciate. He was at West Catholic as an assistant and the built Imhotep Charter to a power house. Players in Philly want to play for him.NG HS is getting many of their new players from Delaware Valley Charter which closed this year. They got 2 transfers that I know of from Imhotep. The PIAA monitors what is going on so they don’t need the nonsense that is exaggerated . My old HS is one that gets directly affected by both Imhotep and Gorretti athletes choosing to go there ,but that’s their choice .I’m not whinning just need to get better.

  334. Mcd65 says:

    ????,Harrisburg is loaded this year and as much as I want Tep to win IMO it will be a dogfight especially without Wells and Johnson. Hsbg. skil position players can really bring it and Micah Parsons can dominate any game. Wood did a good job last year , but I think this year could be a much closer game if those two square off at the end of the year. Teps new coach needs to show he can bring the team together against a solid opening challenge. This should be a good one.

  335. phillyboy says:

    Just wanted to say, those charter schools are a total joke. They’re basically rent-a-schools. Delaware Valley what?? LOL, IMO there’s no way in the world they should be allowed to have their own sports teams. As has been said before, it’s kind of redundant and costly. The kids should just be permitted to play on the traditional public team that corresponds to it geographically. It would save a lot of money, besides, that’s why they’re doing charters in the first place, right? Well why not even be more frugal and stipulate that they go sports free — or no deal.

  336. ???? says:


    I have actually played for Albie @ Tep so I know how his process works

    2nd Imhotep reloaded with lineman this year there Jus Young many played unlimited ball but there big o line will average 6’3 250

    3rd I saw Harrisburg game vs West Allegheny they didn’t do nothing special to me nobody really stood out except the QB DE N WR Tep has a D1 Secondary in Isheem Young N Tykee Smith plus Omar in the box I doubt Harrisburg puts up 20 on them

  337. Come on man! says:

    You confirmed why I am so frustrated with private schools and Philly city high school. You said there are 10 HS in north philly and students can transfer to any one of the 10. That should never be permitted. They have an unfair advantage. If a group of kids get together and want to form an elite team, they can do so without any recourse. But a group of kids from Harrisburg try to do the same thing, they would be ineligible. PIAA rules state any student who transfers to another school for sports is deemed ineligible for one year. This happened in western PA and other sports like wrestling. Zain Retherford was ineligible for his junior year because his family moved to another school district. Mean while, wrestlers from a certain d11 school is a able to recruit anyone they like and from other states. Is this really fair. We expect the kids to play fairly but PIAA does not provide the same to public schools.

  338. ???? says:

    Philadelphia population is increasing so there are going to be more schools that gets a lot of kids the way they are closing public schools in Philadelphia this year they shut down more so the kids that went to there school goes on to the next with parent approval. For example North Philadelphia has 2 parts that sperates East and West with a population of 1 million + cuz of location ( close to center city) in that radious probably 10 schools ( All different Classification ) So there are going to be kids that float around to other schools. ( Not including Catholic).

  339. phillyboy says:

    This first game will tell the tale of Harrisburg. If they win, they’re for real, if they don’t they’re wannabes. Personally, I expect them to win for two simple reasons: 1) I think Imhotep has been weakened by the loss of Coach Crosby and 2) Micah Parsons, baby. Are you kidding ME?!, dude is a 5 star recruit, yes count ’em, 5. A 5 star recruit is extremely rare. D’andre Swift wasn’t even 5 stars and he was the 4th highest rated RB in the country last year. Imhotep wishes they had a 5 star — or a 4 star for that matter. Gonna be interesting.

  340. Bob Hines says:

    Hey “philly” boy do you have kids of your own? Let me ask you something if you lived at 33rd and Lehigh would you send your kid to Strawberry Mansion or Imhotep? None of you have any clue about how the city of Philadelphia is struggling with public schooling so I take ZERO of your opinions seriously. PIAA needed Philadelphia money plain and simple take it up with them!

  341. Billy Splain says:

    Actually bob the pcl petitioned the PIAAin 2006 to join. Not the other way around. Not sure what money you are talking about as attendance at PIAA playoffs by philly schools is usually pretty low.

  342. Mcd65 says:

    phillyboy, So you think Imhotep does not have any 4 star players huh . You better do your homework before spouting off and change your name. You do not represent Philly . You are a so Jersey kid by your own admission. The philly guys support philly teams private or public. BTW 4 star Isheem Young from Tep just committed to Penn State .

  343. Bob Hines says:

    Yeah Billy PIAA member schools pay dues and insurance every year.

    •880 – and Above = $ 600.00
    •500 – 879= $ 550.00
    •241 – 499 = $ 500.00
    •1 – 240= $ 450.00

    How many programs come out of Philadelphia? You can do the math yourself. As far as petitioning goes, I’ll take your word. Should have just said NO! I could care less about the PIAA. Public/Catholic league titles used to be the only thing that mattered here. All the blame is on them.

  344. Billy Splain says:

    43 teams, that’s peanuts in the PIAA budget.

  345. Bob Hines says:

    43 teams that what??? Play football? Include all sports and all girls schools- closer to 90. Not buying that’s peanuts.

  346. Billy Splain says:

    what are you talkin about? each school pays one amount. doesnt matter how many teams there are at each school. If they have 880 and above, they pay $600. total philly dues is somewhere around 21K…peanuts.

  347. Bob Hines says:

    Yeah I get how it works. Not every school has a football program is my point. There are way more than 43 schools in District XII. Nearly 90 members listed on PIAA site.

  348. Billy Splain says:

    ok, sorry I’m a helmet head…90….make it 45K..still peanuts….that alone only pays for insurance and such…so your money argument still doesn’t wash

  349. Bob Hines says:

    Well fair enough I guess no way for me to tell. I’m skeptical 45k over the last 11 years is peanuts but so be it. I’ll concede. Let me ask you Billy where does the majority of the PIAA’s income come from then? Follow up question, why in the hell would the PIAA allow Philly schools in when they knew well before this happened how the now District XII worked? Where I come from everything’s financially motivated but maybe this was in the spirit of competition? Or…maybe it was for starting message board fights. 🙂

  350. Billy Splain says:

    trust me, 45k per year is peanuts. I’d say the largest portion of the income for the PIAA is state playoffs. There a lot of myths about the PIAA and money. everyone thinks it’s this giant organization that sits back and collects bags of money but in reality there is just a handful of people in Mechanicsburg, around 13, that do a major portion of the work. Most of the decisions are made by the districts, not those 13 people. They are basically arbitrators. They have no voting power on ANY decisions made. Those, again, are made by the districts. Fees/monies collected during events and through memberships go toward renting facilities, paying security, game managers, referees, advertisements, insurance, research, lawyers ($$$$) and many other items. They are not sitting on a boatload of money down there.
    Letting Philly in was a matter of formality. They wanted in, and had the PIAA said no it would have been a quick stop in the courts to get in. PA law requires the PIAA to let leagues participate, that was passed back in 72. They just chose not to participate.

  351. phillyboy says:

    McD65 ….I’m a boy from Philly through and through. Moved here as a young adult in mid 90s. My parents etc. were from Philly. For me, I root for traditional public schools. That’s more important than even geography. When the variables are the same, it’s Philly all the way. I was rooting for Prep big time at Widener last year when they took out Bosco and at PW the year before when they pounded St. Joe’s Montvale. I was also at the Prep/PCC final despite my disappointment in the North Penn loss. You could tell the Prep supporters were smart, classy, passionate Philadelphia fans all the way. It was a microcosm, an example of the great Philadelphia fan. But no, phillyboy is one of the city’s best cheerleaders, a staunch supporter of the culture. Happen to be on vacation now out in the mid West, the other day an amazing thing happened: a person whom I had just met, out of the blue asked me if I was from Philly. Played it cool but deep down felt great. Yeah, I’ve developed an authentic Philadelphia accent. Are you kidding ME?! That’s not something you can buy, you got to earn that over the course of many years. And it’s not an over the top NY or Boston accent; it’s more subtle yet distinct.

    Btw, can’t wait for the Wood/Paramus Catholic game at Tennent, I’ll be there.

  352. Chuck L says:

    BTW, PCC (Central Catholic) will be better than a lot of people are expecting them to be. As always, CC will have numbers that most programs would kill for. The strength of the team will Be QB, RB, receivers, OT’s on offense. On defense they’ll have a strong experienced secondary with good linebackers and defensive ends. The interior lines (O and D ) will be a work in progress but should be OK. Overall, they should be pretty good.

  353. ???? says:

    Listen out for next great RB Carl Jones kid has it all hands size break away speed fresh from NORTHWEST RAIDERS 3x Time Popwaner Super Bowl Champions Midget Divsion this kid is special.

  354. Mcd65 says:

    ????, Carl Jones sounds like a special RB. I assume since he played for the RAIDERS that he is an Imhotep future star, but if he lives in that part of the city I would love for him to attend McDevitt. I know,I know,why would he ever choose McDevitt. Well , they really need a savior and he could be it. A Miracle LOL. any way ,I will be watching out for him in the future. Thanks for the heads up.

  355. ???? says:


    He had a chance to attend wood as well but when you win 2x Super Bowl titles wit friends that go to Imhotep already the kids play there role in recruiting. Why not go to the same school wit the kids you won a National Title wit and put effort into dominating at highschool level for a state championship. Kinda great to have kids out of a great lil league program that tells there friends how great it is playing for Imhotep. Plus raiders and Imhotep practice at the same field so he 9/10 already knew where he was going

  356. Chuck L says:

    Took in a PCC practice yesterday. They have size and numbers. About 85 varsity players and approx 60 freshman. One freshman was brought up to the varsity, He is big, doesn’t look like a frosh and said to be an Aaron Donald relative. Watched a scrimmage of 1’s on 1’s. In which QB Troy Fisher stood out. Looked very polished, footwork and passing has improved significantly and also appears to be faster. Offensive line is big but not as tough as in the past. Needs a lot of work. Soph RB Deondre Jones ran hard, looked good but not the break away threat that they have had in the past.. I was told that another Soph RB who I didn’t see in the scrimmage is their big play guy. Some of their skill players will be going both ways and should excel. Lost a defensive end to injury who they were expecting to be a major pass rusher. Wouldn’t be surprised to see them be more of a passing team this year.

  357. Jack1234 says:

    That’s quite the freshman team. Doesn’t surprise me if theyre going to pass more, 6A in the wpial goes through pine and to beat pine you gotta score a lot of points. I always thought fishers skill sets were very underused, he has the potential to be a great QB (smart, big arm etc)

  358. Jack1234 says:

    Went to the pine richland scrimmage yesterday vs Erie McDowell. PR first team offense moved the ball effortlessly and only played two series that combined were only 6 plays long because they scored that quick. First offensive play on the first drive was an 80 yard TD bomb from jurkovec. The defense looked pretty good, the first team defense bended a little but didnt break and they shut out McDowell. The new transfer they got, thomas burns (younger brother of steeler Artie burns) didn’t scrimmage because he didn’t do full heat acclimation. Some other starters didn’t play also.

    Overall even though it was a scrimmage the offense looked explosive and able to score and get big plays at any time, and the defense looks like it will be very improved from last year (which was there Achilles heel). Looking forward to their week 0 game against Wayne from Ohio, that one will be a high scoring affair on ESPN

  359. Billy Splain says:

    Jack. Email me

  360. Phil says:

    Alright, the first and only scrimmage (for some) is in the books. So, who was impressive? Who may be a dark horse? What are the observations/results of some of the scrimmages, especially the big boys? But any report on any one of the scrimmages is welcome. Thanks.

  361. Chuck L says:

    PCC took a major hit when projected soph sensation Luke Robson went down with a knee injury in Saturday’s McKeesport scrimmage. Big loss for the Vikings which will hurt. May be challenged offensively.

  362. Mcd65 says:

    Will th PCC/ Erie Prep game be live streamed ?

  363. D10Fan says:

    Took in the ECP/Mentor (Ohio) scrimmage on saturday. Mentor is the biggest school district in Ohio and it showed. Great size, tons of kids, and a beautiful complex. I think it was the perfect measuring stick for ECP because i’m assuming PCC will have similar size & numbers.

    It was Mentors 3rd scrimmage! i was kind of surprised when i heard that. They treated it more as a dress rehearsal than a scrimmage, dressed in full uniforms and had a pretty raucous crowd. That being said ECP played well. Line was getting a good push in the running game, Mischler looked sharp, could probably run the offense with his eyes closed now. Defensively, any 50-50 ball was won by ECPs DBs, Bauer was all over the field and they had a kid (hybrid LB/DB i believe) that was just laying dudes out in the running game. I have no doubt that if they matched up when it mattered, ECP probably would’ve won by 2 touchdowns.

    PCC is a different animal though, should be a great game Friday.

  364. Jack1234 says:

    @chuck wasnt that kid gonna be the home run threat this year? Tough break, hopefully he recovers fully from it. Pine Richland lost a starting offensive linemen that left the team from migraines from concussions, however they got a kid that used to play that just joined the team and may now be an improvement.

  365. phillyboy says:

    The PR opener against Wayne is a whale of a game. Since I don’t have cable may have to go to my gym to watch the game. I’ll have to get on one of those stationary bicycles close to the screens. And pedal at a really slow speed, lol.

  366. Jamie says:


    Thoughts on D9 and D10 teams we should be watching?

  367. Billy Splain says:

    Stay tuned. We’ll let u all know tomorrow

  368. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Who is going where for the opening night?

  369. Billy Splain says:

    we will have reporters at cathedral prep, clearfield, woodland hills, penns valley, bellwood-antis, central, warren, franklin, and several other locations

  370. Chuck L says:

    D10 Fan, I’m expecting this to be a somewhat down Year . Central may be good by mid season but I think our O line needs a lot of improvement. At least initially, I think this team will Depend on D. I’m not confident that our offense can keep up with Prep’s

  371. Chuck L says:

    Driving up to Erie to see the PCC ECP game Friday. Not overly optimistic for Central, hope I see a good game.

  372. Chuck L says:

    Yes Jack 1234′ Robeson was the big play running back. I was really looking forward to seeing him this year.

  373. B says:

    As a D6 fan and playing football at one of the schools, I always look forward to the Bellwood-Antis vs Tyrone game. The atmosphere is electric as the two teams reside about 10 miles apart maybe even closer. There both relatively small communities with Tyrone a few thousand more in population, but the love for football lives deeply within both towns. As the normal in both communities there is an expectation of having a winning season, making the playoffs and a chance at district championship and a run at states.’The close connection with Delgrosso’s amusement park which really connects the community’s together benefits both Bellwood and Tyrone. There’s nothing like this game as far as rivalry is concerned anywhere else in Blair county all year except playoffs at mansion. There’s always great games in D6 but as tradition goes this might be not just the best opening game in D6 on the schedules of Tyrone and Bellwood-Antis, the most important at least until the playoffs
    Best of luck to both teams this year

  374. Billy Splain says:

    B, that isfor sure one of the top rivalry games in the state, have covered it a couple times as well as many other “rivalry” games…this one ranks right up at the top in the state

  375. Gunner says:

    Billy, with the ICC having it’s members move all 9th graders to varsity, do you believe this is going to have a positive or negative effect on a team like Bellwood-Antis. Or would BA, be more suited to try and move to the MAC? I

  376. Southern D10 says:

    Prep all over PCC 26-0 at half. Obviously only first game of year but I’d have to say 6a goes through Pine richland

  377. Eric W says:

    Very surprised by Prep score, 40-7!! WOW

  378. Golfpro says:

    Don’t be too surprised, when it’s said and done prep will have 7-8 kids go d1 and another 4-5 go d2. This is the best prep team ever and I can’t see anyone coming within 3 tds of them this year. That includes Imhotep.

  379. Billy Splain says:

    well, considering they already have 8 players with D1 offers and 1 with a D2 offer….it really isnt a surprise is it?

  380. Tully says:

    embarassing Prep and Tep play 4a. Like Prep doesnt have enough of an advantage they also have to be the biggest school in their classification.

  381. Mcd65 says:

    Imhotep was awful today. Erie Prep will dominate them this year. Prep is solid . No one in AAAA can touch them East or West.

  382. Eric W says:

    Don’t count out Berks Catholic(D3)in 4A this year…they are loaded as well…and played Prep tough ly in post season

  383. D10Fan says:

    Erie looked tough last night and i was surprised how little of a fight meadville put up. On a couple of those tds there wasn’t anyone within 5 yds of the carrier. We’ll see how they fare on friday, i wouldn’t get my hopes up though.

    @Eric W Berks was definitely a tough out for ECP last year. Big, physical, and well coached.

  384. Fan in the Stands says:

    Big matchup this week in the Mountain League as front runners Clearfield and Central Martinsburg clash in Roaring Spring, PA.
    Interesting matchup as Clearfield enters with a high powered offense and Central relies on its defensive prowess to set field position.
    Clearfield has had the slight advantage for the past few years. Will the Dragons turn the table this year and set up a nice set of wins?

    Two really solid junior QBs to match up in Rummery from CF and Muthler from Central. Protection and execution as always will be paramount.

    Watch out for Garner and Smith from Central…2 really tough kids. Great leaders as well.

  385. Casual Observer says:

    Looks like there is something happening at Mercyhurst Prep. Lots of little things are starting to come together. Next couple of games should be a good indicator.

  386. B says:

    I was very intrigued about the B.G game, with everything I read I expected them to blow out Westmont. After seeing the final score of 13-7 and reading the game report it seemed that Westmont was actually in the game. I understand the all state kicker missed two field goals one being a 43 yard kick which is never easy. Is B.G actually beatable this year? They do play a tough schedule for a A school? Maybe Johnstown,Forest hills, summer set, or bishop mccort?? Or in the playoffs?, maybe it was an off night but I wouldn’t mind seeing them have some competition this year instead of just rolling through the schedule and playoffs. Maybe make it interesting in single A this year. Any thoughts

  387. D10Fan says:

    @Casual Observer i agree about MPS, they look the part so far but let’s see how they handle the success and expectations going forward…that’s half the battle.

    Erie took it on the chin vs CP last week but i think they have a good thing going. I took a look at their schedule and i think they can win every game they have left, i’m not saying they will but don’t be surprised if they win out.

  388. B. Powell says:

    Is this board still up and running? lol.
    As usual, Mercyhurst Prep will find out how good they are in the D10 3A playoffs and not until then.
    The same goes for the AA and A teams from the north regions. For so long they have been dominated by the d10 southern region teams who seem to have high school football built into their culture.

  389. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Anybody know when Jason Lawrence transferred from ECP to MPS? Has he been there all school year?

  390. sausmann9 says:

    @golfpro – you say best team ever for ECP, you are saying this team this seeason is better than the 99′ or 00′ team??? Were you able to see either the 99′ or 00′ teams play??? tx.

  391. Billy Splain says:

    Don’t know bout golfpro, but I say by far saus…..this team is unreal

  392. Jeff says:

    Those 99 and 00 ECP teams were loaded, one of the best HS football games I ever saw in person was the 99 Western Final between ECP and Woodland Hills at Hempfield HS, with ECP winning 27-23 on a TD in the last minute, several future NFL players on both teams.

    With that being said this may be their best team ever, I frankly think ECP can play with and maybe beat any team in PA, including Pine Richland and SJP. I don’t see anyone challenging them in 4A, I just wish they were in 5A so they could play Harrisburg in the West Finals and Archbishop Wood in the final, both would be tremendous matchups.

  393. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Personally I think the 99′-00′ team was tougher, however they played tougher competition so the margin of victories wasn’t as large. Remember they won the AAAA title that year, which is equivalent or even tougher then the current 6A format. Prep needs to get the offensive line figured out ASAP. They have been juggling guys around trying to get things to gel but Mischler has been under far to much pressure early and often.

  394. me888 says:

    “ECL/Metro FAN says:
    September 14th, 2017 at 2:13 pm
    Personally I think the 99′-00′ team was tougher, however they played tougher competition so the margin of victories wasn’t as large. Remember they won the AAAA title that year, which is equivalent or even tougher then the current 6A format. Prep needs to get the offensive line figured out ASAP. They have been juggling guys around trying to get things to gel but Mischler has been under far to much pressure early and often.”

    me completely agrees. The ’99-’00 team was better. This team does pass better than that older team, and LB Bauer is probably a better overall individual talent than any of the those older guys, but the running game, defense, and Sp teams aren’t as good. This team overall isn’t as good either. The current lack of talent in D10 (individual and overall team) is appalling. This years (and last years) ECP team would not have beaten last years PCC team (not even close); and would have gotten thumped by SJP too obviously. Not sure what SJP has this year…so me’ll reserve opinions on that for now.

    me do believe a ECP v PR game would be a good matchup this year. Almost clones of each other. That said, PR has the advantage at QB. Most of the other areas are pretty close to equal.

  395. Drew says:

    @me888 hard not to argue with your post. The ’99 & ’00 teams are the best teams I’ve ever seen in person. Ed Hinkel was the best all around high school football player I’ve ever seen as well.

  396. Jeff says:

    Is it just me or does anyone else out there think PR would be wise to be on upset alert this week and not look past Bethel Park to their showdown next week with PCC. I think Bethel might be the 2nd best team in 6A in the WPIAL this year (yes, better than PCC), and they are going to pound it and play ball control and try to keep Jurkovec and company off the field. If PR’s offense struggles early like they have in a few games this year I think they could be in for a real dogfight, although I expect them to eventually win by a couple of scores.

  397. TomF says:

    ECP’S 99 and OO teams would beat this year’s ECP team by at least 2 touchdowns. That was an all star team! Those titanic battles with CB West were 2 of the greatest games in PA HS history. They played 4A back then-largest classification. If ECP played the equivalent of 4a this year…now 6A, they might not even be in the top 5 and St. joe Prep, Pine Richland or whoever else this year would not come close to the Cb West or ECP teams back then. hinkel, Sanders, Charles Rush, that team had star power everywhere! No comparison

  398. sausmann9 says:

    ECP responses very good. Billy I do know you and your knowledge of the teams so your opinion here holds the most weight (not saying others are invalid) but you also like to prove people wrong (well me, not sure of others) so I can’t tell if you’re messing w/ me here or serious as a heart attack.

    I have not seen this season’s ECP play a game yet, not even on hudl. In person I saw the 99′ team twice that season and the 00′ team twice their season. I just didn’t think this season’s ECP matches up w/ the talent of the 99′ team or the 00′ team. I agree Hinkle may still be one of the best all around athletes to come out of PA, to be on the same field w/ Sanders and Big Joe Dupree in the middle of it all, that was crazy talent.

    ECP v Hburg and Wood would be a nice run in 5A.

  399. Jeff says:

    @ Tom F. – If you are saying last years SJP team couldn’t compete with the CB West or ECP teams of 99-00 I would totally disagree, I think last year’s SJP team was the best this state has seen in a long time, and were every bit as good and probably better than the ECP/CB West teams of 99-00.

    Don’t forget the PCL wasn’t part of the PIAA until 2008, had they been back in the late 90’s I doubt CB West would have made the final 4 consecutive years, and I think most observers in the eastern part of the state would agree with that assessment.

    I also think you are selling this year’s ECP team short, IMO they are a top 5 team in the state and possibly top 2 or 3, Max Preps has the top 5 teams in PA state rankings of SJP, ECP, PR, Archbishop Wood and LaSalle, which I think is pretty accurate, other national polls have them third behind SJP and PR. IMO ECP would play PR tough and quite possibly beat them and would give SJP all they could handle, that’s how good I think this years team is.

    The real question is when are they going to move to 5A where they belong, it’s a joke a school with their tradition of excellence is playing 4A.

  400. B. Powell says:

    At the next cycle count, 2018, I’d expect ECP to move themselves up to class 5A. They will *probably* be 2X defending 4A champs — and made that count by 1 student in 2016. Even if they are under again in 2018, I’d still expect them to move themselves up for a new challenge.

  401. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    I think Juice Scruggs on ECP’s current team is better then Dipre ever was. Charles Rush however was the Gatorade National Player of the year and I would say he was better then Scruggs. I think Joe Mischler has a better arm then anyone on the 99′ or 00′ team. The biggest difference to me comes in the form of running back. Jawan Walker was incredible. I dont think there is a RB on the current roster that could even come close to comparing to him. I think as a whole this years team has a better group of WR’s & CB’s. The offensive line play this year is not as good as it was last year or in 00′. I do believe that this years team has the ability to score very, very fast. Overall I think if 00′ Prep Played 18′ Prep that the 00′ Class would win by 2 TD’s.

  402. Mcd65 says:

    Jeff,I agree with you about St Joe. I saw both ECP/CB West games as well as followed CB West for years since I lived close to War Memorial stadium in Doylestown. ECP had some of the best talent I have seen and CB West although not near as talented ,had the great Mike Pettine as coach. The st Joe team had it all. Dynamic offense [huge o line and D Andre Swift. Their defense was also big and fast to the ball.Infante has proven he is one of the best coaches in the state.

  403. phillyboy says:

    Very well said, Mcd65, that’s what was so great about CB West back in the day; sure, they undoubtedly had big time talented players but they didn’t have the plethora of sheer blue chip D1 players that the ECP’s and SJP’s of the world have. The CB West mystique was something; when Andrew Elsing blocked that punt for the winning TD in the closing minutes of the ’99 final and then you heard the crowd in the background going ‘CB West, CB West, CB West’, man that was goose bump inducing.

  404. jack1234 says:

    @jeff I forgot to post in for a while but I wrote about bethel on the rivals site. You’re correct and I expect a close game; they are well coached and play sound defense. The issue is I think to beat PR you have to score 40+, which they are not built to do. PR’s offense has started slow a couple of times and they are still scoring 40+ per game, when they find a rythm it’s unstoppable. The reason imo is that they force way to much stuff deep, when they let jurkovec drive them down the field and take the deep shots when they present themselves it works much better. PR defense particulary the front 7 is very good this year, and bethel doesn’t have much of a passing game. PR has a very good and expierenced secondary so if they stack the box and bethel has to pass to win it could get ugly. They’re starting a new QB and recievers.

  405. Jeff says:

    I’m a little surprised there’s not more talk on the board about the Bethel Park-PR game tonight. I think Bethel may be the 2nd best team in the WPIAL in 6A, and if PR is looking ahead to their showdown next week with PCC they could have their hands full tonight on the road. I expect PR to eventually win by 2 scores, but if Bethel gets their run game going and keeps PR’s offense off the field they could make it very interesting well into the 2nd half.

  406. Jeff says:

    @Mcd65 – completely agree Mike Pettine from CB West was a great HS coach, he always got the most out of his teams, and no doubt about Gabe Infante from SJP, 3 titles in 4 years at the highest classification speaks for itself, he very quickly turned them into the dominant team in the PCL. I also have a lot of respect for Mike Mischler from ECP and think he’s an excellent coach.

  407. Jeff says:

    @Jack1234 – agree with your analysis, the only chance Bethel has to pull the upset is to somehow hold PR under 30 points, which is next to impossible with their offense. To keep it close Bethel has to play ball control and keep PR’s offense off the field, which I think they can do for awhile, but eventually PR is going to put up their points. I see the final score something like 41-27, think Bethel keeps in close for awhile but PR pulls away in the 2nd half, although if PR gets up by 2 scores in the first half and Bethel is forced to throw it could get out of hand like you mentioned.

  408. phillyboy says:

    You guys think Pine Richland can handle mighty PCC this week? PCC beat a tough NA team and Seneca Valley. They only got tripped up by ECP in the opener.

  409. WPIAL Rules says:

    Sad news to report, Highly respected Coach Chuck Wagner passed away today.
    Prayers to him and his family.

  410. me888 says:

    “phillyboy says:
    September 25th, 2017 at 9:38 am
    You guys think Pine Richland can handle mighty PCC this week? PCC beat a tough NA team and Seneca Valley. They only got tripped up by ECP in the opener.”

    PCC’s pass defense was abysmal vs ECP. Guys running free all night. Mischler even missed a few of the widest open. PCC held the run in check until it didn’t matter anymore, before ECP gained any yards on the ground.

    Unless PR turns it over multiple time early, me would say “Yep!”

  411. Mcd65 says:

    Pine-Richland certainly has a hugely talented team. They also have a superior coach so with that combination IMO they will win the West.

  412. jack1234 says:

    Seneca Valley isn’t good at all this year, and NA aren’t world beaters either. PCC struggled with both. With the way PR has been playing (without kenny white, one of their best players on both sides of the ball) I think this game could get ugly. PCC has some injuries of their own and I think PR is to much for them this year.

  413. phillyboy says:

    Youse guys are lucky, if I lived in Pittsburgh I would so be at this PR/PCC game this weekend. I’ll have to live stream it on MSA sports network. Finally a legitimate public team that has a good chance of handling the top private team. Man I try to eat healthy but I may have to cheat and break out the family size bag of spicy nacho Doritos for this one.

  414. WPIAL Rules says:

    My heart and soul is with Central, my mind and what I have seen over the last 4 weeks are another! I believe this is PRs year to win States. St. Joe’s Prep is not as strong as they been in the past.
    For as dominate that PR is this year, they will down next year and you will see Central on the rebound. With the Class of 2020 showing what they have with a talented QB, RB, Skilled positions, O and D Line.
    Central may also have a coaching change as well…. Only time will tell!

  415. phillyboy says:

    Yo Mcd65 ….you mentioned that you think Pine Richland will win the west. Hmm, that’s a nice vote of confidence, but what you did NOT say speaks volumes. So let’s not beat around the bush; if by chance St. Joe’s Prep meets PR in the state final, who wins?

  416. M says:

    Cathedral Prep is “Facebook Live(ing)” their games via the Prep/Villa Facebook page. It’s legal and free as far as I know (at least as of now). More schools should do this as you get the game in real time. I wish someone would do it for PCC vs PR. What a great game to see if you’re not around Pittsburgh.

  417. Billy Splain says:

    It is legal during regular season. I DO disagree with more teams should do this. It takes away from game attendance.

  418. M says:

    I know McDowell televised games until they lost the channel to budget cuts. It never had a effect on attendance at all. I can only speak for the northwest corner of PA, but it does not effect our attendance. And for people that simply can’t get to games, like grandparents or those with other obstacles such as distance from the fields, it is a great thing to have available. Especially online. I believe those that can go to games will go regardless. Difference of opinion I suppose, but I am really for games being available at home.

  419. Jeff says:

    I don’t see how PCC can keep it close or score anywhere near enough points to keep up with PR’s fast break offense, this game might get ugly the same way last week’s game with Bethel Park did, I’m thinking something like 49-21 will be the final score. It’s pretty obvious no team in the West can challenge PR this year, fully expect them to roll through the WPIAL playoffs and then easily handle State College and the District 3 winner (likely Cumberland Valley) before a titanic showdown with SJP in Hershey.

    As for who wins that game I’ll hold off making a prediction for now, SJP may not be quite as good as last year, considering last years team was arguably the best PA has seen in many years, but they are still ranked #1 in the state for a reason, and their defense will be the best PR sees all season.

  420. me888 says:

    “M says:
    September 27th, 2017 at 8:36 am
    Cathedral Prep is “Facebook Live(ing)” their games via the Prep/Villa Facebook page. It’s legal and free as far as I know (at least as of now). More schools should do this as you get the game in real time. I wish someone would do it for PCC vs PR. What a great game to see if you’re not around Pittsburgh.”

    WPNT (Pgh Channel #22) televises a game of the week every Friday, and occasionally on Saturday afternoons has a PSAC game. This weeks game is CC v PR.

  421. M says:

    Thanks! Is that Root Sports?

  422. me888 says:

    “me888 says:
    September 27th, 2017 at 1:52 pm

    WPNT (Pgh Channel #22) televises a game of the week every Friday, and occasionally on Saturday afternoons has a PSAC game. This weeks game is CC v PR.”

    Actually WPNT’s full sports schedule this Friday and Saturday is as stated previously:

    Friday @ 7 pm CC vs PR


    Saturday @ 1 pm Gannon vs Mercyhurst
    Saturday @ 4 pm Clarion vs Edinboro

  423. M says:

    That’s great information! Thank you very much for sharing!!

  424. Jeff says:

    Naturally everyone talking about the PR-PCC showdown this week, but there’s another very big game in the WPIAL tomorrow night in 5A when undefeated Gateway travels to Warrior Stadium in Penn Township to take on fellow unbeaten Penn Trafford, with first place in the Big East Conference and possible #1 seed in the WPIAL playoffs at stake. Intriguing matchup of Gateway’s high powered offense (44ppg) led by QB Brady Walker against stingy PT defense allowing only 5ppg with 2 SO’s.

    I have seen both teams play this year against Woodland Hills (have 2 kids in the WH Band), and I give the slight edge to Gateway due to better QB play and more weapons on offense, I think they make a few more plays than PT and win a relatively low scoring game 21-14.

    This could very well be a preview of the WPIAL championship game at Heinz Field in a few months as it appears right now these are the 2 best teams in 5A, I won’t see WA and USC until later next month, but I’d say for now the winner of this game becomes the favorite in 5A, although both of these teams still play McKeesport who’s been flying under the radar since an opening game loss to Franklin.

  425. Billy Splain says:

    Going to be very hard for PT to stop C Jackson and Walker.

  426. fanguy says:

    So far MPL are looking good. Great awesome defense, solid offense, awesome kicker and great coaching. Hope last 5 games will be as good as the first 5.

  427. Jeff says:

    @ Billy – I agree it will be tough for PT to stop those 2, also have to contend with I Cameron, they may contain them for awhile but I expect Gateway to make a few more big plays than the PT offense. Saw Gateway in week 0 and came away thinking they are going to be tough to stop and beat this year, also impressed with PT, but I think Gateway is a better team.

    I also think Gateway is better than either WA or USC, time will tell. IMO McKeesport is the wildcard, will be interesting to see how they fare against both Gateway and PT.

    I think 5A is the most balanced classification in the WPIAL, it was last year and the same is true this year, every other classification has 1 or 2 powerhouse teams and then everyone else.

  428. me888 says:

    This much me know:

    Having seen each team twice, Pine Richland is better than ECP on offense and defense.

  429. D10Fan says:

    Does PR stand a chance vs SJP? Haven’t really heard much about SJP this year. I’m assuming they’re like Alabama and just keep re-loading year after year. I saw they handled Archbishop Wood pretty easily.

    Also, havent heard much Tep talk either.

  430. Billy Splain says:

    short answer, absolutely! PR is as good a team as any.

  431. Friday night fan says:

    Me -apparently you didn’t see the 7 on 7 this summer between ECP and Pine Richland. ECP dominated them on offense and defense in the finals. I believe Prep scored 4-5 touch down to 0 for PR. I know it’s not a real game, but I think Prep has more speed at the skill positions! ECP gets no respect because they have to play the regional game that are weak competition. I don’t know why everybody wants to guess at who would win between the two? Their both great programs in different classes! And should be playing at Hershey in December, that’s what really matters!

  432. Billy Splain says:

    7v7 is NOT a representation of what a team looks like in real football. not even close so that comparison means nothing. I saw some VERY good teams at 7v7 who are struggling badly in pads.

  433. Friday night fan says:

    I somewhat disagree I think it show the skill position speed and talent! I know what your saying. But ECP had a lot more speed at the skill positions. I’ m not sure how a real game would go, but I’d love to see it! My money would be on ECP. I’ll root for both in Hershey! Go West!

  434. phillyboy says:

    D10Fan ….I tell you what, if PR does not take the state title this year then it’s pretty much over for the publics at 6A. Goodness gracious PR is a monster on offense and their defense is pretty darn solid as well. On top of that SJP by their standards are having somewhat of a rebuilding year (or it’s at least not a peak year) so things are lining up pretty favorably. PR needs to maintain their focus and be very hungry all the way through.

  435. Jeff says:

    @ Friday Night Fan – are you seriously saying ECP gets no respect on this board or elsewhere. I’m a WPIAL guy and I’ve been saying for years ECP is one of the elite programs in the state, and this years team can compete with any team in PA, including PR and SJP…don’t know if they would beat them, but would be very competitive games. MaxPreps has ECP as the 3rd best team in PA behind PR and SJP (PR on top this week due to blowout of PCC and SJP had a bye), and after ECP a big gap to Archbishop Wood, Harrisburg, etc. so the people who follow HS football know how good ECP is.

  436. Friday night fan says:

    Jeff my post we’re in response to me 888 post. The respect is in the maxprep rankings. ECP was number 1 regardless of class in the state after week one, and 16 nationally. But they are down to 51 nationally , and I believe it has to do with some of the completion they’re playing in their region games they have to play.I’d like to see them play more WPIAL powerhouse teams.I think it would benefit both deep in the playoffs. The programs that are great year in and year out have great coaching staffs! So, thanks to all the coaches out there who put countless hours in to help our youth! Thankyou!

  437. me888 says:

    “Friday night fan says:
    October 3rd, 2017 at 2:48 pm
    Jeff my post we’re in response to me 888 post.”

    me post on the matter was in response to post(s) a few weeks/maybe months ago about CP being best in state regardless of class. me waited until me saw PR for a 2nd time this season (having already seen CP 3 times this year, and many many times over the past 20+ years). me don’t believe Prep could stop PR, but think PR could keep CP to a couple or three TD’s at best.

    me have seen the back and forth over the years many times about best in state regardless of class (from Clairton a few years back, to Jeannette w/T. Pryor), and those teams weren’t anywhere near the PCC’s and NA’s in those respective years. IMHO, Prep is very very good on offense, but PR’s offense is even better; and me’d give a very slight edge to PR on defense as well, but not by much.

    FTR, me went to a 7-7 about 15 years ago, and found absolutely no reason to ever return.

    JMO, as always!

  438. D10Fan says:

    CP schedules out of state competition to get those competitive games in. Benedictine (Ohio) & De La Salle Collegiate (MI) both top 10 in their classifications. Buffalo Canisus is the defending state champion in their class and always plays CP tough. CPs region schedule is bad and they dont have a choice but to play the region schedule. They would probably rather play WPIAL teams but most of the WPIAL hates playing CP too so they go out of state. They play De La Salle Collegiate out of Detroit this Friday @ Wayne St’s stadium. Should be a cool experience for them.

  439. me888 says:

    “D10Fan says:
    October 3rd, 2017 at 8:54 pm
    CP schedules out of state competition to get those competitive games in.
    They would probably rather play WPIAL teams but most of the WPIAL hates playing CP too so they go out of state.”

    Nobody in the WPIAL is ducking Prep. For the 3 to 4 years prior to 6 classes, all games were scheduled by the WPIAL, not the teams themselves.
    There were no open dates available. They (WPIAL) booted McDowell because it would have presented scheduling issues. Since the 6 classes went into effect, there is one open date in week 0 for teams to schedule whomever they want. PCC scheduled Prep this year. Last year they played in a classic event vs St. John’s College.

    Now (just a hunch but) some of the WPIAL publics may not be willing to schedule Prep because of the public/private issue. Some of those biases run so deep that they wouldn’t want to play Prep even if they thought they’d win by 50. me sure no one would admit it, but me wouldn’t doubt it.

    Back to the point. With few exceptions the only game Prep could get with any “bigger school” WPIAL team is in week 0. Some of the smaller classes and some City League (D8) schools may have a 2nd opening to fill…but me not entirely sure on that.

  440. Jeff says:


    Completely agree with everything in your post, the WPIAL leaves teams with very little to no flexibility in scheduling, and only since the move to 6 classes do they have the option of scheduling their opponent for a week 0 game.

    Most fans would love to see some of the WPIAL powerhouse teams play ECP, but due to scheduling issues it’s not going to happen.

    As someone who’s followed the WPIAL for the last 40+ years I also agree about the public/private debate, I know for a fact Bill Cherpak at TJ wouldn’t schedule ECP under any circumstances, and I’m pretty sure there are other coaches who feel the same way.

  441. B. Powell says:

    Perhaps at the next opportunity, D10 can go back to the older formats with the Erie Metro league, the ECL league, the FCVC and then the Mercer Athletic Conference.
    Things seemed to work fine then and it would free up some scheduling space for ECP, McDowell and Erie High to schedule more quality opponents.
    Mercyhurst Prep could play in the ECL.

    Also, I’d like to see the actual vote count from a few years back when this was changed. I can’t believe many (any) ECL teams voted to change and same with the FCVC.

  442. Mike S says:

    Replying to B.Powell’s comment: Wow, didn’t know anyone remembered the French Creek Valley Conference. Heck, before that it was the Crawford County League.

    I think the scheduling problem lies with the fixed geographic district boundaries. Better solution would be to take each classification, map out the school locations, then create groups of 8 schools who would then play each other, filling 7 games of the schedule as mandatory and leaving two other games to be scheduled at will.

    That’s a simplified explanation of how it’s done in Alabama where I live now, where the emphasis is on classifications, not geographic districts, but the Ala. State High School Athletic Ass’n has power & authority centralized, without regional input. (Also, Ala. solves the public v. private problem by using a 1.35 multiplier for student size when classifying private schools, such that if used in PA, Cathedral Prep would be not be the largest 4A school, but possibly 6A.)

  443. B. Powell says:

    Mike S.
    That’s a solution but what’s missing are the old rivalries and the sportsmanship and camaraderie that went along with it. People use to look forward to Friday Night Football but it’s been diminished with mismatches and mercy clocks.
    I’d really like to see the old ECL reform and then add Mercyhurst Prep and Conneaut, OH.
    They could then make two divisions and put the larger schools in one side and the smaller schools in the other and then have some cross-over play.
    Cathedral Prep, McDowell and Erie High can then make up their schedules with the better teams they are wanting.

  444. MikeS says:

    Well, when I was at Conneaut Valley, our rivals were Conneaut Lake and Saegertown, then maybe Linesville and Maplewood. We played Union City and Lakeview outside the county. But consolidation of the 3 Conneaut School District schools to form CASH upset those games from ever happening again. Plus there’s talk of a Saegertown/Cambridge Springs consolidation at some point and possibly even Meadville and Cochranton. The old era can’t be recreated.

    I think the problem of the one-sided games is that some of the schools and communities still have football as a priority and some don’t — the advent of soccer, lacrosse, and all the other sports opportunities. When I was at Valley, we had teams of 30-40 players, but fast forward 30+ years, consolidate 3 schools to form CASH and they struggle to get more than 40 players, beat Cathedral Prep for the AAA D10 title in 2014 with just 34 on the roster, while Prep had 80. The number of kids playing HS football in PA continues to drop. That’s the problem for the sport.

  445. Jeff says:

    Some big games this week in the lower classifications in the WPIAL, headlined by a couple of showdowns between unbeaten teams with TJ travelling to Belle Vernon and Aliquippa facing off against Quaker Valley for first place in the rugged Beaver Valley Conference in what may be the game of the week. I like TJ to continue rolling by at least 2 scores and probably more and wouldn’t be surprised if Quaker Valley upsets Aliquippa in what could be a preview of the 3A title game.

    Another intriguing matchup in 5A with Upper St Clair in a crossover game against McKeesport which will have implications for the playoff seeding next month. McKeesport beat USC twice last year and I like them to beat them again at home by a touchdown. This is the first of a brutal 3 game finishing stretch for McKeesport as they travel to Gateway next week and finish the regular season at home against unbeaten and #1 ranked PT.

    Fun time of year heading into the homestretch with the playoffs right around the corner.

  446. Drew says:

    Outside of CP in 4A how does the rest of D10 stack up against the WPIAL in the other classifications?

  447. Billy Splain says:

    1A we’ll know more about Farrell tomorrow night. But I think they can play with anyone from wpial
    2A Wilmington stacks up with just about anyone in the state. Seneca is very strong this year, those two may have a battle
    3A We’ll have to see about Mercyhurst. they really haven’t played anyone strong.
    5A Grove City can play with anyone and Meadville could play with a lot of them.
    6A they’ve got nothing for PR in the playoffs, but McDowell and Erie would do well against most of them

  448. Jeff says:

    @ Billy
    Agree with you about 1A and 2A, both classes in the WPIAL down somewhat from previous years, and Farrell and Wilmington are very good.

    In 3A MP might not get past Huntingdon/Forest Hills, and if they do I can’t see them staying within a couple of scores against Aliquippa.

    Disagree with you about 5A, I don’t think Grove City or Meadville stays within 2 scores of the WPIAL winner, some people thought Meadville had a chance last year against West A and we all know how that turned out. I don’t think any of the WPIAL teams are as good as WA was last year, but whoever wins (and I think it will be PT, Gateway or McKeesport) will be too much to handle for the D10 winner. And then will promptly get blown out by Harrisburg in the semi-finals.

  449. Billy Splain says:

    with the GC qb completing like 75% of his passes so far, I disagree. They are real good

  450. me888 says:

    “Drew says:
    October 12th, 2017 at 1:01 pm
    Outside of CP in 4A how does the rest of D10 stack up against the WPIAL in the other classifications?”

    me don’t follow the lower classes much, but…

    5A…me with Jeff. Grove City is about +14, or +21 vs TJ or PT, and a little less vs the rest. The rest of D10 5A is even further back than that.

    6A…as Billy states, “they’ve got nothing for PR in the playoffs”. As for Erie and McDowell, me separate from Billy here. Both are a couple TD’s (or more) back from PCC, NA, BP, PH, SV, or Mt. Leb. They probably wouldn’t get into the top 4 in the Northern 7 conference. One (or both) MIGHT, if they competed in the Southeastern.

    Erie has no passing game, and won’t be able to line up and overpower those teams mentioned above.

    McDowell can throw it a bit, but it’s only average at best; and their run game is at about the same level.

    JMO, as always!

  451. Billy Splain says:

    Grove city could play with nearly every 5A team in the wpial. I don’t care what “me” thinks. I’ve watched them all on film. Erie and Mcdowell could play with MOST….that’s what I said. MOST. I didn’t say dominate, but they’d be in a lot of games. Erie HS is brand new and doing very well, give them a few years. Matz did wonders at CT, he’ll do it with this team too. McDowell is having a down year, but they’ve already done the wpial thing and did very well there.

  452. me888 says:

    me realized TJ was actually 4A seconds after posting (but no way to edit), but still meant what me said about TJ being better than GC. And me would put TJ about the 4th or 5th best team when compared to the actual 5A’s. If me could mix the 5A/4A rankings:

    1. PT
    2. USC/WA
    3. WA/USC
    4. McK
    5. TJ

    Only talking about this year Billy. me seen every team me spoke about in person at least once; and the D10 teams of EHS, McD, and Prep all at least twice and some even 3 times. me usually attend the best game of the week between Prep, McD, General McLane, or EHS. If there isn’t anything interesting, me take the drive down south for a WPIAL game (usually a Northern 7 match up). If still nothing interesting, any TV game on FS Pittsburgh or Channel 22 will do.

    Again, JMO, as always!

  453. Billy Splain says:

    “ME” should consider writing for us

  454. jack1234 says:

    PR scrimmaged mcdowell earlier this year and beat them, just a scrimmage but based on what I saw PR sliced thru their defense while missing a few starters I don’t think they’d stand a chance in the wpial

  455. B. Powell says:

    D10 (2A)
    Seneca has a nice team this year, but has played only 2 teams with a winning record.
    Mercer County 2A and 1A have ruled D10 small schools for 30 years.
    Until an Erie County 2A team wins a D10 title again, I’d have to make Wilmington a big favorite with Greenville and Sharpsville next and Seneca #4. I’ve seen this movie before.

    Mercyhurst Prep has the talent to win D10-3A and they’ll find out if they can beat Sharon and Hickory, soon. Harborcreek isn’t in the same class yet.

  456. Drew says:

    Great info as usual from everyone…I’ll be most interested in how Mercyhurst fares against better competition.

  457. B says:

    I would’ve liked to see Bishop Guilfoyle move up in class this year I heard they talked about it (I don’t know how true that is) but regardless it would’ve led to more intriguing games in 2A. I went to the Forest Hills game and they looked more athletic and better then a good 3A team. I don’t see anyone beating them in 1A maybe California or Williams Valley. As a D6 guy would’ve much rather seen them against Ligonier Valley, Steel Valley and Southern Columbia it would be interesting to see how they would play against teams of that caliber. I think they would complete and could win any but it’s unfortunate because no one will likely challenge them and the streak will continue.

  458. me888 says:

    Belle Vernon over TJ was a huge surprise for me (obviously) after touting TJ recently. BV had 2 very tight wins over Trinity and Ringold, which TJ basically blew out. me will still take TJ in a rematch should one occur; and would still look for TJ to go deep into the playoffs.

    McKeesport wasn’t as big of a surprise. me actually had a mention of them probably being at Heinz Field for the ‘ship later in the year, but removed it before posting a few days ago. They seem to always find a way to lose one early, and are almost always better later on.

    In D10, me was surprised that GM whooped up on Ft. LeBeouf. Nassir Singleton went off for 229 yds.

  459. Mike S says:

    With regard to discussion below regarding D10 5A teams versus WPIAL, the teams are really 4A, moved up to get out of 4A where Cathedral Prep is a lock for the District 10 title. If next classification has Prep at 5A, they’ll stay at 4A and uits fairer to compare Grove City, Meadville, etc to the 4A teams in the WPIAL.

  460. me888 says:

    No inside info here, but me just have a feeling that the recent Erie public school consolidation (and Prep’s most recent athletic successes) will actually be a slight positive to CP enrollments, thus possibly moving them up to 5A (assuming the cutoffs are fairly consistent with the current ones). Mercyhurst Prep may also see this slight bump in headcount, though it may not be enough to propel them up in class. me is also aware that the prior cutoffs may be considerably different from the new ones, rendering this enrollment bump a moot point.

    @Mike S

    As to your mention of comparing Grove City to 4A’s rather than 5A’s, that’s the train of thought me was rolling with when me was comparing them to TJ (in a previous post). me didn’t make that clear in that post, and me had me thoughts intertwined with an analysis of 5A D10 vs WPIAL teams.

  461. B. Powell says:

    Yes, the PIAA likes to have nearly equal numbers of schools in each classification 1A through 6A.
    Let’s say if there are 700 football programs they seem to like to divide that number by the 6 classes and go from there. So, there will be roughly 115-120 in each class.
    If you’re on that edge in 2016 you’ll probably be on that cusp again for 2018-2019.
    I’m thinking Cathedral Prep will move themselves up to 5A this next cycle (football) for a different challenge. Me thinks?

  462. B. Powell says:

    But there aren’t 700 football programs in PA…I realize that. LOL.
    Get the numbers in, go through the new approved co-ops and count from there. It seems to me in a fair sense, you’d take that total number of schools and divide them up in equal parts or close to it.

  463. D10 Fan says:

    Unless the numbers force them to, I don’t see CP moving up to 5A. There’s going to be a considerable drop off in overall talent next year. The last time CP had a senior class this good was 16 years ago. Still going to be very good, but they’ll be closer to beatable than they’ve been since before their title in 2012.

  464. D10Insider says:

    Mike S, always great insight and a solid read. I don’t see Prep going up with the new enrollment they will play where the numbers put them. It’s not like they win the state title in every sport, every year. You remember better than all of us when CASH knocked them out a few years back and that 40-3 thump wasn’t to long ago they took in states. The AAAA well any class competition in D10 for Prep isn’t good, but the TJs, the McDevitts, and Berks Catholic and obviously Imhotep are.

    Agreed, next year will more than likely be a rebuilding year for them but the team will still be solid.

    Yes,all the 4A schools in D10 avoided Prep this cycle, can’t blame them. They will struggle against the WPIAL team and probably never beat them.

    Mercyhurst Prep is benefiting from transfers and terrible competition. Some of these guys they have on this team, look like adult men vs children playing the teams they play. I see the same fate for them once WPIAL arrives, IF they get out of D10

  465. Jeff says:

    @ Mike S – completely agree it’s fairer to compare Grove City/Meadville and other “5A” teams in D10 to the 4A teams in the WPIAL, because as you reminded everyone all of those D10 schools are 4A, and many on the lower end of the enrollment scale. However, they obviously have to play the 5A WPIAL winner, and that’s a very tough matchup for them, I would be shocked if Grove City or whoever wins D10 beats the WPIAL champion. And as previously stated whoever wins that game has virtually no chance against Harrisburg the following week.

    @me888 – I too was shocked TJ lost to Belle Vernon, I figured they would win that game by 2-3 scores. I also like them in a rematch if it occurs and still expect TJ will win the WPIAL title and have a rematch with ECP for the 3rd yr in a row…I have a hunch ECP beats them worse than the 30-13 score last year.

  466. Robert says:

    I live in the SE PA area and a few years ago I was disgusted that St Joe Prep was permitted to play for the PIAA championship when they had a NJ resident on their team. Jon Runyon lived in NJ, his father was a congressman from the NJ district and yet he played on a team that won the PA state title. There was an article in today’s paper where he was basically laughing about it. They really should create a separate classification call it 0A where all these schools that recruit across state line or take kids out of school to follow a coach like Albie Crosby play amongst themselves.

  467. B says:

    My opinion on the whole private school recruiting issue is different from most because I saw personal how transferring can help someone get a scholarship. My cousin a couple years ago played at a small school in D6 and was the best player on his team from his sophomore year. His dad decided after his junior year, noticing his sons unique skills and knowing he had no chance at this school to be seen, he transferred to a private much better school. He ended up getting a scholarship to a decent D1 school that his college coach said they would’ve never gave him had he not transferred in high school to the school he did. I know there’s more examples of kids transferring to get better notoriety to better there chances to get scholarships and that’s ultimately more important then who win championships is these kids who otherwise wouldn’t have these opportunities be provided a chance. I don’t agree with someone playing in PA from a different state that’s wrong. But if anything high school football and the way it works is a lesson for these kids that life sometimes just isn’t completely fair you just have to work alittle harder and persevere alittle more

  468. Jamie says:

    So 4A Bradford runs away from the district 9 & 10 4A and 5A competition and joins the AML North to play against single and AA schools (and losing to the good AA schools).They only play 9 games total and now have a chance at making the 4A playoffs if they win their final game tonight against Curwensville. How about playing teams like Meadville, Grove City, etc. to earn the right to be in the playoffs? As far as the final game this evening, GO TIDE!!

  469. Mike S says:

    Hey, Jeff. I agree that in the current D 10 “5A” the winner doesn’t stand much of a chance against the WPIAL 5A in the playoffs. Look at the Meadville team last years with the great Journey Brown. Didn’t go far. But Grove City is the favorite to come out of D10 and it is a more balanced run/pass team than Meadville, yet I don’t like their chances in 5A v a true 5A team. Such is the problem though in D10 with Cathedral Prep in 4A.

    Conneaut did beat Prep in 2014 in the old 1A-4A system as 3A teams to win D10, but had an even better team in 2015 and couldn’t repeat the victory over Prep. So these teams will do what is needed to avoid Prep so that one of them can win a District championship. That’s what they’ve determined is the priority.

    Thanks for the great discussion guys.

  470. Jeff says:

    @ Mike S – GC had a pretty impressive win on Friday against Meadville, so I’m starting to think they may give the WPIAL winner a game, not sure about beating them, but think it may be a more competitive game than a lot of people expect.

    I have seen all the WPIAL teams in the Allegheny 9 conference, and I think GC is as good or better than all of them, including WA and USC. However, the top teams in the WPIAL this year are in the Big East conference, and as I’ve previously stated I would be shocked if the WPIAL winner is not PT, Gateway or McKeesport, I expect 2 of those 3 to meet at Heinz Field for the WPIAL title. I think this is finally PT’s year after coming close many times it the past, if it is PT vs. GC the key in that game will be how well GC’s offensive line holds up against a very good PT defensive line and linebackers.

    I don’t blame all the schools in D10 for avoiding ECP, they didn’t have that option under the old system but they obviously do now since we’ve gone to 6 classes.

  471. me888 says:

    “Jeff says:
    October 23rd, 2017 at 10:18 am

    I don’t blame all the schools in D10 for avoiding ECP, they didn’t have that option under the old system but they obviously do now since we’ve gone to 6 classes.”

    In reality, they did have the option, but did not conspire en masse to exercise that option.

    General McLane alone chose to play at the top 4A level for 2 years (when they were probably closer to 2A enrollment than 4A enrollment) rather than face Prep at the 3A level. They fortunately failed to advance beyond D10 that year, as the better PCC, PR, and NA’s of the WPIAL were bigger and better than Prep in those 2 years. It could have been a serious mistake. But then ego usually makes one stupid in retrospect. The others were smart enough to not follow them at that time. me pretty confident Prep decided against playing up at that time rather than face those WPIAL teams mentioned above, and it was the correct decision for them then. But GM was so bent on avoiding Prep, and to outwardly voice their contempt for the system that…ego (see above). GM also knew they couldn’t beat 4A McDowell at that time either, so it was more for the show (and contempt/protest of Prep and the system in place).

    This is pure conjecture on me part, but me guess GM tried to get the others to follow them then too, but were unsuccessful. me pretty sure they blazed the trail in leading the contingent as a group in protest to jump the level once the 6 classes materialized, and the others just followed suit realizing that Prep was going to be even better for this new 2 year cycle; so it was worth the risk. They now wouldn’t be up with PCC, PR, and NA, but with WA, USC, McK. If nothing else, they at least made their point to the PIAA.

  472. D10 Fan says:

    Looks like it’ll be McDowell/Erie winner vs State College in the sub-regional. Not sure either team can beat SC. Saw both multiple times. I know Erie scrimmaged SC this summer so that could be an interesting storyline if they meet.

    GM has been anti-CP ever since CP started getting good again. It was so bad this year. It looked like GM was purposely letting CP run up the score by going for it on 4th down multiple times in their own territory. It was hard to watch. Anything to get their point across to D10 & PIAA.

  473. Billy Splain says:

    that’s where my season started, erie at State College…would be cool to see the real thing now

  474. me888 says:

    “D10 Fan says:
    October 23rd, 2017 at 8:17 pm

    GM has been anti-CP ever since CP started getting good again. It was so bad this year. It looked like GM was purposely letting CP run up the score by going for it on 4th down multiple times in their own territory. It was hard to watch. Anything to get their point across to D10 & PIAA.”

    Yes, and no.

    Yes, no denying GM has been big time anti-CP going back a long time (10-12 years or so).

    No, on the 4th down conversions. In the Jim Wells era, that has been a constant. Actually, one of the biggest plays in GM history may have been one of those 4th down attempts. Against everyone’s preseason consensus state champion TJ back in their 2006-2007 PIAA championship season, GM went for a 4th and 1 from their own 29 on maybe their 1st or 2nd possession (when TJ had Dom DeCicco, Lucas Nix, Dan Giegerich, and Chris Drager), in a 0-0 game. Drew Astorino busted off about a 40 yard run, and from that day forward they probably went for most 4th down conversions that were less than 10 yards or so for the next few seasons. Had that one play failed, the TJ game could very well have gone the other way right then and there. It actually burned them a number of times over the next couple seasons as well. They just refused to punt in many seemingly improbable situations. They just got carried away with it, and still attempt it much more often, and in much less dire situations than most teams would ever think of. The trouble is the talent level hasn’t been as good since those seasons from about 2004 thru 2010, and the success rate has fallen off as well.

  475. river runner says:

    Sounds like D10 is granting everyone’s wish next year as far as regions go on the upper classifications. McDowell, Erie and Prep will be there own region and will have to go out and find other games to fill their schedules. The Ohio teams will work for one more year, however they are making adjustments to the start time to their seasons in two years. That might throw a wrench into PA vs OH.
    Prep has a great team. There is no doubt about that. However, how fair is it really to have some of these schools in D10 play them? It makes a lot of sense for schools to play up to get away from them. For most of those schools a D10 championship is good enough. Or at least something to build a program around.
    Everyone in D10 knows the road to the state championship goes right to the WIPAL and you know already the level of competition out of the WIPAL is great.
    The public school vs private school debate is here to stay. It was felt in Erie County this year with some kids leaving their home community schools and enrolling at private schools. One Erie county coach stood up to the transfers and fought them. Someone stood up and took a stand and got knocked down in the process. However I think it may have opened the door for other coaches and administers in the area to take a stand against these bogus academic transfers. In reality it is not fair. When you can cherry pick (if you want) as a private or charter school across a much wider area the balance of fairness goes right out of the window.
    It is time for someone in the PIAA to take a close look at how the scales are leaning and make some changes. Other states have done just that. They recognized the parody involved with it and made a change.

  476. Jeff says:

    @me888 – thanks for the great insights and background information, being from Pittsburgh I didn’t realize the level of animosity of GM and the other schools in D10 towards ECP, I certainly knew some existed, but not to the extent you described, and I didn’t know that GM played in 4A for a couple of years just to make a point. Sounds like this has been simmering for a long time and boiled over when ECP dropped from 4A to 3A, which is certainly their right as long as they meet the enrollment guidelines.

    When ECP was in their first heyday back at the turn of the century were they 4A based on enrollment, or were they playing up those years?

    I get your point about the other schools having the option of playing up to 4A back in the old system, but that wasn’t very practical or logical given they would be playing against schools 2-3 x their size when it came to the state playoffs, at least now with the 6 class system they are only competing against schools with 50%-75% more enrollment.

  477. Billy Splain says:

    river runner, there are people trying to make changes but the district chairmen refuse to go along with them. That’s where the problem lies, with the chairmen. Until the coaches as a whole stand up to them and tell them to make the changes, it won’t happen

  478. me888 says:

    “Jeff says:
    October 25th, 2017 at 9:10 am

    When ECP was in their first heyday back at the turn of the century were they 4A based on enrollment, or were they playing up those years?

    I get your point about the other schools having the option of playing up to 4A back in the old system, but that wasn’t very practical or logical given they would be playing against schools 2-3 x their size when it came to the state playoffs, at least now with the 6 class system they are only competing against schools with 50%-75% more enrollment.”

    As to your question on Prep in the early 2000’s, they were truly 4A based upon enrollment.

    As to your comment on moving up within the new 6 class system, now you see how asinine GM moving up to 4A at that time truly was. It was more in the interest of moving the argument forward to the district and PIAA than it was for the kids to compete in the system at that time; and that was dangerous and wrong in me eyes. me best bet was that they were virtually positive there was no way they could get past either 3A Prep or 4A McDowell, but that they’d rather chance it vs McDowell (whom they had a friendly relationship with). They were truly at war with Prep at that time…and still are. They had to play both in the regular season anyway due to the limited number of teams in D10. The real problem would have been if they’d miraculously advanced at the 4A level. GM’s lines may not have averaged 220 lbs per man. PCC, at that time, had 3 or 4 300 pounders, and averaged close to 300. GM wouldn’t have been that competitive vs the top 2A teams from the WPIAL in those couple years, yet alone the 4A’s.

    Every district has some private/public conflict, but most pale in comparison to this one. Palko (WA) and Cherpak (TJ) only vocalize this aspect during intradistricts. While the WPIAL teams may resent it, it’s not like the civil war atmosphere in D10. Heck, if McDowell (one of the 2 or 3 biggest western PA schools) would have just stepped up and been more competitive vs Prep during this time, and beaten Prep once out of every 3 times over the years, many of these smaller schools would have been able to see some light at the end of the tunnel, and probably wouldn’t have followed GM’s lead to begin with.

    As always, JMO!

  479. Drew says:


    CP chose to play up to 4A. enrollment was equivalent to a mid to upper sized 3A school back then.

  480. D10 Fan says:

    yes, their enrollment dipped below 4A requirements but it wasnt at the turn of the century. There were 1 or 2 years i believe that they tried to stay in 4A but after taking a few thumpings from the WPIAL 4As they decided to drop down to 3A.

    I like how you phrased the relationship between GM/CP. “At war” is prefect.

    Switching gears a bit…I’m considering taking a trip to Buffalo this saturday to watch CP take on Canisius, in a battle of defending state champs. Canisius is usually CPs most competitive game and are always fun to watch. I’m most interested in how CP is going to replace star CB/WR anthony bolden who was lost for the year a few weeks ago. They’ve had a few games since then but this will be the 1st real test for the next guys up.

  481. me888 says:


    Prep was a “solid” 4A in the very early 2000’s (1999-2001) when they played the epic battles with CB West. It wasn’t until the next cycle following General McLane’s PIAA championship in Dec. 2006 that Prep dropped to 3A. They were never a 3A playing up, even in their final year of 4A. In their final year of 4A (2007-2008), they lost to PCC 7-21 in the regular season, and again 6-44 in the PIAA’s, as PCC went 16-0 and won it all.

    They never qualified for 3A until the year they 1st took the drop. That would have been for the 2008-2009 school year. That would also be Don Holl’s final season with Prep.

    Many people in D10 claimed Prep wasn’t happy (actually jealous) that GM won a 3A championship in a season that Prep had beaten them 31-14 at GM during league play that year; and chose to drop for that reason once eligible. me not convinced that was the actual reason. me more convinced that coupled with dwindling enrollment, the beatings they were taking in 4A, and the decline of the program under Holl, that 3A was the right move for their kids then. They actually lost to Strong Vincent 0-28 (2008-2009) to end their 1st 3A season, in what ended up as Holl’s final season there. Mike Mischler took over in the 2009-2010 season. They proceeded to lose to West Allegheny 21-36 in 3A intradistricts that year. Mischler turned the program around starting that year, and the rest as they say is history, and still being written.

    Just a hunch, but me thinks their recent success has probably increased their enrollment slightly since the last cycle. Whether it’s increased enough to force them into the next 5A classification, we shall see.

  482. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    ME888 I think you forgot an important part of history to the GM vs Prep Saga. This is when the real “War” started.

  483. river runner says:

    @me: As of right now there numbers are still 4A. That’s what it nice about controlling your own enrollment. Last cycle they were only one or two kids under 5A.

  484. B. Powell says:

    2016-2017 PIAA football count was:
    1A 140 and below
    2A 141-200
    3A 201-282
    4A 283-397
    5A 398-563
    6A 564 and above

    ECP was at 397

  485. BHS2000 says:

    On the eve of one of my favorite nights (week 10 of western pa high school football), I’m excited for several big matchups tomorrow night. Two games that really excite me are Mt. Lebo vs Bethel Park and South Fayette vs. Montour. A lot of talent on those two fields this weekend. Their are two kids specifically that I’m looking forward to watching tomorrow. #1 AIDAN CAIN the standout WR for lebo. How can you not root for this kid? Coming off two consecutive seasons with knee injuries. Now the 6-1 Senior is showcasing his skills by dominating all of PA in Receiving yards 1450 and Recieving TDs. Also #25 JOE MOWOD the extremely well-rounded MLB for South Fayette. With all the talent this team possesses, it’s gone under the radar everything that this 5-11 Junior has done. Not only does he captain and call the defensive plays at middle linebacker. But he has receiving touchdowns, rushing touchdowns, he’s a top special teams player and has returned kicks, and when SF needs a push he will hop on the O-line as well!! Prime example of the selfless attitude we hope to see from our western pa players. Should be a lot of interesting outcomes tomorrow night. Having said that I hope we all enjoy some exciting, competitive, and most importantly safe Friday night lights.

  486. Xavier says:

    How about an explanation of why you ranked Huntingdon with a loss to three loss Central ahead of Forest Hills in AAA?

  487. Billy Splain says:

    Eye test. I’ve seen both play. Plus, Central at 3 losses is still a darned good team, factor in that it was a huge rivalry game. I will also add that Centrals 3 losses came to an incredible Chestnut Ridge team that is taking down all comers, including the 4A Bellefonte team that is making history who’s only loss came to that Ridge team. Bellefonte, who again, is VERY good 4A team and a 5A Hollidaysburg team. It will wash itself out in a couple weeks. If they play each other, it’ll be a great game. But Forest Hills could end up playing that same Central team.

  488. me888 says:

    “ECL/Metro FAN says:
    October 26th, 2017 at 8:39 am
    ME888 I think you forgot an important part of history to the GM vs Prep Saga. This is when the real “War” started.”

    me hadn’t forgotten about that incident, and in jest just the a few weeks ago, me ran into an acquaintance born and raised in the Edinboro area, and me addressed him as a “mayonnaise eating hater” (as me…not being raised in the area), to which we both cracked up. 😉

    But as to your original statement, this incident occurred a few years after the hostilities a actually “started. me had one child involved in the rivalry/animosity back in 2006-2007 school year.

  489. me888 says:

    “river runner says:
    October 26th, 2017 at 1:01 pm
    @me: As of right now there numbers are still 4A. That’s what it nice about controlling your own enrollment. Last cycle they were only one or two kids under 5A.”

    me don’t know about the numbers as they stand today, but me not a conspiracy theorist either. Due to the current financial state of catholic education and schools, me pretty sure that if they could get 10 to 15 more kids to attend immediately, they wouldn’t give a “RATZ AZZZ” about where that put the football or basketball teams in relation to the classification level. That would be negligence by the stewards of the school. What goes on, and what people think goes on are often ridiculously at odds.

  490. WPIAL Rules says:

    SO NA gave PR a good run for their money. Is it possible that NA showed some weakness in PR? Playoffs are here and we will soon find out!

    Projected WPIAL 6 Playoffs:
    First Round:
    PR vs Norwin
    PCC vs Peters
    NA vs Mt. Lebo
    PH vs BP

    Second Round:
    PR vs NA
    PCC vs BP

    6A Championship:
    PR vs PCC

    Winner: ?

  491. Jack1234 says:

    NA tested PR because of horrendous officiating. PR had 3 TD’s called back on horrible calls that were so bad the tv announcers for 22 the point were at a loss for words. Only weakness NA exposed on PR was on defense they couldn’t stop HB toss plays out of three TE sets, problem is no one runs 3 TE sets besides NA. NA didn’t take a hint from PCC and ran a 3 man front against PR on D and they rushed for 600 yards on it. If you wanna take away the pass from PR then Crawford and White will run all over you. The weakness PR has now is that their big play receiver, Raymond Falcone, injured his leg and I think he might be out for the season. Did not look good. That’s a blow to their offense as he consistently made big plays for them. I don’t think their should be a question mark for the PR PCC game though, PCC will not beat PR with that god awful offense.

  492. phillyboy says:

    I tell you right now, PCC should have to play NA in their semi. Seems like NA is at least the 3rd best of not second best team at 6A in the WPIAL. How did NA lose to PCC this year?

  493. phillyboy says:

    Dag, that’s tough news; I didn’t know Falcone is out for the year. If PR is able to get by NA and PCC, that could tip the balance, making St. Joe’s Prep the favorite to take states. They still got Batman but without Robin it will be hard to beat the Prep. The Prep is basically the Yankees of PIAA football. Maybe PR can gut one out, play inspired ball, all is not lost, there’s still a chance they could pull it out.

  494. Jack1234 says:

    He was a very good player but they’re loaded with other guys, they still should be good

  495. WPIAL Rules says:

    NA will not get 2nd. They have 2 Northern 7 loses. PR will play for States but SJP will beat them.

  496. Jack1234 says:

    Having seen both PCC and NA play now, I think NA is slightly better than PCC. Obviously NA will finish third in the northern 7. If PR meets SJP it’s a toss up for me. I think SJP should rightfully so be the favorite; their resume speaks for themselves (3 state titles in 4 years). But this SJP team isn’t the same as years past, seems like they have a great defense this year and a solid offense led by a senior QB with state championship experience. They don’t however have elite game changing players like Swift or zacheus like they did for all of their titles. Keep in mind swift single handily beat PR in 2014. Prep has also been without their top WR Simmons. I wouldn’t count PR out against Prep, unlike PCC PR Is actually well coached and I think if this game happens it will be an epic game.

  497. VanDerHere says:

    Heard this from a D10 AD recently regarding Regions next year…

    Erie, CP, McDowell by themselves in a ‘Metro’ League. They will then have to fill the rest of their schedules with non-region games.

    FLB and GM would be out into other regions. If both end up 4 A, could be a big region of


    or potentially split it in half. Will be interesting to see how it goes.

  498. phillyboy says:

    For PR to have any realistic chance against St. Joe’s Prep Kenny White is going to have to get big time involved. Otherwise they’ll just key on the QB. Last I checked the Prep is ranked #7 in the nation. They also beat St. Peter’s Prep of North Jersey, Tampa Jesuit, Wood, and LaSalle. Even without a 4 star player the Prep machine rolls on vanquishing anything in its way.

  499. Jack1234 says:

    @phillyboy PR has had a realistic chance all season. And they still do. Falcone wasn’t there only playmaker, and if they key in on only the QB then they will get burned. Rankings don’t mean that much; maxpreps has PR number 1 in state and 20 nationally. SJP is obviously very good but I think they are beatable this year they do not have the same type of team that they have usaully had.

  500. River Runner says:

    @VanDerHere: The lynch pin in the whole thing will be where ECP ends up. If ECP bumps up then then 4A’s will stay 4A. I think that would put Meadville and ECP as the only 5A. If ECP stays 4A then 5A becomes a packed region. It might make sense to have two regions at that point.

  501. Jeff says:

    I wouldn’t assume it will be PR vs. PCC in the final, I think Bethel Park has a very good chance of beating PCC at their own ground and pound game, very big and good offensive line and 2 very solid running backs in Volpatti and Doleno.

    It’s a shame Falcone is out for the year, but I wouldn’t count out PR just yet, they are still head and shoulders above every team in the WPIAL this year, they will comfortably win the WPIAL title and should handle State College and then the D3 winner (presumably Cumberland Valley) in the state playoffs before an epic showdown with SJP. I figured that game was a tossup before Falcone got hurt, I now give the edge to SJP, but the good news for PR is they have several weeks to adjust to Falcone being out before they play SJP. These 2 teams have been on a collision course since very early in the season, and while losing Falcone will hurt it won’t derail PR from making it to Hershey, I’ll reserve my prediction on that game until we get closer and see how the playoffs unfold.

  502. Jack1234 says:

    I’d be an idiot to say losing falcone doesn’t hurt the team. However they’re other receivers have been very good, and their backfield is quite possible one of the best in the state with white and Crawford. Then people forget their defense has been very good this season. Pr hasn’t ran with jurkovec much this season but they finally unleashed him this Friday and against NA using the read option. This play is extremely deadly with jurkovec and when pr finds anouther time to unleash this (quite possible against sjp) any defense will struggle against it.

  503. Jack1234 says:

    The issue with bethel park when I saw them was that they are one dimensional. PR’s front 7 shutdown there run game and they couldn’t pass at all. They are starting a soph QB and they couldn’t get any thing through the air. Ground and pound won’t beat PR this year, gotta be able to go score for score with them and force some mistakes.

  504. Billy Splain says:

    I saw BP two weeks ago and they were far from one dimensional. Their qb moved the ball around quite well.

  505. Jeff says:

    I don’t give BP any chance against PR in the final, they won’t be able to score enough points to keep up, but I do think they have a legitimate chance to beat PCC in the semi-finals. PCC didn’t fare too well last year when they played teams that were as big up front as they were and just as fast or faster (St. Johns and obviously SJP), and BP is a similar type team, albeit not on those other teams level, then again, this PCC team is not nearly as good as last year. We’ll see what happens but I’m predicting a BP-PR final, with PR winning by something like 49-21.

  506. VanDerHere says:


    I would bet good money teams will play up again if Prep stays at 4A. My guess is Warren won’t stay again now that they have a new staff. Unless Meadville and ECP both end up at 5A because of enrollment, ECP will be by themselves.

    What would make sense is adding one team to that mega region and splitting it into 5 teams. Maybe Titusville or Corry if they somehow at 4A? A Corry additon for example would look like

    Group 1

    Group 2

  507. Jeff says:

    Some thoughts on the WPIAL 5A playoffs, since I know that class the best having seen 6 out of the 8 playoff teams in person. I think there’s a good chance the Big East will win all 4 opening round games, like the Northern 7 did in 6A last year. USC and WA are average teams, I expect WA to get beat at home by 2 scores by McKeesport, and Franklin has a good chance to beat USC on their home field, their QB Jack Hansberry is good, but he’s probably 85% of their offense, and I expect Franklin’s defense will be able to contain him just like Woodland Hills did last week.

    PT got a break from the WPIAL seeding committee by putting McKeesport on the other side of the bracket, I expect they won’t have too much trouble handling Fox Chapel and the USC/Franklin winner and advance to the final against the winner of the Gateway-McKeesport rematch. That will be a great game, just like their game earlier this year and the playoff game last year, I give the slight edge to McKeesport this time and think they will advance to Heinz Field for the 2nd year in a row.

    Tough to pick a winner between McKeesport and PT, but it’s tough to beat a very good team twice in the span of 3 weeks, so I have PT winning a close one over McKeesport to finally win their first WPIAL title.

  508. B. Powell says:

    I like how your thinking, but if you’re throwing Corry into that mix, don’t forget Harborcreek, too. They were at (281) in 2016 and Corry was (274).
    You could also expand those regions with Hickory (251), Slippery Rock (259) and Sharon (243).
    Franklin was at (236) in 2016.

    I guess we’ll have to wait and see the new numbers come in and then wait to see where ECP is at.

  509. Danny says:

    @ Powell and Van

    Agree with your thoughts regarding D10 Regions. There are a few teams that could potentially be moving down to 3A. Conneaut PA I believe is close. I think D10 could mix some 3A schools with 4A to make travel lighter in the regular season. To me, a region with Oil City, Franklin, Corry, Warren, and Titusville in it makes a lot of sense. Meadville could be in there too The old TCAC. Then put Conneaut in with the Mercer County schools. The issue is where to put GM and FLB.

  510. Jack1234 says:

    When I saw bethel play PR once they got behind and they had to pass the ball they struggled. This was week 4 for bethel and 5 for PR so it was earlier this season but stil didn’t impress me.

    @jeff the only teams that proved they can move the ball on PR’s defense was lebo and NA. If lebo doesn’t have a few of the fumbles they had during the game then it would’ve been much closer than the score showed. I wouldn’t count them out in their rematch against NA. That Cain kid gives them a chance against any team. They passed for 400+ with their backup QB against PR.

  511. SCLions says:

    So, Altoona is leaving the WPIAL and has been granted membership to the Mid-Penn Commonwealth. Do you think this is a good move for the MPC considering Altoona was a member years back and didn’t fair well in the division then.

  512. Mike S says:

    Regarding the D10 talk below and how the regions will break out, would not surprise me to see Conneaut (CASH) fall down to 3A. They’ve been barely a 4A and the enrollment trand has been downward for quite some time. Matching CASH up with the Mercer County Schools would make some great games.

  513. Jeff says:

    @Jack1234 – I’m not counting Mt. Lebo out tonight against NA, but I don’t like their chances due to a porous defense, was very surprised NA put up 44 on them in their first game. They will have to win a shoot out, which they are capable of doing with their passing game like you mentioned, but I think NA’s defense will get more stops than Lebo’s defense and NA wins 42-31.

  514. Jack1234 says:

    @jeff Lebo’s d line was very good when I saw, outside of jurkovec scrambles they shut the run game down and got some pressure too. The secondary is pouras though, NA should expose that.

  515. Tim says:

    When is the D10 all region selections going to be made and when/where will it be published?

  516. Billy Splain says:

    We’ll have it on the site in the brackets after all games are played, sunday afternoon….we do know Erie vs State College is Friday at Clarion, 7pm

  517. Southern D10 says:

    Tim, I believe the coaches in each region come together at some point during the playoffs to vote on the all-region teams. However, I don’t think they get released until the last team left in D10 plays their last game. Which might not be until after the Piaa championships for possibly a couple teams. Now if you meant the sites and times for next weeks games, Billy is right in that they should be announced sometime on Sunday

  518. Billy Splain says:

    my bad, misread….all region teams come out after the season

  519. jesper says:

    So what is the WPIAL going to do in 3A next year? Seton LaSalle and Apollo Ridge are moving down to AA (where their numbers are now anyway).

    Decent chance Elizabeth Forward and Beaver move up to 4A. Burrell and Southmoreland could go down…

    Do they divvy up the rest of the Allegheny Conference and just have two conferences in 3A.

  520. phillyboy says:

    Listened to part of the Pine Richland/Norwin game last night on MSA Sports. Sheesh, PR lost another key player for the year? They’re dropping like flies. At this rate it will be a job well done just to be the state runner-up.

  521. Billy Splain says:

    Aliquippa also lost a key player in Eli Kasinovich with a broken leg

  522. Jack1234 says:

    @phillyboy that injury is not season ending, they think he’s fine.

  523. Tim says:

    Thanks Southern D10.
    I heard someone say that the voting has been done for All region, but I can not get anyone to confirm it nor the date or place that the choices will be published.
    Is there not, all region, all district and all state teams?
    I could not find any information on the voting process on the PIAA web site.

  524. PCC64 says:

    Phillyboy, a few days ago you wondered how PCC beat NA. I was at the game, it was very close,and hard fought. Central was up 14-7, NA was moving on the ground but Central came up with the stops. Late in the 4th Quarter NA was moving again looking to tie the game. Central’s D forced them to pass and Brian Dallas and his gang of pass rushers put an end to the game with multiple sacks. At the time, I stated that NA was a Good team and that they would not be beat the rest of the year excluding PR. I was scoffed at by some people but there you have it . NA is a heck of a team. BTW, so is Penn Hills.

  525. River Runner says:

    D10 all region teams are done through the Erie paper. Coaches nominate players on their teams and send that list to the paper. The paper then makes a ballot and send it out to all the coaches. The head coach votes (you can not vote for players on your own team). Typically they do not release the winners until there are no teams remaining in the playoffs. That could mean once the PIAA championships for some regions. The Go Erie website will publish the list as well as send the list to local papers. In years past they have started publishing them once a region is finished. So region 1 might finish up and be posted and four weeks later region 5 could be done and be posted.

  526. phillyboy says:

    Thanks for that PCC64. I was just commenting that I thought it’s a minor injustice that PR has to face NA in the semi of the WPIAL tournament since #1 should face #4. I know the records are what they are but I got to believe NA is at least the third best team in the WPIAL at 6A.

  527. HS Football Guru says:

    You guys keep talking about this SJP vs PR epic state championship game. It’s not gonna happen. State College is going to steamroll PR in the State Quarterfinal. I guarantee it!!!

  528. B says:

    State college beating PR ha. State College they have 2 loses and not even close they lost by 15 and 24. I don’t see that happening PR will beat state college by atleast 3 touchdowns and I’m from district 6 so I always want to see the teams from there do well but I just don’t believe this upset will happen

  529. Ernie from Erie says:

    SC has to play Erie yet. That single wing has only really been stopped by CP. Speaking of Erie, what a great win for that program beating defending 6A and before that 4A Champion McDowell. Hasn’t happened for a really long time. Go D10!

  530. WPIAL Rules says:

    PCC64 – what Phillyboy is stating is that he was hoping that PCC would face PR this round so they would not have a chance at their 5th consecutive trip to Heinz. He is anti-private school!

    State College is looking stronger and stronger…but who have they played?

  531. phillyboy says:

    WPIAL Rules ….what I was saying is that PCC should have to play NA in their semi. Was thinking Lebo might be the easiest opponent of the four.

  532. Jeff says:

    @Philly Boy – Bethel Park beat NA 35-15 early in the season, their only loss was to PR, and they won their conference, that’s why they were seeded third ahead of NA, had they not been upset by Penn Hills they would be playing PCC in the other semi-final. All of this is a moot point because PR is significantly better than every other team in the WPIAL this year. I have a feeling the rematch this week will not be as close as the first meeting, and wouldn’t be surprised if they put up 50+ points on NA, there’s a lot of bad blood between the schools and PR is not going to let their foot off the gas, this game may be all but over by halftime.

    As for State College beating PR, that would be one of the biggest upsets in PA playoff history, PR will be at least a 3 TD favorite in that game, and I don’t think it will be close, and that’s if SC even gets that far, they first have to beat Erie this week and then likely a very good Delaware Valley team the following week.

    It’s been obvious since very early in the season the only team in 6A that has a chance to beat PR is SJP.

  533. D10 Fan says:

    Anyone have any insight/prediction for Mercyhurst/Sharon this weekend? Part of me thinks Mercyhurst in a close one but i’m not sure they’ll have an answer for Strickland. Could go either way.

  534. HS Football Guru says:

    New year, PCC64 is still here and still the worst person alive. Nothing has changed lol

  535. Danny says:

    @ D10.

    Give me MP 24-20. Helsey is running like a man possessed. MP actually does have a strong secondary with Barnes and Montefiori back there. Brooks has been efficient all year, and I think the arsenal of Motillo, Barnes, and Helsey could be too much. Voytik from Sharon has been getting better every game though, I definitely think it’ll be a close game.

  536. Pcc64 says:

    God be with you !

  537. Tim says:

    Thanks, great answer. Just have to wait to see who is picked

  538. jack1234 says:

    NA run defense has been nothing short of terrible all season long, it’s the main reason bethel beat them since they are a strong power running team and PR ran for over 600 yards on them. NA kept it “close” with PR because the offiating was god awful and they screwed up multiple calls that would’ve been game changing and essentially allow PR to blow the game open. One example was an NA RB being stripped while bassically standing up and the second the ball came free the refs blew the whistle and ruled him down when it was clearly a strip recovered by PR. That isn’t the only bad call, there were many more. It was so bad the announcers on 22 the point were at a loss for words. Anyhow,NA also used a few gadget plays that caught PR off guard. NA wasn’t a bad team when I saw them, they played hard but in the end PR is just too much for any WPIAL team. I don’t think this game will be that close, NA may score some and move the ball but with better refs this game is a mercy rule. We will see though.

  539. jack1234 says:

    Regarding State College beating PR, for any team to beat PR this season (this includes SJP) you have to be able to score a lot of points. Unless you’re offense can put up 40 on PR’s D (which has played very well this season) then you don’t have a chance because even if PR gets slowed down they will still score. NA and Lebo played PR hard but in the end it’s hard to score that much on a good defense and PR always will score. We will see, state college is a good team but if the game happens I don’t how PR wouldn’t be the favorite.

  540. HS Football Guru says:

    State College is averaging 47.2 PPG so watch out PR. Plus State College has been without the best player in the state, Keaton Ellis, for the last 6 weeks. He will be back and State College is gonna destroy PR.

  541. Danny says:

    More D-10 Coaching news…

    Dave Frank of Seneca resigns after a 9-1 season. Don’t know the backstory here but would think that he would continue coaching elsewhere. Will also be interesting to see how this affects Scarabino. Transfer?

  542. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Scarabino will end up at Erie Prep.

  543. Jack1234 says:

    Never even heard of this Keaton Ellis kid. I’m sure Micah Parsons and Phil Jurkovec have something to say about that though LOL. And averaging 47 points against who even? Has state college even played a real team this year?

  544. SClions says:

    Ellis has a full ride to psu as a db. He’s a junior so has one more year. As a parent of a former state high player and follower of the team, the only true test was against Harrisburg which they hung with them thru 3rd quarter, then fell apart. The last two years the opening schedule for state has been weak compared to previous years if you ask me. I think they’ll beat Erie but will fall to PR. They played PR like 3 years ago and lost and state was a way better team and PR wasn’t as good as they are now. I’m sure ha football guru is just someone on the team and talking smack.

  545. Jeff says:

    Let’s not forget SC also has another game after Erie before they would play PR, likely against an undefeated Delaware Valley team. Everyone assumed SC would play PCC last year and they got beat by Williamsport the week before.

    SC had lots of problems stopping the Wing-T when they played Cumberland Valley earlier this year, so if they don’t defend better than they did in that game they could get upset by Erie.

  546. Jeff says:

    @Jack1234 – you obviously are very close to the PR program and offer a lot of insight, I completely agree with you that I don’t think tonight’s game will be that close, and would not be shocked if it turns out to be a mercy rule. I expect PR to score 50+ and I’ll give NA 21, and at most 28 like the first game, wouldn’t be surprised at all if it’s something like 42-7 or 49-14 at one point and NA scores a few TD’s in the 4th quarter to make the final score a little more respectable.

  547. Jack1234 says:

    PR will take what NA gives them on defense, if NA drops 6-8 into coverage they will run and vice versa. Everybody gives art walker credit as a great coach but I didn’t understand the thinking behind the last gameplan. Three guys in the box and your giving two great athletes at RB for PR who both have elite quickness/speed at the HS level all that room to run. Best bet is to just hope for a few turnovers and score as much as you can

  548. D10 says:

    I wouldn’t count out Erie High just yet. Only team that has stopped them their offense this year was Prep and that’s one of the best teams in the state. Any insight on BV v TJ II and SF v Montour II tonight? Or are we expecting a rematch between CP and TJ this year?

  549. sausmann9 says:

    A big shout out to my two underdog D10 teams who will stun everyone with upsets;

    Greenville 14 Sharpsville 13

    Sharon 21 Mercy 20

  550. Jeff says:

    @D10 – Didn’t see your post until now but I was pretty confident TJ would win the rematch last night, but didn’t think they would shut them out. Also thought Montour had a shot in their rematch against SF but to come from 2 TD’s down and outscore them 22-0 in the 4th quarter was pretty impressive.

    I do think TJ will win next week to set up a meeting with CP for the third year in a row. TJ as usual is very solid overall and has a very good defense but they are not on CP’s level, I would expect CP to beat them by 3 scores like they did last year.

  551. B says:

    Is there any information or does anyone have any idea if the games that will be played at mansion park in Altoona for the Thanksgiving weekend if Nov 24-25? They usually host several playoff games and I will be in the area and was wondering if any are worth going to

  552. Billy Splain says:

    @ B…more thank likely yes. nothing scheduled yet though…but the D6 title games will be there on saturday for sure

  553. phillyboy says:

    Wow, State College crushed a pretty good Erie team 48-12. Maybe that dude that was talking smack about them isn’t too far off. If they meet, Pine Richland could test them. Could this be like Duke upsetting UNLV back in the day??

  554. phillyboy says:

    Meant to say PR could BE tested.

    Also, regarding that Delaware Valley team must confess I never heard of them. Where exactly is that located? I’m pretty sure there’s a Delaware Valley in South Jersey by the Delaware River that has a really good wrestling program, but never heard of the PA variety.

  555. LHACfan says:

    AA and AAA title games will be played this weekend at Mansion. A title game should be there the following weekend, the 24/25 weekend.

  556. Jeff says:

    @ B – If State College beats Delaware Valley they could play PR at Mansion Park Thanksgiving weekend, that would definitely be a game worth seeing, would expect the 4A and 5A playoffs to be in Western PA with ECP and Grove City (assuming they beat Hollidaysburg) taking on the WPIAL winners.

    The following weekend there will likely be more games at Mansion Park, as the winners of next week games will meet the District 3 champs, which will likely be Cumberland Valley in 6A, Harrisburg in 5A and either Berks Catholic/Bishop McDevitt in 4A, expect at least one of those games and perhaps 2 to be played at Mansion the first weekend in December.

  557. SCLions says:

    Delaware Valley is from Milford, next to the PA/NJ border (think Poconos). They’ve had some good teams the past several years. State College did scrimmage them in 2014 or 2015 but they haven’t meant outside of that. Should be a good game, they (DV) are undefeated.

  558. Jeff says:

    @ phillyboy – SC is very good, if they get past Delaware Valley this week they will test PR but I don’t think they will beat them. SC played Harrisburg tougher than anyone else this year, that game was actually tied 21-21 in the 3rd quarter before Harrisburg pulled away for a 51-28 victory.

    IMO SC is the only team capable of upsetting PR before the state final, they have a very good offense and expect they would score 4-5 TD’s against PR, the problem is I don’t think their defense will stop PR consistently (no D has yet) and PR will score 6-7 TD’s, expect the game to be a high scoring affair, something like 49-35 for PR.

    Neither PCC nor Cumberland Valley (or whomever else wins D3) have an offense capable of scoring enough points to keep up with PR, that’s why I think SC is the only team that has a chance to upset them prior to the state final.

  559. B says:

    Thank you for the info provided, I live in Florida and watch a ton of football down here but still go back to my roots and love the PA football and style of football. I am a D6 guy so when I’m in town with was 4 Friday nights this year 3 were spent at D6 games one was PR because I wanted to see future ND recruit. I think Altoona getting out of the The WHIPL will benefit them from future ass whoppings until they can start to actually know what winnning feels like and maybe build some confidence by starting with an easier schedule and slowly building the program. It’s sad Altoona used to be decent now they are just bad. And Bellwood-Antis always having a great regular season then losing because the mid penn schedule they play is extremely weak. BG stepped up years ago to play in a brutal league for a 1A and thrived since, Bellwood used to regularly beat BG up until 4 years ago. Anyways would really enjoy seeing Dunmore vs Ligonier Valley assuming both win hope it’s in Mansion Park

  560. Billy Splain says:

    B, Bellwood plays in the ICC, not Mid Penn….likely see state college or someone on saturday at mansion probably vs PR and the D6 title game on friday..Liggy/dunmore likely at bald eagle again

  561. Ernie Frome Erie says:

    I was very surprised when Sharon took down Mercyhurst. Sharon and the south were down this year and MPS coach and fans had everyone up here thinking they could rival ECP. They fought hard, had a chance to tie it but ran a jet sweep into the boundary on the last play that got stuffed.

  562. RamsFan says:

    FYI, I believe this year the game between the 6A WPIAL winner and the SC/DV winner will be played in D7, not Altoona. Likely places would include NA, Norwin, Ambridge.

  563. jack1234 says:

    Scoring 4-5 TD’s on PR’s defense isn’t going to be easy, PR defense has been very good this year. BTW suppoesdly falcone’s injury wasn’t as bad as they thought and I hear there’s a good chance he’s playing this saturday in the wpial final. Regardless, PR’s number 2 guy had 260 yards and 4 TD’s (against NA btw, arguably the second best team in the WPIAL), and jurkovec broke the wpial record for most offense by a single player in a playoff game. Only two incompleitions he had were drops. Only time their offense has been stopped is by themselves (penalties, mistakes). If they are playing this hot without their top reciever, then it seems like the state championship is theirs to lose.

  564. Jeff says:

    @jack1234 – I don’t disagree with anything you said, I merely pointed out SC has the best chance to pull a major upset, and I don’t think they have much of a chance. Their offense is better than Mt Lebo, certainly more balanced, and I do think they are going to score some on PR, but they’re not going to contain PR’s offense, obviously no one has. I think SC is as good or better than NA, I know they run a different type of offense, but I do think they will put up 28 on PR, could see it ending something like 49-28.

    I agree PCC has no chance this week, could get ugly early, and D3 seems to be down this year at 6A, PR will easily handle Cumberland Valley or whoever else wins the D3 title.

  565. Danny says:


    I’m not sure that I buy that the south was down in D10 this year. Hickory was down. Greenville, Sharpsville, Grove City, Sharon are all very tough. I was at the Sharon-MP game, Sharon won because they were more physical on defense and got after MP’s QB. They will roll Karns City in their next game.

  566. SCLions says:

    you may be right. Last year SC fell to Williamsport. Williamsport then played PCC at Mansion Park Altoona. SC played PCC at Fox Chapel in 2015 and played PR at Mansion Park Altoona in 2014.

  567. Drew says:


    I was disappointed in the outcome of that MP/Sharon game. Was expecting to see MP beyond D10. Anyone outside of MP coaches and fans know the reality that they are not on the same level as CP, not close. Not yet. Can’t blame them for having confidence in their program though. All it take is one good season to springboard you to better things. 2018 will be an interesting year for them.

  568. Ernie from Erie says:

    Thanks for the input guys. I was referring to 3A not all of D10 south, my mistake. I don’t see MP EEEEEEVER being on the same playing field as CP. Ever.

  569. RamsFan says:

    Weather looks to be dreadful for game on Saturday. May not head down and just watch on TV. Rain could put a crimp in P-R’s offense.TO’s make for upsets. I guess in PCC’s too. But P-R has shown that they can effectively run the ball too. A little worried about this one now.

  570. Southern D10 says:

    That’s the thing, all of the 3A teams in the south are paired with the 2A teams. Of the 12 teams in Mercer County,9 are in one region. 7 of those 9 were playoff teams. That type of schedule Sharon played toughened them up a lot.

    Sharon’s three losses came to 3 very good teams. Wilmington and Greenville, who play in the 2A D10 title this week, and IMO whoever wins both are good enough to get to the western final and possibly even Hershey as well. Their other loss came to undefeated South Range,OH. Who is in the state quarterfinals over there.

    So imo, that strength of schedule alone toughened them up enough to get past MP

  571. Jeff says:

    @RamsFan – are you seriously worried about PCC this week? I don’t think the game will be close even if it’s played in a downpour and windy. PR has way too many weapons for PCC to contain, regardless of the weather, and PCC’s offense is not capable of scoring enough to keep up. The only way it’s close is if PCC scores a couple of defensive or special teams touchdowns, and even if they do I still think PR will win by a fairly comfortable margin.

  572. WPIAL Rules says:

    @RamsFan…. As much as I support and hope PCC wins, this could be PR’s year to win state. But like PCC was this year, next year will be PR’s rebuilding year.

  573. Southern D10 says:

    New Piaa classification parameters were released today. In football:

    1A 1-131
    2A 132-198
    3A 199-272
    4A 273-384
    5A 385-560
    6A 561+

    Heard that D10 will release the school enrollment #’s on Friday.
    Nothing official yet, but these new numbers could bump Cathedral Prep up to 5A and all the current 5As will stay at 4A where they should have been last cycle.

  574. RamsFan says:

    @Jeff @WPIAL Rules

    Haha. THanks. Maybe I’m just looking for reasons to worry. I do think that NA was the next best team in 6A and had the kind of offense to press P-R. But you are correct, outside of multiple flukely things happening or kids playing A LOT worse or better, it does seem like P-R’s year to make a deep run.

  575. Jack1234 says:

    It was frigid and in sub 20s against NA and PR had their best passing game all season. They are very balanced on offense rn they do both running and passing very very well. Rain is different but I don’t think the weather can stop PR from putting up 40+. Plus, pcc has been without Khalil Weathers their top player on both sides of ball. PR should roll. It’ll be interesting what PCC does on defense this time, last meeting they ran a three man front and pr ran it down their throats.

  576. Ernie from Erie says:

    Southern D10, rumor has it Prep wants to be 5A no matter what, even though I’m pretty sure they’ll still be under the 384. Not sure if the powers that be will let that happen. It’s not really the coaches choice either, but we’ll see tomorrow!

  577. D10 Fan says:

    @ Southern D10

    CPs enrollment is down slightly. I wouldnt be surprised if they are in the 370-380 range. I think CP would prefer their numbers to be up so they can qualify for 5A but I feel the administration will play in the class their numbers indicate. The next cycle will be intriguing for CP and how Erie High affects their enrollment.

  578. Ernie from Erie says:

    Can’t blame them for playing in the class they’re supposed to play in. But I agree. I’m sure the members of the football program wouldn’t mind 5A but they’ll play where they play and not complain.

  579. Jacob C says:

    I am a District 2 fan from the East. I was looking at enrollment because its changing and saw Aliquippa plays in AAA with A numbers. What is the reasoning for that? Just to compete against better teams?

    Just curious because we don’t see many teams opt to play up from our area.

  580. No Horse says:


    Del Val hasn’t played anyone that’s very good all season. Given their schedule there is no telling exactly how good they are. Personally, I think SC is going to beat them pretty easily, but that game is the biggest mystery in the playoffs as far as I’m concerned.

  581. Southern D10 says:

    Wouldn’t be surprised if they do stay at 4A. Saw on twitter that D10’s total enrollment of all its schools, is down about 1000 students from the last cycle two years ago.
    As I said earlier it’s not official till Friday but I’ve already heard that atleast five schools in D10 are dropping in classification

  582. Jeff says:

    @ Jacob C – Aliquippa has been playing up in class for decades, they’ve been 1A for enrollment for many years, when there were 4 classes they played up at 2A. One of the reasons is all their rivals in Beaver County are bigger than they are (i.e. Beaver Falls, Beaver, Hopewell, the new Central Valley district, etc.), so they play up to be in the same conference with their rivals. One of the things different in the WPIAL than other parts of the state is all conferences contain teams in the same classification, there are no teams from different classifications in the same conference at any level, so if they didn’t play up they couldn’t play all their rivals in a given year because they would be in a different conference.

    By the way the conference they play in is one of the best in the state, and probably the best in terms of smaller schools. Beaver Falls won the state title at 3A last year, and they didn’t even make the playoffs this year, Aliquippa plays Quaker Valley for the WPIAL title tomorrow, and QV is in that conference as well and their only loss this year was to Aliquippa 22-7…at one point this year the conference had 4 times ranked in the top 10 in 3A in many state polls.

  583. Jeff says:

    @ No Horse – completely agree with everything you said about the Del Valley vs. SC game this week. Del Valley is the mystery team left in 6A, this is the round last year where SC lost to Williamsport, but I would be very surprised if they lost tonight.

  584. M says:

    Schools have until December 6 to move up if they choose to.

  585. Billy Splain says:

    Changes for west teams listed

  586. MikeS says:

    PIAA needs to adopt an enrollment multiplier for private schools like many states do. in Alabama, it’s a 1.35 multiplier.

  587. Eric Weiser says:

    Don’t look now….Governor Mifflin 21 Hburg 14..middle of 3rd..Mifflin 1st down at Hburg 32!

  588. Eric Weiser says:

    Shot heard round Pa..Mifflin 26-14 over Hburg,under a min.,GM taking a knee!!!

  589. LHACfan says:

    Eye test. I’ve seen both play. Plus, Central at 3 losses is still a darned good team, factor in that it was a huge rivalry game. I will also add that Centrals 3 losses came to an incredible Chestnut Ridge team that is taking down all comers, including the 4A Bellefonte team that is making history who’s only loss came to that Ridge team. Bellefonte, who again, is VERY good 4A team and a 5A Hollidaysburg team. It will wash itself out in a couple weeks. If they play each other, it’ll be a great game. But Forest Hills could end up playing that same Central team.

    maybe time for a visit to the optometrist? Looks like Forest Hills was the better team.

  590. Billy Splain says:

    I’m sorry, what was the score? they won by a td. we had them ranked near each other. I don’t get the internet hate. But, insulting coaches on our forum isn’t tolerated as you can…or can’t..see

  591. LHACfan says:

    Forest Hills finished with distinct advantages in total yards (415-247), rushing yards (172-119), passing yards (243-128) & 1st downs (19-8)

  592. Billy Splain says:

    stats mean very little to me. Some of the best teams in the state have low stats. FH won, I don’t mind. they were in my top ten.

  593. Drew says:

    Why is there so much outrage that TJ has to play in Erie on Friday? D10 & WPIAL have only rotated sites for a few decades now. Last year CP played right in TJs back yard. Trying to avoid talking about the actual matchup?

  594. Billy Splain says:

    being from Berwick, nobody there cared. We just said “who’s Driving?”

  595. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Drew-Where is the outrage? I’m not seeing it?

  596. Drew says:

    Not in this forum…on Twitter.

  597. JC says:

    @MikeS – I like the idea of a multiplier. Even something as low as 1.2 would be effective.

  598. WPIAL Rules says:

    Well it appears that there could be some changes coming to PCC! I personally see it as a change for the positive!

  599. Billy Splain says:

    What ya hearing

  600. jack1234 says:

    @wpial rules are they finally going to find an offensive coordinator? you and the rest of the pcc faithful gotta be livid of the performance saturday, and all season really.

  601. RamsFan says:

    Totten retiring, DC to HC and OC quits.

  602. RamsFan says:

    That was just speculation!

  603. B. Powell says:

    Has Steel Valley been winning all these games the past few years with 18-23 man roster? Their Maxpreps page says (18) kids and last year they mercy-ruled EVERYONE with (23) kids? Or are there more kids playing and not showing on the roster?
    Wow, their conditioning coach must know what he’s doing and they must have some stars.

  604. B. Powell says:

    To the guys who want the private school enrollment “X” multiplier figured in — there may be some schools where this has no effect to what you’re actually wanting.
    But at least that’s less harsh than making them all to play up (1) full class for -being a private school?
    I actually think the public PIAA schools are doing amazingly well, considering everything and they are doing alright in Ohio, OHSSA too.

  605. Jeff says:

    @Drew – I don’t follow twitter, but doesn’t surprise me if some TJ fans are whining because they are notorious for that, led by their head coach. In an ideal world this game would be played at Slippery Rock or Grove City every year, but as you mentioned D10 and D7 have been alternating sites for the playoff games for at least the last 2 decades, not a perfect system but it is what it is, strap em up and play and quit complaining.

    Regarding the game itself, I have thought all year that ECP is better than last year, and TJ not quite as good, so I expected ECP to win by 3 scores, and I have stated as much on this board in the past.

    However, after watching TJ’s defense completely shut down Belle Vernon (saw that game in person at Baldwin a few weeks ago) and again on Saturday against Montour I think this game is going to be closer than I thought. I still expect ECP to win, but I don’t think they will put up too many points on TJ’s defense, also don’t think TJ is going to score too many points, I see this game as something like 21-10.

    If TJ is still hanging around and within a score in the 2nd half anything can happen, so I wouldn’t be too overconfident if I were Prep, just ask Harrisburg!!

  606. Jeff says:

    After reading about SC’s struggles with Delaware Valley I don’t think they have much of a chance to upset PR, expect PR win by at least 3 TD’s and by at least that many next week against the D3 winner and cruise to the state final.

    No question SJP has a much tougher road to Hershey with Parkland this week and most likely Coatesville next week, still expect SJP to make the final but would not be shocked if they got beat, whereas I would be shocked if PR loses.

    Then again I doubt too many people outside of the Governor Mifflin faithful expected Harrisburg to lose last week, I thought they were on cruise control to the final, and appears they thought the same thing.

  607. RamsFan says:

    I would think that SC will come ready to play. Whether they can slow down P-R’s offense or score 3 or 4 times on P-R’s defense is questionable. P-R has to continue to stay away from turnovers on offense and big plays on defense. They got lucky twice on two fumbles that they recovered themselves. Defense looked very good. With that being said, play calling by PCC was awful. Its almost like they weren’t trying to win, just not get mercy ruled.

    Jurkovec is special and he has SO many weapons. Not counting him, they have 7 skill players that seems to know exactly what their role is and fill that role well. They run and block and catch short and deep. Its really fun to watch. All seniors. That means something for sure.

    Defense is a huge improvement too. They are good. Even though PCC’s line was bigger, P-R’s defense stoned them up the middle. I think the stat I read in the paper was 75 yards until they last drive where PCC left their starters in against P-R’s backups.

    Hope they can finish this now.

  608. Drew says:

    Logistically those sites make sense. However, the PIAA is about money and they think rotating gives them a better chance for a bigger crowd because only 1 team will have to travel instead of 2.

    As for the game itself, I agree TJs defense is impressive but it’s impressive every year. I think CP can score in the 30-35 range, Mischler, Roberts, & Odekoven is a trio unrivaled by anyone TJ has seen. I’m not sure CP will run all that effectively but they might not have to. It will all come down to whether or not TJs dline can pressure Mischler. If they can’t, it’ll be a looooong night. Also, CP might get Fessler back from injury this week and that will only add to TJs worries defending CPs passing attack.

  609. Billy Splain says:

    Drew, The whole “piaa is about the money” statement is a myth. The PIAA is not some money garnering entity in Chambersburg that seeks cash for their coffers,there are 17 administrative people there that manage and moderate. The 12 districts run the PIAA, those in chambersburg such as Bob Lombardi have no vote, get paid by the districts, have zero say in any rules or decisions. That stuff is left up to the district reps. That said, you are correct in that there is a better chance of a home district traveling, but in the end not much money is brought in during playoff games. Rental for the stadium, security, paying game managers and such eats the gate receipts up. The hope is the game breaks even or makes just a bit.

  610. MikeS says:

    Regarding the issue of competitive balance between public and private schools, I believe 6 – 8 states use an enrollment multiplier, others force a move up a classification based upon a certain standard for measuring success, and others have separate divisions or even if they play in regular season, separate playoffs. About 1/2 the states have not addressed the issue.

  611. Ernie from Erie says:

    TJ and CP have developed into a little bit of a rivalry. They have had 2 good ball games the last two years, I’m not expecting this year to be any different. The first was 28-21 and last year was by 2 scores, it’s more even than fans think. One thing is obvious though, these two teams do not like each other, and anything can happen in the playoffs. I like CP in a close one, a very close one.

    Berks and McDevitt is another intriguing matchup. Whatever is said about TJs defense is nothing compared to what is said about BC defense. Similar situation though where BC hasn’t seen an offense like McDevitts. McDs QB Diehl leads them to a 28-24 victory setting up a CP v McDevitt semifinal, which history has shown to be a great game.

  612. WPIAL Rules says:

    @ RamsFan – PCC topic you are about 66% correct. The DC will not become HC. Most of the alumni do not want to see that. There is a new AD in place and I am sure that there will be more recommendations coming.
    @Jack1234 – the play calling has been horrible for the last 5 to 6 years! 3rd and 15 with a young line and you try to run it up the middle. Fisher can throw. He didn’t have much time in the pocket this year like the past 2, but the kid can throw. They practiced trick plays for 2 weeks and never used any of them.
    Why do you think they lost a former Pro QB as coach? Because the OC pushed him out.
    PR should make it to states! I have not watched much of the SJP tape. So I will hold back my pick for state champs of the 6A until I see more. But I think that PR will make this a great game with SJP or Parkland.

  613. D10 Fan says:

    @Drew @Jeff

    TJ always comes out of the WPIAL playoffs with ridiculous defensive stats. While what they’ve done this year is very impressive but i dont see much of a difference from this years defense and the past few TJ teams. I’d be surprised if CP doesnt move the ball well. That being said, TJ is still a very tough team and they have the type of gameplan that could keep them in the game. Ground & pound on offense to play keep away from CPs offense & do just enough on defense to slow down CPs offense. CP better have learned from Harrisburg’s upset last weekend because TJ is the type of team that can sneak up on you and steal one. Do i think they will? No. But no one thought Gov Mifflin would beat Harrisburg.

  614. Ernie from Erie says:

    Agreed D10 fan, one things for sure. Win or lose TJs coach will have some fun quotes after the game. He said in an interview after winning WPIAL “now we have to go up and play the all star team, I mean Erie Prep” He sure does play the role of underdog well, coming into this game winning 32 of their last 35 games.

    The issue with the sites only matters to some. Erie to Pittsburgh and vice versa isn’t bad when you flip them every year. This works here because whether it be McDowell, Prep, or Strong Vincent from Erie or TJ, West A, or PCC from Pittsburgh both followings travel well. Hell, Prep brought 4 student busses to a game back in 2012!

  615. Jeff says:

    @D10 Fan – agree with everything you said although I do think TJ’s defense this year is slightly better than the past 2 years, not only are they shutting teams out they are completely shutting down their offense. They obviously have not seen an offense in the WPIAL anywhere near as good as ECP, so they will get their points, but I can see TJ keeping them out of the end zone on occasion and forcing some field goal attempts. If ECP scores 30+ they win comfortably, if TJ can keep them to 3 TD’s and a field goal or 2 they have a chance to be in the game in the fourth quarter.

    I was at the game last year and did a write up for Billy on this site, that game was closer than the final score of 30-13, TJ dropped 5-6 very catchable passes that would have made the game a lot more interesting in the 4th quarter.

    The other thing that sticks out about that game were the big plays, TJ needs to limit the big plays on offense to have a chance, which is easier said than done against ECP’s offense.

  616. RamsFan says:

    @WPIAL Rules I think not promoting the DC to HC is a good idea. Great DC but not HC material. HC leaves and OC leaves too?? Totten was a good HC and represented Central well. That will be a great job for someone. Are you implying Gus Frerotte may be coming back?

  617. JC says:

    @ B Powell – That was the idea. Forcing a full increase in class is not quite as desirable, as the class ranges shift in size. A numerical multiplier would still shift teams up in ways that better reflect the player pools than a straight enrollment number, but also wouldn’t be too punishing to schools. In addition, the multiplying number can be shifted as needed. I see this as a pretty decent plan overall.

  618. Jeff says:

    It’s too bad Grove City was upset by Hollidaysburg, I was looking forward to seeing how they matched up with the WPIAL champion, I doubt they would have won but think it would have been a pretty competitive game. I do think Gateway will beat Hollidaysburg this week and has a shot against the D3 champion now that Harrisburg has been eliminated, but I don’t see any team left in the tournament in 5A that can hang with and beat Wood.

  619. me888 says:

    Jeff says:
    November 22nd, 2017 at 10:54 am

    “I was at the game last year and did a write up for Billy on this site, that game was closer than the final score of 30-13, TJ dropped 5-6 very catchable passes that would have made the game a lot more interesting in the 4th quarter.”

    me was at the ECP v TJ game in Erie 2 years ago, and will tell you the same is true for that one. TJ had every opportunity to win by midway through the 3rd quarter, and just didn’t make the plays you’d have expected. Penalties, dropped passes, etc…allowed Prep to finish them off. Cherpak’s comments about ALL STAR teams should be saved for Jan through Aug interviews. They had every chance to win and just fell flat. The 2 teams haven’t been that far apart talent wise in recent years. It’s more of an attitude thing. Prep believes they’ll find a way. TJ is pounded into believing the system is so unfair, and that they’ve no chance going into the game. Maybe they think playing the underdog publicly gives them something to rally ’round. me thinks it just creates bad ju’ju’, period!

    In short, save the “Oh, whoa is me!” stuff ’till the off season PIAA meetings. No pregame/postgame interview should be addressing the topic then. The rules of the game (right or wrong) were established before the season. If you’re fundamentally opposed to them, then opt out. Once you choose to play, you’ve officially accepted the terms of the arrangement. This isn’t about whether me believes the system is right or wrong, just about the implied rules of engagement once you’ve chosen to compete.

    JMO, as always!

  620. Billy Splain says:

    Yeah Jeff where’s ya disappear to?

  621. D10 Fan says:

    I completely agree with what you guys said about the previous 2 matchups. I was at both as well and despite what the public school supporters will want you to believe, both matchups could have gone either way. I’m looking forward to attending on Friday and hope to have a great game to comment on afterwards!

    I would love the magical ability to be at 2 places at once so i can attend the Bishop McDevitt/Berks Catholic game as well.

  622. Billy Splain says:

    D10 fan, I don’t buy into the Cath/prvt debate at all…I’ve seen many teams fall flat against them on their own..are there some problems? yes, but very few

  623. Ernie from Erie says:

    Correct me if I’m wrong, but it seems like they’re more public than private schools in each classes Elite 8:

    6A – St Joes
    5A – Wood
    4A – CP, Berks, McDevitt, Beca and Tep
    3A – Scranton Prep and Conwell Egan
    2A – none
    1A – BG and Imani

    Not sure if all of these are considered Private but I know most are. 38 public schools are in the final 8 in football. Let’s take it easy on Private v Public.

  624. Pcc64 says:

    WPIAL Rules is this accurate about Totten retiring. Haven’t heard anything about this, only wishful thinking and speculation.

  625. Billy Splain says:

    PCC64, it is not.

  626. SClions says:

    SC vs PR. My take. They played like 3 years ago at mansion park. SC offense was one dimensional give ball to mischer. That was about all they did and they went down. This year they have more offensive weapons. So I think they’ll put up a few points but it lies on their qb. If Friberg (their qb) has a game like he did against DV (4 picks) they’ll go down fast to PR. I think SC defense back then was better than this year. Plus bus ride to hempfield for 1pm game on Saturday will be a big factor as well. I see PR winning then taking care of CV which will probably win their game. Again, just my take.

  627. Billy Splain says:

    SClions…all those picks weren’t just Friberg…some were incorrect routes, some were bad play calls from the coaches….combined with excellent play reads from the DV defense

  628. SC says:

    Multiplier benefits every class but 6A..

  629. WPIAL Rules says:

    @PCC64 There is a new AD in town and I am sure that he will be making changes! OC needs to go. His play calling is horrific!


  630. Pcc64 says:

    You may be right about the OC. The new AD is the current DB coach so I’m not sure how that will factor into his plans.

  631. Eric Weiser says:

    BC dominates McDevitt

    Lutz,RB,over 200 yds and 3 rushing around 400
    28-9 @ half..45-17 with 3 m left..45-24

    BC D..2 to’s,5 sacks and held McD star receiver(52-1121-17tds)to zero catches..should be an interinteresting game next week

  632. Eric Weiser says:

    One other small tidbit about the Berks Catholic O….have outscored their opponents 418-10 in the first half.Before MCD knew what hit them,4 possessions into the game,BC had 28pts

  633. B says:

    BG is in trouble might lose winning streak 7-7 in fourth homer center about to score

  634. Jeff says:

    @ Billy – I’ve been posting on this board regularly all season long. Went to every Woodland Hills game until they were eliminated, then went to TJ-Belle Vernon a couple of weeks ago and PT-Gateway at Heinz last Saturday and heading to Hempfield this afternoon to check out PR vs. SC. May be available next weekend to do a write-up if you need a game covered just let me know.

  635. Billy Splain says:

    Jeff…i know you’ve been posting…was more of a Hey man! I’ve said before, anyone that would like to write for us is more than welcome!

  636. Jeff says:

    So much for TJ, guess the lesson there is to go with my first instincts. All season long I thought ECP was better than last year and TJ not as good and ECP was 3 scores better than TJ, then I watched TJ totally shut down an undefeated and pretty good Belle Vernon team a few weeks ago and thought their defense might have a chance to slow down Preps offense, but based on the final score looks like I was wrong.

    Berks Catholic handled a good Bishop McDevitt team yesterday a lot easier than just about everyone expected and I do think that will be a very good game next week, if they play at Somerset again like last year I may make the trip to check it out because it’s only an hour drive for me.

    I think the four best teams are left in 4A, which I don’t think is true of any other classification. Both games are rematches of the semi-finals last year, can Berks or Bethlehem Catholic stop the grudge match between ECP and Imhotep?

  637. Jeff says:

    2nd big upset in as many weeks with BG falling last night to Homer-Center, last week of course was the Harrisburg shocker. 1A is now wide open, and I think Farrell vs. the WPIAL winner is a game that could go either way.

    Really hope Wilmington and Sharon win today so we have D10 vs. the WPIAL next week in all 3 of the lower classes, would be cool if D10 and the WPIAL fill all 6 of the Western spots in Hershey.

  638. D10 Fan says:

    TJ didn’t have an answer for Mischler’s running ability last night. Looks like they were selling out on the straight zone run but once (coach) Mischler threw the zone read at them it opened up more space in the running game. CP also showed a few more plays and switched Roberts & Odekoven to the same side on a few formations & lined up Roberts at RB for one play. Little wrinkles like that make it that much more difficult to defend them. I’m sure they’ll unleash a few more wrinkles next week vs Berks.

    Also, in typical Cherpak fashion he whined about how unfair it was blah blah blah. Maybe he should check out the score of that HC/BG game. And maybe he should program his time machine to this century so he can run an offense other than power-I. He has some tough kids who were getting banged up all game. You could clearly see that a few of them were gutting it out. Kudos to the players. They deserve more than a whine-fest in the newspaper.

  639. Bill Hitchcock says:

    @ Ernie from Erie,

    There certainly are more public schools in than private. The problem is….which teams win the state titles? Nobody is beating st joes prep. Pine Richland can score but Prep is too physical. Archbishop Wood walks to the state title. Cathedral Prep/Berks Catholic probably win states…if not I consider Imhotep private (charter is private)…cuz they draw.
    3A and under okay….but in the large school it’s forgone conclusion.

  640. Jack1234 says:

    PR beats state college 49-21. Hs football guru is all quiet LOL. Number 15 on state college the penn st pwo was going off and gave PR a scare (tied 14-14 at half) but PR made adjustments at half on O and D (biggest adjustment was putting Kenny White on number 15, which resulted in a INT by white on the first pass to him after that). Jurkovec is having a post season for ages if anyone has seen the stats so far.

    @bill Hitchcock PR is a very physical team; prep isn’t going to “out physical” them per say. They do however have a defense capable of slowing down PR and forcing them to play perfect on offense. If PR makes mistakes like they did today (fumbles, miscues etc) then Prep likely wins. I don’t think preps offense can keep up with them in a shootout; I’ve watched film and their line is young and they don’t have the type of explosive players they did for last years team or the 2014 team. When these two teams likely play it will be an insant classic.

  641. Jeff says:

    Saw PR today for the first time and in talking to a lot of the parents they played their worst game of the year, certainly their worst half, but still won by 4 TD’s.

    Game was tied 14-14 at half, with turnovers and penalties hurting PR, blocked punt led to first SC score, then SC stopped them at the 1 yd line and went on 99 yard drive, PR fumbled the ensuing kickoff but PR was able to stop SC from doing any more damage and score tied at half.

    SC inexplicably tried onside kick to start 2nd half, based on the way the first half went no way I try that there if I’m the SC coach, too much risk at that point of the game. Gave PR ball at their own 47, 3 plays and 30 seconds later it was 21-14, subsequent int by Kenny White and TD pass by Jurkovec and before people had settled into their seats it was 28-14 barley a minute into 2nd half. PR unstoppable in 2nd half as they scored on 5 straight possessions, SC did manage to make it 35-21 after the initial onslaught but PR tacked on 2 more TD’s.

    If they play like they did in the first half against SJP they will lose, if they play like they did in the 2nd half they have a chance. If they turn it over 3 times and are as sloppy as they were today they’re in trouble IMO. Jurkovec was off a bit, especially in the first half, was low on some throws and missed open receivers, needs to be sharper against SJP. Maybe I’m nitpicking, I’m sure the PR faithful like Jack will chime in, but I saw a few things today that would concern me in 2 weeks against SJP if I’m a PR fan.

  642. Jeff says:

    @D10 – couldn’t agree with you more about Cherpak, he’s not doing his kids any favors by whining about the “unfair” advantage the private schools have. Back in the day when WH was a powerhouse we didn’t bitch about Central Catholic we went out and kicked their butts, have very fond memories of Steve Breaston running wild at Heinz Field in 2001 against PCC.

    His power offense/good defense works well in the WPIAL at 4A, but have to be able to throw the ball to beat the better teams across the state like ECP and Imhotep, and he’s too stubborn to adapt since he keeps dominating in the WPIAL.

    His schtict is certainly wearing thin and someone close to him needs to tell him to give it a rest.

  643. Mcd65 says:

    Is Pine Richland the most dominate team in Western Pa. large school divisions in the last 10 years ? They have just blown out every team they faced this year. Very impressive on both Offense and defense .

  644. Ernie from Erie says:

    Bill, I don’t care how many public schools are in PA I’m stating that public school football programs are doing just fine in the playoffs. Actually to the tune of 16-8 right now in the semi finals.

    Jeff, agree on all accounts about Cherpak and his Pittsburgh mindset.

    McD65, no I don’t think PR is the most dominant big school team over the last 10 years. They had a very similar team last year and PCC knocked them around, so no. Also I know it’s 7 on 7, but you could definitely see they would have had some trouble with the Ramblers this year. Add the line, I’m taking CP but we’ll never no. I like the question though, but I’ve seen better. Jurk is definitely the real deal though. Would have been fun to watch him and Bauer (CP, ND recruit) go at.

  645. SCLions says:

    PR did play a sloppy first half. That onside kick by SC to start second half, I thought that was a bad move if you’re playing PR. You knew PR was going to make adjustments at halftime. After that the flood gates opened. SC played like they had nothing to lose and I think that frustrated PR the first half. PR was just too much that 3rd quarter.

  646. Lee says:

    Cherpak and Palko are whiners, moored to their antiquated offensive schemes. They wail about unfair competition rather than playing some tough teams in Ohio and updating their offenses. West Allegheny lost four years in a row to CP in the four seasons immediately preceding TJ’s three losses in a row to CP. CP plays a majority of its games a hundred miles from home against larger schools.

  647. Jack1234 says:

    LOL PRs team isn’t similar at all to last years. It’s almost a day and night difference in many aspects. And 7on7 doesn’t show anything, I’ve seen 1A schools beat up on a 6A school in 7on7 but if said teams played in an actual game the 6A school would be up by 40 at half. Have you even seen PR play in person this year?

  648. Mcd65 says:

    PR is a dynamic football team . Although I have only watched them in their opener against Wayne I have been reading about them every week, and nobody has competed seriously with them. IMO the final has the makings of a classic assuming of course both PR and St Joe win this week. St Joe demolished a very decent Parkland team and they are the real deal again this year without any super star. I believe their 1 D-1 player simmons has not played at all due to a torn acl.

  649. Ernie from Erie says:

    Well Jeff, glad you can comprehend. I said “I know it’s only 7 on 7” As a football mind you can definitely get something from passing scrimmages by taking a look at how skill guys compare to each other. I know it’s no pads, no line, but I saw their secondary look like little gridders against CP. You can’t honestly think that of you added the linemen PR would mercy ruling CP at half. Go ask PRs coach.

    The Jurk is fantastic, and PR is a great team. But Mischler can shread defenses too, and CP is just as good.

  650. Lee says:

    Mischler’s the second best QB in PA and his dad is probably the best high school football coach in the State. Coach Mischler ended the Central Bucks West dynasty when he was still in his 20s, and rolled the great Woodland Hills teams. CP would likely beat PR at any venue of PR’s choosing. Better receivers, better runners, better lines, better kicking, better coaching. CP’s also used to playing a hundred miles or more from home.

  651. Jeff says:

    @Mcd65 – I would say PR is the best team to come out of the WPIAL in the last 5 yrs, since the NA teams that won 3 WPIAL titles in a row, as well as state titles in 2010/2012, beating Coatesville in the final that year 63-28.

    IMO opinion this year’s PR team is definitely better than the PCC team from last year, as good as that PCC team was on defense I don’t think they would stop this year’s PR offensive machine when they get rolling like they did in the 2nd half against SC on Saturday.

    They need to clean some things up if they want to beat SJP in 2 weeks, and I’m a little concerned how their offensive line will fare against SJP’s defensive front.

    @ Ernie – I think you were responding to Jack, not me, I don’t recall anyone on this board saying PR would mercy rule ECP, that’s just ridiculous. That would be a fun game to watch, I think both teams would put up a lot of points and would expect the game to be a shootout, and the team with the ball last might very well be the winner. Most neutral observers agree the 4 best teams in the state are the 2 PCL teams (SJP & AW) along with PR and ECP.

  652. Jack1234 says:

    @jeff PR didn’t play a good first half I agree. Between fumbles and mental mistakes it kept SC in the game. I thought the staff made some great adjustments at halftime and after that state college didn’t have a chance. Momentum completely shifted. IMO the reason jurkovec was slow and off point in the first half is because state college was getting consistent pressure on him. The offensive line came out in the second half and played the way they have all year which has been very good and kept jurkovec clean, that’s when the offense started clicking and they rolled. I agree if they played like that in the first half sjp will actually captilize and they will be in trouble. But credit must be given when it’s due, state college is a good team and I don’t think anyone expected PR to just roll over them. PR was clearly the better team but I expected a fight from SC like they got.

  653. RamsFan says:

    Lee, how do you figure that? This year, in their only common game with PCC, P-R has a 47-3 lead at half time vs. PCC in game 1. Then a 42-7 blowout in the WPIAL Championship.

    Mischler is a great QB but if he is #2 in the state, the distance between him and the #1 kid is quite large. #15 for PR would be the best player on the field by a significant margin.

    In 2016 with an average at best supporting cast and torn tumb ligaments, Jurkovec went for 300/100 versus PCC. 6 point game in the 4th quarter. So I would never bet against him.

    ECP should go 6A, come to D7 and play in the Northern 7. I would actually like to see P-R play ECP as our week zero game.

  654. Jack1234 says:

    @ernie from erie skill guys look great in 7on7 because the QB isn’t being chased by D linemen and linebackers. If PR played CP it would come down to the 4th quarter IMO. We can all keep dick measuring over a game that’s never happening if we want to choose. Never said they’d mercy rule CP btw.

    @jeff I’d put these PR team slightly above those NA teams, this team is a juggernaut. Not sure anybody has dominated the wpial like they have this year. We will see what they’re final legacy is to be. The offensive line didn’t play great against SC and part has to do with their was an illness going around the locker room and a few linemen were playing sick. Not to make excuses but I think it had an effect on play. Second half however they got it together and jurkoec had plenty of time to throw. They’ve played great all year, theyve ran the ball well and they’ve given jurkovec plenty of time to throw this year. What worries me about SJP is that they’re D line can get pressure without blitzing which is a huge advantage against PR. Teams that blitz against PR get burned but disrupting jurkovec and keeping guys into coverage is a great way to slow PR down. PR’s offensive line play will be key if they end up playing SJP in hershey. I don’t think SJP can consistently score on PR, I think PR defense is good enough to stop them enough times for their offensive to score even if they get slowed down by prep’s great defense.

    On another note how is manheim township? Seems to me like cumberland valley was the favorite and they pulled the upset. Have to assume PR is a heavy favorite heading into this game.

  655. Mcd65 says:

    I know its premature, but I keep thinking about the potential Prep/PR matchup of not only players but coaches. IMO these two coaches are among the finest in the state.Their last matchup was a classic chess match. This will be fun to watch assuming they both get there.

  656. Ernie from Erie says:

    “but if said teams played in an actual game the 6A school would be up by 40 at half” – Jack1234

    You don’t need to sell me that 7 on 7 isn’t real football because I know it isn’t. But it is competition. PR and CP are both great teams with both great players and coaches. I think we all can agree it woulda been a hell of a game. Let’s hope they both advance this week so we can watch them on TV next weekend!

    Speaking of that, what do you guys think about the matchups in the West?

    Jeanette vs Farrell
    WashPa vs Wilmington
    Quaker Valley vs Sharon
    Berks vs Prep
    Gateway vs Manheim Central
    Pine Richland vs Manheim Township

  657. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    ECP or PR next year? ECP does lose a ton to graduation, what about PR?

  658. RamsFan says:

    @Mcd65 That is also what I have been thinking. But if it happens, hope it doesn’t turn into a clunker. Everyone will be disappointed.

  659. phillyboy says:

    Anybody know where the PR – Manheim Twp. game is going to be played this weekend? If it’s in Lancaster County would be tempted to drive out there. Then again got to give props to District 3, they live video stream some of their games like the D3 final this past weekend.

  660. Billy Splain says:


  661. Jack1234 says:

    My example in that quote was comparing a 1A school to a 6A school. I agree it would be a great game and CP is a top notch team indeed. My only question is if they are so good why not pay in 5A? Aren’t they only like 5 boys off the number? IMO looks better for them winning in a higher classification, no doubt they’d compete up there.

    @mcd65 PR returns a decent number of guys next year that started this season and I think they will still be very good but they will obviously take a step back with what they graduate. Doubt PR plays a big name week 0 opponent next year but we will see what coach K does with the team he has next year.

  662. sausmann9 says:

    @ Lee – would love to see what Mischler could do at a public school without the advantages he has up there in Erie. Best coach in Pa??? questionable and your opinion for sure. Take a public school coach that wins perennially and there’s your best coach in the state, you know the ones that go against the recruitment factories, lol.

  663. Friday night fan says:

    Sausmann9 – Tell me the definition of ” Recruiting” ? Do kids go to Cathedral Prep on Athletic scholarship? The answer is absolutely not . Prep is a great school academically, and yes they have great sports programs. Kids and their parents that want to be apart of greatness chose to attend Prep. Most of the football team went to grade and junior high in the Erie Catholic school system. Prep is 9 th thru 12 th grade only and all but maybe 1 or 2 kids were on the freshman team! That’s a fact! Mischler is the top 4 A coach in PA, and what advantages ? They practice everyday just like everyone else! They new when this senior class were freshmen that they were going to be special! But certain people know it all and want to tear down young people’s accomplishment. Jealousy is a terrible thing! Prep and Pinerichland are both great programs lets support both the next two weeks and stop the hate!

  664. Billy Splain says:

    FNF is correct, the names on that team don’t change, nor do the results.

  665. WPIAL Rules says:

    I am ready to make my pick for 6A. SJP will take States this year! PCC will be the best next year! PR will be rebuilding just like PCC this year!

  666. D10 Fan says:

    It looks like the Berks fan base has already made their plans for Hershey. It’s one thing to be confident but it’s a whole different thing to be over-confident. Yes, throttling McDevitt was impressive but McD is no CP. Seems like they forgot that CP was up 3 TDs and controlled the 2nd half of that game last year. That was with Mischler being immobile due to an injury suffered earlier in the game. It wasn’t easy and Berks definitely made things difficult for CP but once CP hit that big play to put them up 28-7 the game was all but over. I hope the players don’t have the same hubris the fans have because they’ll be in for a rude awakening if they do.

  667. Billy Splain says:

    Hi gang…want to give a plug for my nephew Wesley. Played LB for Bloom U. He will graduate with communications degree and he just started a sports blog, check him out:
    follow him on twitter @SPLAIN_IT

  668. TomF says:

    Lee, I would put Mischler as the #2 Coach in the state. Southern Columbia is going for State Championship #7 and will probably have #8 next year. I have seen CB West-Pettine, Berwick-Curry and ECP-Mischler along with Southern Columbia-Roth and Roth is as good as any HS coach in PA history.

  669. River Runner says:

    My two cents on the public vs private debate. Being from the D10 area I have seen CP year in and year out be dominate. They dropped off for a couple of years after Mischler left the first time and went to coach Iroquois. Prep kinda dropped off the radar some. However lets be honest here. Between CP, MP and Villa D10 has see a lot of funny things happen out of the Erie area. Number one if you look at a CP program they list the Catholic Middle School the player went too. Correct me is I am wrong and I might be, anyone can go to Prep who lives in the Erie Catholic Diocese. That is 12 or 13 counties in NWPA. From Erie County to Potter County and as far south as Mercer and Jefferson County. That is an enormous area. Lots of kids could make the choice to go there. On top on the troubled youth they take in on “Academic Scholarship”. I don’t believe for one second that CP hands out “Athletic Scholarships” that would make things way to messy for the PIAA. Just like MP coming under fire earlier this year because two of Fairview’s top football players decided to transfer to MP only to have the transfer deemed athletic in reason. Not to mention from the outside looking in, MP had a transfer from the Chicago area move in before the season. Right now in D10 you have a whole group of teams willing to play up to get away from Prep. The machine that is CP or any Private or Charter School has an advantage. Sometimes its a huge advantage, other times it is slight. Regardless it has become a topic of conversation in all circles of high school athletics at this time. There is a problem of fairness, maybe not with all private or charter schools but with enough of them. This issue isn’t going away now. I think it will a thorn in the PIAA’s side until something is done to correct it.

  670. Jeff says:

    @ Lee – ECP did not “roll” the great WH teams back in their heyday, they played one time in 1999 at Hempfield, I was at the game and it took a very late ECP score to win, the teams on the field that night were very evenly matched, and if they played 10 times I think it would have been 5-5 or maybe 6-4 for ECP. They did not play in 2000 because Mt. Lebanon upset WH in the WPIAL final due to extra point that hit the upright in the last HS game at 3 Rivers Stadium, had they used high school goal posts instead of the pros that kick would have been good and game would have gone to OT and who knows what would have happened.

    No one’s disputing Mischler is a great coach, saying he’s the best in the state is debatable, hard to argue against Infante at SJP or Roth at Southern Columbia to just name 2. As to whether ECP would beat PR this year, I’ve seen both teams and as a neutral observer I would say I could see either team winning, I do think both teams would probably score 40+ in that game.

    The question remains if they are so good why are they playing 4A? And spare me the crap about that’s where their enrollment put them, they were 2 under the number for 5A and should have played up, and likely still would win 5A, although would be interesting to see them match up against Archbishop Wood.

  671. B. Powell says:

    I’d think ECP would stay 4A when, in fact, they just made the cut again by a few students and why not? If they declare 5A for football, immediately, 8-10 other D10 schools shift to 4A to avoid playing them twice in one year.
    I believe Prep is expecting a talent drop-off the next 2 years and staying 4A might be the wise move. Plus, after all, who are they making the classification decision for? Themselves or the other 8-10 schools who want to drop to 4A?
    I believe Prep voting for themselves wins that one. Think about it…”we’ll go to 5A so you can drop to 4A??” I don’t think it will work that way. lol

  672. D10 Fan says:

    CP doesnt need to go to 5A for better competition.
    1. They can schedule tougher competition in the regular season because they have more freedom and resources to do so. The team from Michigan they played this year just won the state title in Michigan’s 2nd biggest classification.
    2. They get tougher competition once outside of D10. WPIAL, District 3 champ, and then Hershey all offer good competition on the 4A level.
    3. Similar to my previous point, they dont care about what other D10 teams do. They have their sights set on the competition at the state-playoff level. Not week 4 vs region 5’s 3rd place team.

  673. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    River Runner-You are wrong. Prep is open to everyone that can afford the tuition and passes the entrance exam, however its not a boarding school. Kids need to commute to the school everyday. I highly doubt there are kid driving 4+ hrs to and from school from Potter County. Prep is made up of kids mainly from Erie County. Sometimes a kid or two from Mercer or Crawford counties.

  674. Jeff says:

    @ D10 Fan & B. Powell – on a statewide level there is better competition at 5A than 4A. The 5A WPIAL winner will typically be better than 4A (Gateway is better than TJ this year), same with District 3 and whoever makes the final from the east. I understand why they are playing 4A and maybe that’s the best place for them, but I for one as a high school football fan think they should be playing in 5A, and it doesn’t have anything to do with all the other schools in D10.

    There was talk last year within the PIAA and on this board about a proposal to force teams like CP that dominate at their level to play up a class, like they do in other states. Assuming CP wins 4A again this year, and they are definitely the favorite to win, that would mean they would play 5A for the next 2 year cycle. That seems like a reasonable proposal to me and a way to help mitigate the obvious advantages a private school like CP has.

  675. Jeff says:

    @ Ernie – glad you brought up the other games a few days ago, with all this talk about CP we’ve kind of lost sight of the actual games. I don’t follow the lower classes as much but I’ve read and seen enough to make some educated guesses, so here goes, along with some thoughts on the eastern games.

    1A Farrell vs. Jeanette – 2 tradition rich programs, think they are fairly evenly matched and will pick Jeanette in a close one, in the east I like Steel-High over Homer Center, who will have a slight letdown after their huge win last week over BG.

    2A Wilmington vs. Wash High – Wash broke 16yr WPIAL title drought, but I like Wilmington to win this game by a TD, although no one is beating Southern Columbia this year and probably not next year either.

    3A Sharon vs. Quaker Valley – I think QV has the defense to slow down and somewhat contain Sharon’s offense, and I think QV will put up plenty of points, they have on every team they played this year with the exception of Aliquippa, so I like QV to end Sharon’s run. Expect Middletown to win to set up a state final against another school from the Beaver Conference.

    4A – Berks Catholic is improved, or so say the D3 guys, but so is CP, and I don’t see how they’ve closed the gap from last year, I think there will be more pointes scored, but like CP by 2 TD’s, I’ll say 35-20. In the east I would pick Beca if they were healthy, but top 2 receivers, one of which is all state, have been out for weeks, they are also both DB’s, so I’ll take Imhotep to win and set up the grudge match with CP.

    5A Gateway vs. Manheim Central – potential to be a very good game, I like Manheim to win something like 34-28. In the east AW will roll against Unionville by 3-4 TD’s and will win in Hershey by about the same margin, no one left in the field who can hang with AW.

    6A RR vs. Manheim Twp – Manheim may hang around for a while like SC did, but they are not any better than SC and perhaps not quite as good, final score may be the same as last week, I’ll say 49-21. In the east I think SJP will handle Coatesville, they have some athletes and will put up some points, but I can see SJP with a defensive and/or special teams TD and SJP wins by 3 TD’s, I’ll say 42-21.

  676. River Runner says:

    @ECL-Metro Fan: You can’t tell me that families in the Prep Organization aren’t willing to host kids. You also can’t tell me they don’t hand out “academic scholarships” or whatever you want to call them. Instead of listing whatever Catholic Middle School they attend or their home church, how about they list their home county or town? Just my two cents.
    I think you will see D10 place CP, McD and Erie high in their on region this year. They will then make another region for the other schools that are 4A but play up. They will force the Erie schools to find games against bigger opponents.

  677. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Jeff-If the PIAA were to force a team like ECP up to the next classification for the 2 year cycle, what happens after they dominate for that 2 year cycle and say win the 5A Championship both years?

  678. Billy Splain says:

    ECL, if they adopt the success factor then they move up again….

  679. B. Powell says:

    Hi River Runner,
    You really think another region is needed?
    We are talking about (2) teams and what to do with them in football. TWO.
    That would be GM and FLB at true 4A teams playing up.
    Granted, the games they played vs ECP, McDowell and Erie were NOT good the past two years but they DO play these teams in nearly every other sport and have been used to it. It’s just taken for granted.
    I think the sportsmanship between the schools hasn’t been bad and GM and FLB have decent facilities worth of 4A+ teams. GM and FLB will just have to work at getting better, but they certainly aren’t crying.
    Most GM and FLB kids probably look forward to playing Prep, Erie and McDowell.
    Don’t they want to play us? lol.
    Sure they do and why not?
    Let me ask you a question…Has Playing FLB hurt Prep in any way the past couple years? No.
    GM and FLB will be fine in the 4A-6A region as is.

  680. Mike says:

    @D10 Fan where exactly did you see that the Berks fan base was making plans for Hershey? ECP is the defending champs and the #1 team in the state. I wouldn’t think there was a need to invent bulletin board material with that pedigree.

    The Reading newspaper and fan base is well aware of which team has a dozen D1 recruits on it, and that many consider ECP the best team in the state this year in any class.

    Luckily, they still make the kids actually play the games, and I expect an entertaining, high scoring affair tomorrow night at Somerset.

  681. Ernie from Erie says:

    Jeff – great insight. I too follow the higher classes and was curious about the lower. I find it interesting D10 could have 4 teams represented at states. That’d be kind of cool.

    River Runner- as stated before CP has plenty of competition in the state playoffs. 28-21 to TJ, a come from behind win against Mcdevitt then they got smoked by Imhotep 40-3. The year before that they lost to CASH in districts. It’s not like they cruised last year at Hershey either. Far from
    domination. Prep also isn’t housing kids from other counties. Your right though D10 will put those 3 together in a region and make em full schedules. Prep should be able to keep Canisius, St Francis, and Benedictine plus McDowell and Erie. They have Central Catholic next year week 1 too so shouldn’t be too bad for them. Hopefully Erie has the same luck.

    I’m taking Prep tomorrow.

  682. Mike f says:

    Any of these semi finals being streamed?

  683. Billy Splain says:

    The only stream I know of is Cathedral Prep/Berks can be found here:

  684. Eric W says:

    D10 Fan,

    Nobody that I know of, here in Berks County(D3) is packing their bags for Hershey? We have respect for EVERY opponent…see Harrisburg,and would never do that crap. I live in Wyo.,went to WWL,and live a mile from GM and Berks Catholic…coaches/players/fans around here know better…having said that,if BC can keep the game in the 20’s,I think they can pull the upset

  685. Billy Splain says:

    Another Stream: Tonight live on the @NFHSNetwork live stream coverage of the @PIAASports Class 5A semifinal. Manheim Central battles Gateway Link:

  686. Jeff says:

    @ECL/Metro Fan – IF ECP would play up in 5A and win 2 more state titles they should play 6A, that’s what a atate like Indiana does. Just like I think Archbishop Wood should be playing up in 6A. Their enrollment for next 2 year cycle is only 4A, but would be shocked if they dropped to 4A, and frankly they should be playing 6A.

    IMO no reason ECP and AW shouldn’t be playing at least 5A and perhaps 6A in the case of AW, ECP of course beat them in 2012 state title game, so don’t tell me ECP can’t compete and beat the best 5A and perhaps even 6A teams, maybe not every year, but certainly this years team could compete and perhaps beat any team in PA.

    Being from Pittsburgh I don’t have any information at all on the ECP program, just the view of an outsider, but I have a feeling if you asked the players and coaches a majority of them, and maybe a large majority, would favor playing up, I played HS sports many years ago, and I know as a 17 and 18 yr old I wanted to take on the best competition, and think many of the kids at ECP probably feel the same way.

    I have a ton of respect for the ECP program and coach Mischler, one of the elite programs in the state, and as such I think they should be playing at least 5A. Just my opinion, many of the ECP faithful will disagree and that’s ok.

  687. Mike f says:

    Thanks Billy

  688. Eric W says:

    Berks Catholic,pretty impressive opening drive…9 1\2m,7 first downs…7-0

  689. Jeff says:

    Very good game at Somerset tonight as Berks Catholic went toe to toe with ECP, entertaining first half with teams trading touchdowns, Berks started with clock chewing drive taking 9+ minutes off the clock to take a 7-0 lead, tied at 14 before BC fumble in their own territory, but then 2 plays later an interception gave them the ball back near midfield, marched methodically down the field to take 21-14 lead, but left a minute and half on the clock, plenty of time for Mischler to lead ECP to tying score with 26 seconds to go until half.

    ECP got 2nd half kickoff and in two plays and 21 seconds took their first lead of the game at 28-21. BC tried to answer and drove inside the 10 yard line, but settled for a field goal to make it 28-24. ECP drove to BC 27 yd line but turned ball over on downs with 2 straight incompletions. Then, on 4th and 1 from their own 47 BC in what was the turning point of the game decided to go for it on 4th down and were stuffed by linebacker Matt Bauer & company and turned ball over on downs. I thought BC should have punted them in the hole and not gone for it, or at least not run the play they did. Gave ECP momentum and in short order with 4 running plays capped by 21 yd TD run by Billy Lucas made it a 2 score game at 35-24 late in 3rd quarter. BC again tried to answer and drove inside ECP 20, but on 4th and 11 an aborted halfback pass by Cooper Lutz and subsequent scramble came up short and ECP took over at their 17 with about 6 minutes to go in the game. A holding call on first down pushed them back inside the 10, then on third and 11 Billy Lucas broke free for an 84 yd TD run that made it 42-24 to ice the victory for ECP.

    Game was closer than the final score, Berks played well and were in the game until the 4th quarter, ECP just eventually wore them down, too many weapons on offense, and defense got the stops they needed in 2nd half.

    Neither team punted in the game, not sure I recall seeing a HS game with no punts.

    Should be a great 4A championship next week with rubber match between ECP and Imhotep, I like ECP to win by a TD but would not surprise me if Imhotep pulls it out.

  690. Friday night fan says:

    Don’t leave us hanging Eric? Then what happened?

  691. Mcd65 says:

    I,Isheem Young did not play vs Bethlehem Catholic. He is Imhoteps best 2 way player and I seriously doubt he will be playing football for quite some time if ever again. Very sad. I was looking forward to watching him against ECP next week and then at Penn State.

  692. TomF says:

    Mcd65 on Young…Click here

  693. Prexies says:

    Is there any chance Wilmington beats Southern Columbia? Southern looks too good

  694. Billy Splain says:

    Neither team has faced what they are bout to see. Should be a great game

  695. Come on man! says:



  696. Southern D10 says:

    Wouldn’t count out Wilmington just yet. Back in ’08 they went to Hershey and played that stacked West Catholic team from Philly. Everyone picked WC to win by 40. In what’s probably the best championship game in Piaa history, Wilmington won

  697. Mitch says:

    Hey guys. I am an eastern guy here getting ready for Hershey. Do not know anything about this class A game. What can you guys tell me about these teams and what should I expect? Also is one team favorite over the other. Thanks.

  698. Route54 says:

    Can someone give me the news about this Wilmington team. Looks like they are a solid team that can put up the points. Do they have any D1 commits ?

    Thank you

  699. river runner says:

    @ B. Powell-I am pretty sure most teams in D10 do not look forward to playing ECP. There is not a school in D10 that circles them on the calendar and says yes I cant wait to play a team loaded with D 1 talent. That has a roster of 80 kids. I know that Grove City beat them a couple of years ago as well as Conn. However those were special teams. There is a reason everyone plays up. I wont change my thoughts on private schools and the unbalance against public schools. It is time for a new system in the PIAA. Not just for football. For every sport.

  700. Captain Complainsalot says:

    1A – Two public schools in state championship
    2A – Two public schools in state championship
    3A – Two public schools in state championship
    4A – 1 Private vs 1 Charter school
    5A – 1 Private vs 1 Public school
    6A – 1 Private vs 1 Public school

    3 Private, Catholic schools who work their tales off.
    1 Charter school who pours their hearts into sports
    8 Public schools who don’t care about private vs public and knocked off such schools on their way to Hershey. Let the kids play, all seperation would do would cause the argument every year as to who really was the state champ, the public or private school.

  701. Billy Splain says:

    we will have team previews for the games beginning Wednesday

  702. Route54 says:

    Sounds good Billy, thank you.

  703. TomF says:

    River Runner, do you think Public teams are the only teams that complain about the Private/Charter advantage? Take Berks Catholic for example. 95% of their kids are from the CYO program, homegrown kids, admissions turned down 2 big time football players due to poor academics, they have more kids transfer out than transfer in for football. BC is located in READING, PA! The poorest city in the US! They do things the right way and also realize that they will never be able to beat the ECP’S or Imhoteps-(recruiting machines) of the world. McDevitt will also be back, they always have several big time foobtall transfers every year. If TEP and ECP would move up to 5A where they belong, I dont think you would hear that many complaints. 3 years in a row that TEP/ECP will meet for a championship, that sucks!

  704. Jeff says:

    @ Southern D10 – Wilmington has a great program and great coach but I would be shocked if they beat Southern Columbia, and think they’ll lose by at least a couple of scores. IMO Southern Col. is the 2nd biggest favorite this weekend behind Archbishop Wood, would love to see Wilmington and Gateway win, but honestly don’t think either has much of a chance.

  705. Friday night fan says:

    Well put Captain, and Amen! Good luck to all the West teams this week! Let the kids play the game! Thanks to all the coaches out there putting in the long hours to help the young people of our great state!

  706. Jeff says:

    At the risk of stating the obvious just want to mention Matthew Bauer is a stud at linebacker for CP. I was very impressed with him on Friday night, Brian Kelly at Notre Dame has picked up 2 tremendous players from Western PA in Bauer and Phil Jurkovec. Bauer reminds me of Paul Posluszny, the former Hopewell star who led his team to the 3A state title in 2002 and went on to a very successful career at Penn State and the NFL. Bauer looks like he’s going to be a very good and perhaps all-pro LB in the NFL if he continues on his current path.

    And which schools are recruiting Billy Lucas? He had a tremendous game on Friday and certainly looks to me like a very good D1 prospect. I’m a Pitt fan and if Pat Narduzzi is not recruiting him I’d like to know why.

  707. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Some big news in D-10. Seneca High Schools all time pass leader has left the school. He started his first day of classes at ECP today. Billy Lucas has flown under the radar, mainly because of Preps passing offense. I expect that to change in the next month.

  708. Friday night fan says:

    Jeff- As usual the superstars get all the credit, but I thought the CP O Line was the difference in the game! It’s easy to run through holes like that! BC had no answer for the line or CPs run game! And yes- Pitts not really recruiting any current senior out of arguably Preps best class ever? Pitt only seems to see WPIAL players, maybe they should be looking north?
    Is PITT recruiting any of Pinerichlands seniors? They had two D lineman on the TJ team committed, and One from PCC. And the CP Oline did a great job against them. Makes you wonder!

  709. Drew says:

    “Recruiting machines” What are private/charter school coaches supposed to do when a kid’s parents inquire about their kid playing for them? “No, we can’t take you because people think it’s unfair.” People want to play for the top programs schools no matter if they’re private/charter/public. How is TJ by far the most dominant WPIAL 4A team every year? It’s a public school, why do most of the better players end up there? Why does Southern Columbia have such a great program? They’re public and they destroyed NG, a private school who had a bunch of transfers this year. Wilmington another public school with a great program year in and year out. Nobody cared about MP until they went 10-0 with a couple transfers and a big time D1 prospect this year….didn’t even make it out of D10, losing to another public school with a good program in Sharon. Annnd everybody didn’t care that CP was a private school when they were getting dominated by Strong Vincent (public), General McLane (public), McDowell (public) and the wpial. Any school with the right people in place can field a competitive, good, consistent program that draws kids to them. Yes non-boundary is an advantage but if it was as big an advantage as everybody makes it out to be there would no TJs, Wilmingtons, Southern Columbias, Pine-Richlands, Aliquippas etc etc etc etc.

  710. Tully says:

    Well said Tom. Not that they care but the complaints would certainly go way down if CP and Tep played where they should be. And spare me the numbers. One is the biggest school at the 4a level (with no borders to on top of that) and the other one draws whomever they want from one of the largest cities in the country!! Great players and full respect for the kids, but have a lot more football respect for the school’s championships and accomplishments if that were the case.

  711. Mcd65 says:

    Drew,good post. There are many public school teams that are just great programs both east and west. Being from the eastern part of the state ,almost every year North Penn,Neshaminy,The Downingtowns,Coatsville ,Pennridge.Upper Moreland,Parkland So Columbia,Berwick.Selingsgrove,Dunmore and on and on have very good teams . The privates Wood .st joe.LaSalle,Becca and maybe ACC. Public schools are doing just fine IMO.

  712. Budda says:

    To Wilmington: I am a very long time HS football fan. In fact, I always go to all of the games at Hershey every year since 1995. I spend my fall traveling watching different teams. I need to inspire the kids of your team. They would need to play their very best to be in this game. Southern is so talented. The first time I saw them this year, I was taken by surprise. Heck, their kicker is even great. Then I looked at the program, most of them are juniors or sophomores! Southern is talented and powerful, not even a double team can stop their #4 (Fleming).

  713. jack1234 says:

    someone started a go fund me for isheem young “justice for sheem”. What justice? The only justice being served is him being caught for armed robbery. He’ll have a while to think about what he did. This is whats wrong with society, vicitimizing the people that commit the action. Maybe the kid was influenced who knows but a very poor choice that costs him a great oppurtunity in his life.

  714. River Runner says:

    Wonder why the Seneca quarterback transferred to Prep?

  715. TomF says:

    Drew, on the “recruiting machines” I guess you did not get the Memo:

    Seneca’s Scarabino Transfers to Cathedral Prep!
    Mischler graduates this year and Scarabino in. Forget 5A, please move up to 6A

  716. ???? says:

    Immhotep doesnt need to recruit they practice on a field with 8th and 9th graders that are 3 time back to back to back National Popwarner Championships. In the Highest classification of popwarner all the kids on NW raiders either are in imhotep already or are 8th graders coming to imhotep next year so please can stop with this recruiting thing. When your lil league team go to nationals and fighting for there 4th title down disney if you guys jus open your eyes and research you would see this and stop pointing the recruit fingers at Imhotep when all there top players came out of that same program. Go youtube and type in northwest raiders and look at there kids play how physical and fast they are against other teams.

  717. Drew says:

    I was well aware of the transfer when I posted my opinion. Scarbino’s family reached out to CP and were told he would compete for QB but were more interested in him as an LB. I guess you did not read the 1st sentence in my previous post. I’m sorry that CPs answer wasn’t: “It’s not fair that you want your son to play here so we can’t accept him.” Scarbino wasn’t the only transfer either. One of McDowell’s starting DBs transferred to CP and I believe their QB is considering transferring as well. I guess CP should just lock their doors, turn their phones off, and just tell everyone to stop wanting to play there.

  718. Eric says:

    @Tom F,

    Berks Catholic is not from center city Reading(“poor”)even though it has a Reading address……BC school is barely a mile from Wyomissing and Wilson West Lawn districts,the two richest in Berks County,with many BC students from there,stop the woe is me routine,please

  719. phillyboy says:

    Bah-ah-ah-ah-ah, Bah-ah-ah-ah-ah, Bah-ah-ah-ah-ah ….the sheep are following their shepherd, ECP. It’s corny at best, embarrassing at worst. It’s actually the same psychology that drives real estate. If enough people had the wherewithal and gumption to stay put and not kiss the behinds of those currently in a favorable position things would eventually improve where you are whether it be real estate or well, high school football. But more importantly, it shows character and intestinal fortitude. Bah-ah-ah-ah-ah Bah-ah-ah-ah-ah Bah-ah-ah-ah-ah

  720. You topia says:

    You mean, like in Erie if we just sat back and let the public schools go out of business this year?
    That would have been bad for all.
    As shepherds, we now give you the hook! lol.

  721. SCA Tigers says:

    I am a Southern Columbia fan/Dad and was hoping for some news about Wilmington. I looked at the Hudl film and can not see them staying close…Not talking smack but if they let up 42 last week. Southern will drop 50+ on them.

  722. me888 says:

    “Drew says:
    December 5th, 2017 at 8:59 pm
    I was well aware of the transfer when I posted my opinion. Scarbino’s family reached out to CP and were told he would compete for QB but were more interested in him as an LB.”

    me thinks that no one should ever be able to hold a CP diploma after just one year in the building. Athlete or not. It devalues the diploma for all that came before them.

    As for the athletic side of the argument, D10 should block all the transfers of senior athletes, and force the PIAA to hear the cases to overturn. If the PIAA overturns…so be it; at least D10 could say they tried.

    With all that said, me also understands the oddity (and extenuating circumstances) that is now present within the city of Erie. The fact that there are only 3 high schools within the confines, and 2 are private. Movement may very well be more imminent than in a more normal environment. me may need to see how things play out over time to be able to claim fair/foul.

  723. B says:

    A Homers Center-28 Jannette-24
    AA -Southern Columbia-49 Wilmington-28
    AAA-Quaker Valley-42 Middletown-35
    AAAA-Cathedral Prep-37 Imhotep-21
    AAAAA-AW-42 Gateway-14
    AAAAAA- Pine Richland-37 St Joes-35

  724. garyz says:

    Prediction for A Title Game
    Jeanette 28- H. C. 14

  725. Jeff says:

    Predictions/Thoughts on today’s games

    1A Homer Center vs Jeanette – interesting matchup between 2 teams not expected to be here. Jeanette finally got past Clairton in the WPIAL playoffs for the first time in a decade, since the great Tyrelle Pryor led teams, and Homer Center is the Cinderella story of the tournament, taking down 3 time defending champ BG and becoming the first school from Indiana county to make the state final. I think this may be one of most closely contested games of the weekend and could go either way, HC has won their last 2 games by the same score of 20-14, but I think Jeanette makes a few more big plays on offense and HC is on the losing end today 20-14.

    4A CP vs. Imhotep – I really liked CP in this game before Isheem Young was suspended, too many weapons on offense, and defense will make enough stops like they did last week. Think they will be more balanced on offense and Mischler will have a good bit more passing yardage than last week, and don’t think Billy Lucas is going to run wild on Tep’s defense like he did against Berks, but I like CP 35-22.

  726. Jeff says:

    @Friday Night Fan – agreed, the CP O-Line was excellent against BC, no one was even close to touching Lucas on the last long TD run, and some of the holes they opened were massive. But Lucas also had quite a few yards after contact, on a couple of his TD runs he broke several tackles and dragged a defender a few yards along the way.

    Have no idea why Pitt is not recruiting a number of players on CP, perhaps they are but just haven’t offered anybody, big mistake IMO.

  727. Jeff says:

    Unfortunately I don’t think either of our western teams have much of a shot today after winning both yesterday.

    2A Wilmington vs. Southern Columbia – has there ever been a state tile matchup with as many combined wins as these 2 coaching legends have, an astounding 725 between them. I don’t think Wilmington’s defense will be able to slow down Southern Columbia’s high powered offense, I think they will score more then Southern’s previous 2 opponents but not nearly enough to keep up, I’ll take SC 49-27.

    5A Gateway vs. Archbishop Wood – Gateway has had a great season and restored some of the Gators proud tradition, but they are overmatched in this game IMO. I’ve seen them 3 times and their defense can be vulnerable to the run, which is not a good thing when going against a running machine like Wood. AW ran for over 300 yards last week against a good Unionville team, I wouldn’t be surprised if they do it again and expect Nasir Peoples to have a big night.

    Brady Walker is a very good HS quarterback, Courtney Jackson is a big time receiver, and freshman sensation Derrick Davis has been a force on both sides of the ball, so I do think Gateway will score some, but can’t see them slowing down’s Wood’s offense, I like AW 48-28.

  728. B Powell says:

    Wow, some good open date teams coming in for 2018 scheduling. Let’s see some elite matchups!
    Congratulations to ECP on the back to back 4A title and a good ending for the SR’s.

  729. RN says:

    It was a long afternoon for the Wilmington Greyhounds but they played their hearts out in a 48-0 loss to the Tigers of Southern Columbia. To say they were overmatched is an understatement. When you are a one dimensional team in a state championship game you almost always lose. Once the Tigers shut down the Greyhounds running game, and that was early in the game, the game was over. The SCA defense took over and the offense powered their way to title number 8.

  730. Dennis Pascoe says:

    Wilmington Greyhounds and their fans hold your heads high. Our Tiger’s were on a mission after that embarrassing loss last year. You also have had a great year.

  731. Mcd65 says:

    Jeff,good call on the Wood running game. They are a machine. They were an average sized O line ,but their technique is undeniably great as a unit. Gate way played some good teams this year ,but were overmatched against Wood. Let the whining begin .

  732. garyz says:

    Predictions for today
    Q.V. 21- Middletown 14
    Q.V. defense shuts down M-Town in my opinion.
    P-R 35- SJP 21
    I think a healthy Jurkovec and PR skill players may be a little to potent for SJP. However this one is hard, because after all SJP is SJP! I do believe we are in for two great games today hopefully! Best of Luck to All!

  733. Jeff says:

    IMO today’s games are the toughest to handicap of the weekend, I have gone back and forth on both games, and could make a good case for any of the 4 teams.

    3A Quaker Valley vs. Middletown – I was leaning towards taking Middletown, back again after losing to Beaver Falls, which is their only loss in last 2 years. They have been crushing everyone in their path, and most people in the east expect them to win, and some rather handily.

    But Quaker Valley has been pretty impressive themselves, and they play in the rugged Beaver Valley Conference, arguably the best in the state for smaller schools, with 4 teams earlier this year ranked in top 10 in most state polls. No question they have played a tougher schedule than Middletown, have scored lots of points against everyone except Aliquippa, and the Quips didn’t give up many to anyone. They also have a very good defense, and I think they’ll somewhat contain Middletown’s running attack. Ricky Guss makes enough plays and QV wins 27-21.

    6A PR vs. SJP – not much needs to be said about the matchup that’s been anticipated since the start of the season. I liked PR for most of the year, but after watching them play 2 weeks ago against SC, and the illness that has been running through the team, I’m taking SJP. Think both teams will score a lot of points, but SJP’s defense or special teams will make something happen, and SJP finds a way to win 42-38.

    I really hope I’m wrong about that prediction, someone needs to beat SJP, hopefully we don’t have to wait for Coatesville next year!!

  734. Eric W says:

    Middletown 27-17
    SJP 28-24

  735. Eric W says:

    Very surprised by QV score

  736. Mike S says:

    Regarding the transfer of Joey Scarbino to Cathedral Prep from Seneca, certainly for the best for the kid who is a fine player with ability to play D1 football and will get much more exposure at Prep than his local 2A school with about 20 players. I’ve watched a good bit of video and think while he could indeed play QB and has a very strong arm, his best college position is linebacker where he has the right size and is very physical.

    I have no problems with kids transferring to a school like Cathedral Prep, just believe they should be playing in 5A or 6A, not 4A.

  737. Xavier says:

    Middletown would not have beaten any of the top four Western AAA teams. The east must have been very weak if this is the best team to come out. Game results would have been the same vs Sharon or Alliquipa, and would say that Forest Hills and Mercyhurst Prep were better teams as well. Quaker dominated in every aspect of the game, last year Middletown’s excuse was the size of West Beaver line. This year their inability to throw was exposed. Did not handle getting beat very well, not a lot of class

  738. me888 says:

    “Mike S says:
    December 9th, 2017 at 3:26 pm

    I have no problems with kids transferring to a school like Cathedral Prep, just believe they should be playing in 5A or 6A, not 4A.”

    me comment had nothing to to with Scarbino directly, or even athletics for that matter. Prep should NOT accept senior transfers for general students, band, forensics, etc…and certainly not for athletics. He should have transferred in last year or earlier, and me wouldn’t take umbrage with it. As stated earlier, “It devalues the diploma for all that came before them.”

    D10 should oppose the transfer for athletic intent, and let the PIAA overrule it, as usually occurs. me/we shall see.

    JMO, as always!

    Note: Rob Gronkowski (NE Patriots) ended up at Woodland Hills when PCC refused to accept his transfer from a NY school he was thrown out of. The reason: No one earns a PCC diploma with one year in the building (with the possible exception of a Doogie Howser, M.D., or a Sheldon Cooper)…BAZINGA!!!

  739. garyz says:

    Great day for the WPIAL! P-R laying it down on SJP was Awesome! Jeanette beating a H-C team that didn’t look like they belonged on the field with them! Last but not least, Q.V. just smacking Middletown around, that team surely did not belong on the field with Q.V., they actually don’t even make the playoffs in QV’s Conference! Two years in a row M-Town is picked and hyped to beat the WPIAL Teams (BF&QV) and they get blown off the field! They must not have any decent competition in their league and it surely shows! Congrats to all teams!

  740. garyz says:

    No disrespect to H-C, they had a great season! Plus they are the only team to beat B.G. (Altoona All-Stars) before their streak started, then they ended it! H-C has my respect, they just do not see speed and athletes like Jeanette has. But they are a great team, and have all my respect!

  741. B Powell says:

    ECP just declared 4A again for 2018-2019. In fact, don’t look for a rematch with Imhotep who just dropped to 3A. Wood just dropped to 4A and pencil them in to the title game next year.

  742. garyz says:

    I have to agree with you on that, I don’t know how that team has made the finals two years in a row. I will actually say that Class A champion Jeanette would blow them off the field. No team speed, no ability to throw the ball and very undisciplined defense. I am not trying to rip on them, but it blows my mind that they have only lost 2 times the past to years and both were in Hershey!

  743. Jack1234 says:

    @wpial rules you were off on the prediction…

  744. NW PA says:

    I love how all of the sudden all the best athletes in PA are from little old Erie PA. Up here, we know we can compete because of work ethic and character. Their is no reason, anyone from Philly, Pittsburgh, or even Harrisburg should complain about Prep recruiting. They are still pulling kids from Erie County, not the millions the other cities can pull from. 28 teams in a row have been beatin by better coaches and football players. It doesn’t matter if it’s private or public, Football is football. Prep should play in 4A, where PIAA has put them. All of the schools should do that and not have the option to move up or down. Maybe try that 1 year, and see if 6 classes work.

    As for public vs private debate. Move on. 11 vs 11 in football, where your from only matters to losers.

  745. TomF says:

    B Powell where have you seen this? I have only seen the WPIAL list of teams moving up. I can’t imagine Wood moving down after dominating 5A, same with TEP, they should move up to 5A

  746. B Powell says:

    The headline was in the Erie paper this past weekend.
    As they congratulated ECP for the back-to-back titles they mentioned not to look for a 4th meeting with Imhotep Charter. It said Imhotep was going 3A for 2018-2019 and to look for Archbishop Wood to be the next challenger as they (Wood) were dropping to 4A. The new enrollment numbers were in by Dec 6th.

  747. M says:

    Team classification list 2018-2020

  748. Jeff says:

    @ B Powell – if in fact Wood has dropped to 4A it’s an absolute joke, and it’s about time the PIAA grew a spine and did something about it. They play a national nonconference schedule, then take on the heavyweights in the PCL, and come playoff time step way down in competition. For what, just to prove they can destroy public schools their same size and win a state title. They have won 5 titles in 7 yrs at the 2nd highest classification, and now they are moving down?

    I really wish for the sake of competitive balance the PIAA would have adopted the success rule when they went to 6 classes, if a school dominates at their class they move up a class for the next 2 yr cycle.

    Wood should be playing 6A, period, I don’t care where their enrollment puts them, they are one of the best programs in the state and should be playing 6A, and ECP should also be playing in a higher class, instead they game the system to stay at 4A.

    If the PIAA had any guts and passed the success rule Wood would be playing 6A for the next 2 yr cycle, ECP and Imhotep would be playing 5A, and Southern Columbia would move up to 3A.

    I’m from Pittsburgh and have never complained about ECP or any of the private schools recruiting, it’s a fact of life, but don’t act like that doesn’t give those schools an advantage. I’ve stated on this board many times in the past that ECP is one of the best large school programs in the state, and should be playing a higher class than 4A, particularly when they are one of the largest schools in that classification, time to step up and challenge the bigger schools, and since most schools won’t do it on their own time for the PIAA to step in to restore some competitive balance and integrity to the system.

  749. Colin says:

    Garyz and Xavier

    3a in the east is very diluted. In D1 and D12 there are very few teams at that level. However it appears now that Neumann Goretti will be 3A moving forward. Albie Crosby is just getting started there so expect to see them a lot in Hershey. And If B Powell is correct in saying Imhotep will be 3A next season then expect a similar Wood/Gateway type of score in the 3A Final next season because Imhotep is loaded and who knows who else they have coming in.

  750. B says:

    Interesting questing PR this year against St.Joes last year,Swift Against had Jurkovec?? Ha hopeful see Georgia play ND in future with both starting can’t wait!!

  751. WPIAL Rules says:

    @ Jack I know. I was surprised that SJP didn’t hang in there as well as I thought. Props to PR!

  752. RN says:

    @ Jeff-The problem with the success rule is that it punishes the teams that work their butts off to be successful. It’s moronic to even suggest a so called solution like that. SCA won 5 titles in a row from 2002-2006 and then didn’t win another one until 2015. That should tell you right there that some years you have what it takes at your assigned level and some years you don’t. What it comes down to is what teams are willing to make the sacrifices necessary to beat the better teams in the state at their level. Yes, the private and charter schools make it more difficult to do that because of their opportunity to get players from anywhere, but SCA made the adjustments necessary to overcome that obstacle and other schools will have to do the same until the PIAA comes up with a fair and reasonable solution.

  753. Phil says:

    @RN – The success factor does not ‘punish’ anyone, it levels the playing field. It is used in Indiana and there is not much complaining. In fact, Indianapolis Cathedral moved from 4A where they had won a few championships to 5A, won 2 more titles, moved to 6A and is close to being champs there. That is where they belong. My question is if the team is that good Indy Catherdral, Clairton, Wood, SoCol, BG, etc. why wouldn’t they want to move up. If you are a starter or a future college player especially, what do you get out of destroying everybody and playing only a half? If you don’t succeed after the next 2 year cycle you move back down…or you stay put…or you move up again. Every 2 year cycle you get re-evaluated!! Most fans want the team to stay put, but most players wouldn’t mind the success factor from my experience! Privates will not get separated from publics, that is not going to happen, so there needs to be transfer rules and a multiplier for those schools. Add in the success factor and the field is more level. The result should be more competitive games and a sharpening of the skills of players because they have to be on top of their game instead of going through the motions just because they are so much better than everyone else.

  754. RN says:

    @Phil-Sorry Phil but your arguments are as stupid as the PIAA system currently in force.

  755. Mike F says:


    Football standpoint only PCC, ECP, Bishop McD, Wood, St Joes, ACC, Bechi, ITep. Outside of those programs who else is a problem?

    North Catholic had a nice 2-3 year run and now they are back down to earth. Seton la Salle is a consistent playoff team, but so are many public’s. Serra Catholic, Canevin, Bishop Carrol, Bishop McCort, etc all these boogie men to many are like most public schools. They get a good group of boys in they make a run then they lose and wait for the next good group to show up.

    Here is my suggestion. Investigate those 8 school see if there is any wrong doing. If there is report them to the PIAA and let them be punished. If there is no evidence then move on.

  756. 814 says:

    If you investigate ECP all your going to find is a bunch of champions who do it the right way. Please, the address is on the website. I’m sure Coach Mischler being the outstanding man of character he is will welcome any and all questions.

    I agree Mike F, and I would say those schools aren’t really even a problem. Cathedral Prep has been around for almost 100 years, the football program has won 4 state championships? Hardly dominating. Also, have you seen their other sports teams? Basketball is average at best, baseball has a good run here and there and the hockey team is about par with th rest. Trust me, if Prep recruited Erie county, McDowell wouldn’t have 2, 6’5+ and 1 7ft basketball players and Erie High school wouldn’t have sports.

    Quit the crying, and get better coaches or a better offseason program.

  757. Mike F says:


    I guess using the word problem was a poor choice of words on my part. A better way of stating it would be those are the 8 schools that take the brunt of the criticism for recruiting accusations but all Parochial/Private/Charter schools get accused of it especially when they win. That is my point no one cares when these type of schools lose only when they win. So if people feel that these schools are such boogeymen investigate them and bring the evidence to the PIAA. If there is no evidence then people need to shut up and move on.

    One thing I have a problem with, is the word recruiting because it seems like every person defines it differently. Some think if a school just talks to a potential student athlete that is considered recruiting. Others (I am in this category) think recruiting is offering incentive outside the norm of the rest of the student body (i.e tuition scholarship, job for parent, etc). Then there are other who feel it is something in between.

    What I think people would find if they investigated these 8 schools are that they are successfully largely because they are successful. in other words the program recruits itself because others want to be apart of it so they on their own go there. If you had a son who was a good student and football player who had a shot at a college scholarship (not necessarily FBS but FCS/D2/ or Ivy League) and you live in Shaler/Brentwood/PCSD/Wilkinsburg/ETC school district. Wouldn’t you consider sending your son to Central where he can be more easily noticed by such schools? That is why these schools attract these great players.

  758. B Powell says:

    Well said, 814. I couldn’t have said that one better myself. Cathedral Prep has always done things the right way and has produced many of the finest citizens in NWPA. Absolutely 1st class school and faculty and sports programs.
    Many of football players were in church Saturday night and the priest recognized them and I turned around and cheered for them, too on a job well done.
    I pay taxes and live in the FLB school district and we play ECP in just about everything and although they own us, their kids and coaching staffs are good sports and relish the competition. I’m sure they wish us well and are hoping we too can elevate our game and become more of a rival to them. The same is true for Villa Maria and Mercyhurst Prep. 1st class schools in every aspect.
    They are blessed with good fortune but have also done the work to get where they are and you can’t get around the fact about how the private schools CARE. They CARE about being excellent and the results follow them.
    High school is just the 1st step.

  759. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    ECP isnt going to be half of what they where this season. I wouldn’t be surprised if ECP played a watered down schedule next year. The senior class was very good. They lost 1 game as freshman to St. Ed’s 7-6(with Bauer playing varsity). Then they lost 1 game to IMTP in the state finals. Junior and Senior years, didn’t lose a game. I could see them losing a couple games next year.

  760. 814 says:

    I’m picking up what you’re putting down Mike F and couldn’t agree more that the success is their greatest recruiter.

    Thanks B Powell, I agree. I admire the fact FLB will stay 4A to challenge the champs.

    ECL/Metro FAN, ECP will definitely not have 5ajor division 1 players but no one is going to just walk in and take their title. Yes the Senior class was stupendous, note their sophomore class is off to an even better start. Have yet to lose. Perfect season as freshmen and JV. The seniors also had one more loss under their belt when they lost to Wakulla down at ESPN Disney. I believe their watered down schedule will include PCC, Canisius, Benedictine, Erie, and McDowell. It is going to be interesting who they add in there.

  761. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    814-I did forgot about the Florida game where Mischler broke his collarbone. I still don’t think the sophomore class has the guns this senior class did. Talented, Yes, but IMO not on the same level. They play McDowell, Erie, Benedictine and Canisius almost every year now. I don’t see the team heading to Florida next year or Detroit like this season.

  762. Friday night fan says:

    I don’t think you can hang the Florida loss on this senior class? They were only sophomores then, and most played on the 10-0 J.V. team. If this years sophomore class wins it the next two years and goes undefeated there junior/ senior years then you can compare them. But they haven’t accomplished anything yet. Time will tell, and we know the have great coaching to guide them.

  763. 814 says:

    Ya I wouldn’t put the Wakulla loss on that class either. I just did because the poster added the Imhotep loss to that class. I agree, Freshmen 7-1, JV 10-0, Varsity (JR) 14-0, Varsity (SR)14-0 will be damn near impossible to beat. A lot of great classes came through those halls, you’d be surprised how many classes only have a handful or less of losses. And they need to recruit? Cmon Man!

  764. Phil says:

    @RN – Sorry you confused those stupid facts with your opinion.
    @Mike F – We are talking all sports, not just football. Transfer rule is being looked into for all schools, not picking on anyone. If you live in say, Seneca Valley you can’t send your son to P-R because they are winning, but you can send him to PCC. No boundaries, therefore multiplier and/or transfer rule is needed. But keep in mind, it goes beyond football. Success factor is a success where it has been implemented. There was a radio show earlier in the year that dealt with that. Very informative.
    @814 – Totally agree. I know people up that way and most of those kids have been in the program, not transfers. Mischler is also one of the better coaches in the state, there is no denying that either.

  765. garyz says:

    Yes that will definitely make a difference, that can’t be argued. However I will say this, I don’t always think that ‘Tep plays the best team game. Have a vast collection of talent, but to many times they get beat by the better team. The team who plays as one, who is better coached Etc. I would site ECP for one and a few years back when S. Fayette coached by Joe Rossi who did not have anywhere near the athletes that Tep did and absolute demolished them! However they will be the odds on favorite in 3A that can’t be argued. As far as NG, don’t know enough about them to really comment, but you always post quality thought out comments so I will take your word for it. Plus Crosby is a quality coach for sure. See how it shakes out next year brother!

  766. Friday night fan says:

    814- Here we go again. What do you mean recruit? When you have success kids chose to come to the school, but there are no scholarships for sports. It is a need based school, and what you pay depends on what the family’s income is. During the fall after the varsity practice, coach Mischler has youth football on Preps field. These kids start playing there at 6-8 years old! And they and the parents watch the success of the varsity over the years. There are a few that transfer to Prep , but they have to be enrolled by mid way junior year. No senior transfers. I know when your successful rumors start flying, but all but 1 or 2 of the players in this senior class went to Prep as freshmen. So, when did they recruit them? People just can’t believe that very hard work, and great coaches win championships!
    How about be supportive of local teams that have some success!

  767. 814 says:

    Friday Night Fan – I think we’re on the same page here, it’s hard to capture emotions like sarcasm on a message board. I was saying “and they need to recruit?” as a broad statement to the board not just you. But in other words no, there is no need for any coach to go poach because the program recruits itself.

  768. phillyboy says:

    I ain’t done celebrating PR’s title yet; be doing that until at least the end of the year. As a salute to Pittsburgh was trying to jam to some tunes of artists from that area. Did a little google search; sheesh, is Christina Aguilera the best you guys got? No boundaries man, I’ll have to widen out my catchment to include the rest of the state.

  769. Friday night fan says:

    814- sorry I misunderstood your post i quess . Happy holidays to everyone! It was a great year for the west winning 4 of 6 in the finals! Can’t wait for next fall! Congratulations to all the teams who brought the gold home!

  770. garyz says:

    Wiz Khalifa and The Clark’s May be better representation!

  771. Tully says:

    I believe good programs feed themselves. So I have no reason not to believe ECP does it ‘the right way’. I just think they should be doing it he right way in 5a and fight in their actual weight class rather than dodge the big boys, which they are clearly one of. No borders just adds to that and multiplier helps that. SJP and PCC already at top class. So it evens playing field with the ECP and Wood’s of the state.

  772. Friday night fan says:

    I Don’t know why you think ECP should move up to 5 A. The PIAA sets the rules on enrollment guidelines. And believe me Prep isn’t turning students down to meet 4A numbers. They chose to be in the class the PIAA puts them in. As far as attending ECP. That’s the great thing about the country we live in. We all have choices on schools we can attend, and some choose a catholic education over the sub par public school system. As far as the multiplier thing? Write a letter to the PIAA, and ask them to make it happen. Sorry if I don’t agree with your way of thinking. I’m not the person who believes in the every kid gets a trophy mentality. If you want to even the playing field work harder( coaches and players). A lot of coaches in PA are running out dated offenses and defense. It’s hard to beat teams that can score in 2-4 plays. And your team takes 7-8 minutes to score. Once you get behind it’s hard to catch up.If that makes sense? The ECP senior class worked there butts of for the last few years, and they have great coaching. In two week the next season starts in the weight room at ECP !

  773. Mike F says:

    Friday night fan,

    I agree with you on school choice I disagree on outdated offenses. You run an offense that best suits the talents you have. No one style is better than another. There are still plenty of teams taking 7-8 minutes to score that win in bunches at all levels. You seem to favor the quick strike offenses and that is great, but lets not make it out to be the best. It is just one of many good systems. In fact I would argue if refs didn’t over enforce pass interference those offenses would not be nearly as popular or effective

  774. Friday night fan says:

    Mike- Let’s take Meadville for example. I’m not picking on any one team, but They’ve been running the same offense since the early 80’s. The coaches don’t change the offense, or playbook year to year. They put the players into there system as best they can.And they’re secondary usually has troubles covering receivers.why? It’s not the players. It’s the way their coached during practice.These coaches teach what they know. Which is 3 yards and a cloud of dust. But when they get behind they can’t catch-up against an offense like a Grove city.I’m not saying it doesn’t work locally, but when you get into the playoffs agains WPIAL teams etc.. that’s when it shows.

  775. Mike F says:


    I am not arguing that. I look at it like how Palko coaches WA. How many different offenses has he ran over the years? He changes the offense to suit the talent he has that year. That is what I am talking about.

    If I was coach and my talent on and was power I, I would run power I no matter how outdated it seems to be. If it was for spread then i would run that.

  776. Mcd65 says:

    Mike F Power football 101, Archbishop Wood. Not too shabby for old time football.

  777. RamsFan says:

    The biggest problem with the “power football” theory is it really only holds up if you are clearly better/bigger than the other team. Look at BP and NA and PCC out here in the WPIAL. That is their identity and when they have better kids, they win. But when its about equal they don’t.

    PCC is a really good example. Their last 5 loses (all mercy rule) have been to teams that are equally talented and all run some version of the spread, at least at times. PCC wants to always run power and counter and they can’t keep up scoring wise. Even in the state championship game last year, PCC’s line was overwhelming bigger than SJP, but they got smoked because they had nothing else to turn to when SJP stopped the run.

    Also Archbishop Wood could run the Single Wing and still win – until they played someone of equal talent (like SJP). It doesn’t matter.

    And to counter that – look at Butler. They run old time football and stink.

  778. WPIAL Rules says:

    @RamsFan – PCC need a new OC. His play calling sucks. He has no idea on how to use the players he has. He chased out a great coach because he didn’t like the play calling.

  779. Tully says:

    Well said Ramsfan. Wood is successful with power football because they choose to play down relative to the caliber of their program (no need to quote enrollment numbers I am talking quality here). That is continued point about ECP. Due props to ECP first state title in 2000 which was well earned at highest classification. Multidimensional team always has huge advantage and exactly why PCC struggles against balanced teams. Dont have to spread the field but do need to be able to throw.

  780. Tully says:

    I’d also add that I certainly understand the argument of playing where your numbers put you in the four class system. With six classes the level of football is not nearly as deep or competitive on a consistent year over year basis. Consistency is where privates and charters have the biggest advantage. Good pub programs who are good enough to retain their own will be in the mix but their talent will always be more spikey. That is also why the Quips continue to be the most impressive program in the state. A 1a school losing in the finals of the toughest 1a district a bigger accomplishment than a team that constently demonstrates they can beat 6a teams winning in the ‘new’ 4a. Wood has also demostrated they are way above the ‘new’ 5a. Bravo Aliquippa for playing where you should rather than just accumulating trophies.

  781. Tully says:

    Sorry a 1a school losing in the finals of the toughest 3a district. go Quips!