The Funding Zone Scoreboard

2018 Football Forum

Written by: on Monday, January 1st, 2018


Are you ready for some football?

Welcome to the official forum on high school football for the 2018 season.

During the off-season let’s talk about players, recruiting news, teams and everything about high school football.

During the season each week let’s talk about match-ups and how teams did. Let us know what player(s) stood out each week.

2017 Football Forum

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27,961 Responses to “2018 Football Forum”

  1. sausmann9 says:

    Happy New Year everyone!!! Hey all, remember Thursday is the Under Armour All Star game at 1pm and then on Saturday at 1pm is the US Army All Star game. Enjoy and good luck to our PA players!!!!

  2. Billy Splain says:

    There’s some good pa talent there this year from PA. The last hurrah for hs football of the 2017 season.

  3. Gary Kinsey says:

    Was trying to find somewhere to find a list of past PA. high school football all state teams, or at least players from district 6, please reply with any help

  4. Billy Splain says:

    email me,…let me know what you need

  5. M says:

    I don’t see the link to the forunm on the homepage any longer. I had to do a web search to find this today. Didn’t know if I was alone.

  6. Billy Splain says:

    sorry bout that

  7. M says:

    Thanks Billy

  8. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    Looks like Erie Prep has found themselves someone else to compete for the QB job against Scarabino.

  9. peabody says:

    what kid is that. Haven’t heard anything but Scarabino, but more interested in him as LB

  10. ECL/Metro FAN says:

    I’ll just say McDowell wont have a returning started at QB.

  11. WPIAL RULES says:

    What a joke. It’s time for the WPIAL to pull out of the PIAA. What is the purpose of having an eastern and western champion? Why not just rank the top 16 or 32 teams in the state in each conferance and go from there?

  12. Billy Splain says:

    the wpial can’t pull out of the piaa.

  13. Jack1234 says:

    Some very good 5A and 6A western teams may not be able to at least make it to hershey with this new alignment now

  14. Billy Splain says:

    Jack, it doesn’t matter. when you have only 13 6A and around 24-25 5A teams, it is what it is. My only question is why didnt they leave 11 12 in east and put the D3 teams in the west. would have been the same. Some using blame 6 classes, but if it were four those other teams still wouldn’t have a chance.

  15. Xavier says:

    Who knows anything about the Strickland kid from Sharon, multiple-time All-State receiver, 0 college offers.

  16. Mike F says:


    Don’t know/never seen this Strickland kid, but I do know this about recruiting. It is a crap shoot. This is not wrestling where a kid can say I was 92-14 and placed in states and beat this person, that person, etc and have it mean something. Therefore they are recruited accordingly based off their accomplishments on the mat not their potential.

    Football recruiting is a funny business an the exact opposite. You have guys look great at these camps in shorts and get destroyed on the field be rated in the top 3 at their positions (Sterling Jenkens) in the country. Yet the kids who destroyed that player be d3 players. Basically football coaches look at potential more than ability.

    I can’t tell you how many times I seen LBs be 4 star recruits with offers from everybody. They are 6-2 220lb and 4.6 forty,yet they never make tackles because they are cowards who take bad angles and have no football instincts. Then the 5′ 7″ 150lb 4.8 forty safety behind that 4 star LB take great angles, have good football instincts, and isn’t afraid to take or give a hit and they are choosing between Grove City, St. Vincent, Theil, etc.

    QB recruiting is the same way. I remember Paul Jones from Sto-Rox being a 5 star. he looked the part with height and weight (don’t remember exact measurements but he had them) and he could throw the ball a mile. The problem, no football instincts and wasn’t accurate at all. Most HS coaches would kill for a 5 star QB I remember watching Sto-Rox play Keystone Oaks and Jones coming out of the game so Sto-Rox could go to wildcat. That should tell you everything about how good he was. Yet he went to PSU as a 5 Star QB and offers from everyone.

    Basically don’t worry about recruiting, try and find the best academic/football balance where the kid fits. It will work out better for the kid then chasing the dream.

  17. Southern D10 says:

    @Xavier. I never understood why he never got any big college offers. He certainly had the talent and stats to warrant them. Unfortunately this came out this morning.

  18. Jack1234 says: WPIAL schedules released today. 6A now is only one conference.

  19. Xavier says:

    When you bring in 30 kids with half of them being out of state, how many do you think will still be there in a year? Slippery Rock and Clarion are bring in half a new team each.

  20. B. Powell says:

    Cathedral Prep gets ok on (4) more players.
    Two transfers from McDowell, two from Seneca now cleared to compete in sports at Prep
    EDINBORO — District 10 ruled Tuesday, 2/6/2018 that four student-athletes who recently transferred to Cathedral Preparatory School are eligible to participate in athletics at the school.
    The D-10 Committee conducted four separate eligibility hearings at the Northwest Tri County Intermediate Unit 5 on Tuesday.
    Regan Schleicher, who previously attended McDowell High School, was ruled eligible after the first hearing. After Schleicher’s ruling, McDowell officials withdrew their challenge to a second transfer from McDowell, Shelby Wiley. As a result, Wiley became eligible to play sports at Prep.
    Seneca High School challenged the transfers of Joey Scarabino and Tre Thrower in the next two hearings. However, District 10 ruled both eligible to compete for Prep.
    All four athletes are juniors who played for their respective football teams this past fall, while Scarabino and Schleicher also played baseball in the past. All four players were football all-region selections, while Scarabino is the all-time passer in Seneca history, and Schleicher was the starting quarterback at McDowell and all-region selection for the baseball team. Thrower and Wiley were voted to the all-region first team at defensive back.
    Bill Flanagan, the athletic director at Prep, is the District 10 Secretary and Erie City representative on the D-10 Committee, but he recused himself from the four hearings as a D-10 Committee member and was present as a Prep administrator. He was not present for the committee’s deliberations.
    Pete Iacino, the District 10 chairman and private schools representative on the D-10 Committee, also recused himself, leaving no private school connections on the committee for the four eligibility hearings.
    The committee unanimously approved Schleicher 9-0, while Scarabino was approved 8-1 and Thrower 7-2. There was no vote on Wiley after McDowell withdrew its objection.

  21. M says:

    Weird, I have been trying to share the below article here for several days.

  22. sausmann9 says:

    And yet Prep doesn’t want to move up, WTF is the PIAA doing if not fixing the issues???

  23. Billy Splain says:

    Saussman, they are still working on different rules to curb the problem of transfers but hitting giant walls called district chairman that don’t want to hear about it. Many are from “transfer” schools.

  24. B. Powell says:

    I believe Seneca’s coach resigned last fall and this transfer was seen as quite a step up for both boys as far as future opportunity at the next level. ECP has shown it can certainly help with that and also provide and upgraded academic curriculum.
    The McDowell to ECP transfers are public to private school, Erie, PA – Erie, PA, as there is no Millcreek, PA.
    That’s the very core and theme of a private school – as an alternative education.

  25. me888 says:

    “B. Powell says:
    February 15th, 2018 at 10:19 am
    I believe Seneca’s coach resigned last fall and this transfer was seen as quite a step up for both boys as far as future opportunity at the next level. ECP has shown it can certainly help with that and also provide and upgraded academic curriculum.
    The McDowell to ECP transfers are public to private school, Erie, PA – Erie, PA, as there is no Millcreek, PA.
    That’s the very core and theme of a private school – as an alternative education.”

    McDowell is not in the City of Erie. It is in Millcreek Township which does in fact have it’s own government and school system.

    Prep should never permit anyone to obtain a CP diploma by spending only 1 (or 1 and 1/2) years in the building. It devalues the diploma for all current, former, and future students; not to mention that it’s a really bad look and public relations move. The public schools here will be even more infuriated.

    JMO, as always!

  26. phillyboy says:

    @ B. Powell

    This notion that kids transfer to an elite private program in order to ‘enhance future opportunities at the next level’ is the biggest crock on planet Earth. College is big time overrated anyway but that’s a whole other topic of discussion. It’s all about taking the easy way out and kissing the behind of the big dog in order to have the privilege to be a part of it — as opposed to having some loyalty and playing for your home team. Yes, winning state championships is really cool, but not at the expense of becoming a sell-out. It’s a symptom of what Governor Rendell called ‘the wussification of America’. And btw, PR would have kicked Erie Prep’s butox last year.

  27. B. Powell says:

    Good discussion.
    Just remember, too, it’s not all slam dunk approved up here, either. Mercyhurst Prep had a couple kids approved from one nearby school last fall 2017 and 2 other kids from another school with -higher academics than Mercyhurst- were not approved.
    All because the 1st school didn’t contest the transfers and the other school did.
    Seems like they are at least trying to find solutions.

  28. Friday night fan says:

    I don’t know how you can say PR would have beat CP? The common opponent was PCC and they both won by about the same score over PCC. I know it wasn’t a real game but CP beat PR in 7 on 7 36-6. I think that showed CP had the edge in the skilled positions. PR couldn’t cover the CP receivers period. I think CP O Line was better than PRs was. I guess we’ll never know, but would have loved to seen it! I think it would have come down to Phils legs against CP ground game.
    I don’t agree with the selling out comment? If the students attend the private school as a freshman. I don’t care for the wagon jumpers either I guess.

  29. jacky1234 says:

    PR was the best team in the state last year and there is no debate. The way they beat SJP in the title game solidifies this. Jurkovec is a generational player and he’s good enough to beat teams by himself.

  30. Friday night fan says:

    Spoken like a true PR fan LoL ! He sure wasn’t all that throwing the ball in the 7 on 7 vs CP. I don’t think he was use to throwing against a secondary with 3 D-1 D backs.I think CP had WAY more weapons on offense than PR. All CP would have to do would be shadow Phil with Matt Bauer to keep his scramble game in check. I’ll take Mischler any day over Phil, joe has better accuracy on long ball. PR didn’t face anyone close to CP this year including St. Joes. I think PR was a one horse show, and CP had a more balanced team. They both had great years, but CP would be more than PR could handle!

  31. me888 says:

    me’ll take PR by about 6 over CP. Neither defense would keep the other team under 20 to 24 points; and me’ll take PR’s offense over CP’s. me saw them both 4 times each, and none of the games were vs the patsies.

    Jurkovec is an all around better athlete than Mischler. He has a better/stronger arm (and is at least as accurate as Misch). He was a better runner also. Much more elusive. Mischler may have been a better field general, but not by much, if at all.

    JMO, as always!

  32. Jack1234 says:

    Enough with the 7on7 nonsense. It’s a joke. Most kids I know that aren’t on those travel teams don’t even take it serious. It’s way different covering a receiver or running routes in pads vs in shorts and tshirts. Also he’s faced plenty of secondaries and defenses with more D1 guys than ECP had on defense this year. Look at what he did to PCC in 2015 and 16. Mutliple D1 guys all across those defenses. Also saying mischler is better than jurkovec is a truly asinine statement, the mischler kids a player but he’s absolutely nowhere near jurkovec. All you have to do is compare film, mischler isn’t making anything close to some of the plays jurkovec made this past year.

    PR wasn’t a one horse show at all, they were loaded with other guys and a very underrated defense. SJP had a better defense than ECP and look at how PR scored on them. You’re argument is disprovable.

  33. Friday night fan says:

    Well Jack , I guess it’s only nonsense if your the ones scratching at the end of the game. If the players don’t take the game-seriously it doesn’t count? Your not a TJ coach are you? I guess it’s all we have to go by as it’s the only time they met this season. And th PCC game.I said I’d take Mischler I didn’t mean he’s better.other than his deep balls In my opinion. It doesn’t really matter what we say we’ll never know. But I do agree it would have been a high scoring affair. I agree neither defense would have done much to slow the other down. I think it would have come down to field position, and turnovers. I see a score of like 42-35 type game. With CP on top of course! I don’t agree with the St. Joes defense being better than CP either. CP would have beat SJP just as bad as PR did.

  34. garyz says:

    Anyone who uses 7 on 7 as a unit of measure or comparison, tells me all I need to know about their understanding of the game!! The whole 7 on 7 thing is so overrated that it is starting to lose some luster as a team function. However the kids who play for travel teams (comprised of kids from various schools) is still growing! That is because it’s a showcase for skill players and an informal recruiting tool. As a Coach, I like doing a few here and there, but so much more can be gained from repetition of the actual Offense and Defense you will run during the season! As an OC, I want my kids to know are Base runs and play actions VS every scenario possible. Not lining up in 5 Wide, which we may do 10-12 times a year, or playing exotic coverages that we most likely will never run on Defense!

  35. garyz says:

    Jurk and the kid from ECP were both great QB’s, no doubt! However if you truly think the kid from ECP was better than Jurk because of a 7on7, or height, well your wrong! Look at every nationwide ranking, scholarship offers and tell me what everyone missed? Was it that 7on7 that has been referenced? Is it his height? Because if Mischler was the 2nd coming of Marino, the height difference means nothing in today’s game. So what is it you know, that all recruiting services and College Coaches do not? The 7on7, 36-6 Football In shorts! I AM NOT A PR FAN, just someone who respects and knows the game!

  36. jacky1234 says:

    Except 7on7 isn’t an actual game, so yes it doesn’t count for anything. All it does for PR is practice their formations and plays etc. Take a look at who ECP played and who SJP played, SJP played better compeition and they gave up less points statistically then ECP did not playing as hard of teams. Your argument is invalid, if ECP wants to be considered the number 1 team they should move up a class or two and stop beating up on weak teams in 4A

  37. Mike F says:

    Wow Mike Zmijanac is voted out as Head Coach at Aliquippa. Pittsburgh media is attacking the School Board.

  38. steven o'neil says:

    Anybody have any info on what the reason is behind the school board getting rid of the quips head coach? I was completely shocked to read that.

  39. Friday night fan says:

    Your whole post tells me you know very little about CP. Their first 3 games in 17 were against 6A teams all ranked in the top 5 in western PA. Look at the scores.Then they went to Detroit and played the 2017 Michigan state champs an Michigan second largest classification. And Canisus out of Buffalo is always a state contender for the regular season finale. Cp usually has the starters out mid way through the 3 Rd quarter, and that’s when they give up some points also.Anyone who thinks you have to play 6A to be the best is dead wrong. The PIAA decides what class we’re in, and you think Berks Catholic and Imhotep are week team? Nobody said the 7 on 7 was a real game. But when people make comments like PR is the best in the state no debate? I disagree that’s all! And Jack- your point Is invalid! Must be a burg thing?

  40. phillyboy says:

    According to the ‘project a matchup’ feature at [2017] PR 42 – ECP 28.

  41. Phil says:

    What’s up with Aliquippa’s coach getting the axe. Never heard anything bad about Coach Zmijanac. Wasn’t losing something like 36 games in over 20 years good enough for a few board members. Or is there something behind the scenes we don’t know about? Hopefully that behind the scenes thing isn’t some people in power with an axe to grind.

  42. Mike F says:

    Steve O’Neil,

    The reasons are very valid: Heavy Sarcasm

    1) He didn’t help with recruiting as an example the one school board members kid was not pushed enough in the late 90’s

    2) He is not doing enough for former players hanging on the street corner.

    3) They only won 1 state title with him

  43. Mike F says:


    When i heard he was axed I thought there was a PSU/MSU situation. At the very least I was expecting he got to physical with a player. When I found out it was just school board politics, it made me sick to my stomach. I have no clue who they think they are going to get better on the field or off.

    No coach is going to be able to change the environment there. It is in the bottom 10% for education in this state and there are tons of drugs and no jobs in that community. The boards “reasons” are a joke.

  44. Jack1234 says:

    Yeah Erie high school and 5-6 Erie Mcdowell. Real powerhouses LMFAO. And PCC was weak last year as well. The school from michigan is ranked 112 by maxpreps, PR beat SJP that was a top 25 team at the time. Also imhotep was without their best player, and they truly weren’t anything special last year. PR has a better resume that is facts. Also coming from someone likely from erie that’s some thin ice your on making comments like “must be a burg thing” Lol

  45. Tully says:

    CP does play impressive non-conference schedule. Make me wonder why they are satisfied being in a watered down 4a despite the largest enrollment in that class. Couldnt be trophy hunting could it? Why not play Wood for that honor? Or better yet why dont both play at their weight in 6a where the caliber of their programs belong?

    What happened in Aliquippa a complete shame. Hearing pushed flr the normal politics and parent vendettas. The losers in it are the kids. Coach was a class act throughout.

  46. Phil says:

    @ Mike F
    Thanks for the info regarding the Aliquippa situation. Sources have echoed the same as you stated plus one other factor that does not warrant discussion unless proven to be true.

    If I may, I’d like to jump into the PR vs. ECP debate. Whether you are a PR fan, an ECP fan or just a high school football fan especially from western Pa., it is good to see great football being played here in the west.

    Jurkovec is probably the best HS QB I’ve ever seen, Mischler makes the top ten though. Bauer is definitely one of he better LBs I’ve seen. Roberts and Scruggs are great, while Kristofic and Crawford and Falcone are fantastic. And on and on it goes. Bottom line is both teams were loaded and I was blessed to see them both play at least 3 times the past couple years. Oh, by the way, you couldn’t ask for two better coaches who are easily accessible, very knowledgeable, and genuinely good guys. No predictions by me, but if someone came up with a high school version of Madden’s Game Day with these two teams on it, I’d play in an instant!!

  47. B. Powell says:

    May I also add, there is “life” in Erie, PA football again. Prep has it going ON and the McDowell vs Erie playoff game this year was epic. I listened to it on the radio and my eyes started to well up with happiness for those Erie High kids. For many of them it was the 1st thing of value they had won in their lives and the reformation of Erie High was done so quickly and came off as good as it could have happened.
    Add Mercyhurst Prep in the mix and Erie area has some fine athletes. D10 does pretty well in playoffs considering the city and rural demographic mix.

  48. phillyboy says:

    I understand this ECP team was very talented, very good but when push comes to shove PR would have taken them. I absolutely think St. Joe’s Prep would have beaten ECP, as well as Wood. My suspicion was that PR was the best after seeing how they were unstoppable against a highly regarded Wayne, OH team. My suspicion became a certainty after seeing how PR decked Saint Joe’s Prep in crunch time, that was a HUGE win. Believe me, SJP is a very tough out. I would rank last year’s ECP at #4 in the state after PR, SJP, and Wood. Erie Prep had a few decent wins, but you can’t play in the minor leagues and crow about being the best. Very rarely is the state champ in a lower classification the overall best in state. One notable exception IMO was 2011; that Wood team was off the hook at the end of the year.

  49. jacky1234 says:

    @b powell this past PR team had a bunch of other underrated guys as well, Jason defrancisis luke meckler mike katic luke meckler Anthony Cerminara etc. I just don’t believe that anyone in the state could beat them last season. I think the top 4 in the state were PR, SJP, Wood, and ECP.

    @phil you actually can if you have ncaa 14, you can create your own rosters, customize uniforms etc. You can also play in high school stadiums in the game I believe. I also have heard of people making wpial rosters to download.

  50. Friday night fan says:

    You have to realize CP lost two D1 D backs/ receivers mid season. There’s no way wood or SJP were better than CP.
    I think the top 4 were PR/ CP 1 or 2 respectfully then wood and SJP in 4 th place. CP takes the starters out in the third Quarter most game. I’m sure they would have beat a lot of teams badly, but the coach has class! And it hurts the national rankings that’s the trade off I guess.
    Jack LMFAO – you said CP should be playing 6 A teams? They do was my point jeryoff! They only played like 2 4A teams before the playoffs. They were forced to play region games.Who knows when you do scheduling in the spring what a team will be like next fall? Tell James Conner from Pitt/ Steelers that his h.s. Team McDowell is a joke big guy! Week one McDowell was beating Cleveland ST. Eds at half time, and they’re always ranked high nationally. The Wayne team PR played week 0 was obviously in a rebuilding year also. PCC was a lot better than Wayne. The problem with CP moving up to 6 A say in the playoffs would be they only have 130-140 boys per class. To play schools that have 300+ boys per class. It would be a depth issue. This 2018 class at CP was the best class football wise to come through the program according to the AD of CP. There will be a talent drop this year I think. Imhotep will be very tough this year!

  51. Mcd65 says:

    Friday night fan, Both Wood and Imhotep moved up a class beyond their enrollment classification. Why does CP continue not to move up ? I’m curious .BTW there is no way anyone can predict a games outcome if its not played. I can say Wood would beat CP , just as you believe the opposite. Take a look at who Wood played last year.Im sure you don’t look at those things outside of Erie. Pine Richlane was the best in Pa. last year IMO. Sauseman,I like your Jr.East/West idea.

  52. Friday night fan says:

    Maybe Wood moved up to get away from Imhotep in there districts? Imhotep beat Wood in districts 2015 if I’m not mistaken. And CP beat them in the state final 2012. So may be Wood doesn’t want to play them in the play offs? I’m pretty sure coaches ( some) have conversations wear not privy to. Like you said no one can predict out comes that’s why they play the games! Imhotep and Wood move up by choice, and Cp doesn’t by choice! I don’t really think they give a crap what guys on some forum are saying. All the team being brought up are 1 st class programs with great coaches! I’m not disrespecting any team. At least in the FBS they have closure with the playoff. They know who 1-4 are.

  53. Jack1234 says:

    Friday night fans you are one of the densists mofo’s I’ve talked to. Lol. yes erie mcdowell was a JOKE last season. Your bragging about beating a 5-6 team? Maybe I didn’t mention maybe beat good 6A teams? PCC was nothing special last year once again. So if the problem is not having the same enrollment numbers as the other big 6A schools and not having the depth to compete with these teams, then why in the hell are you suggesting that ECP would’ve beaten the top 6A and 5A teams as well last season? Literally every posts you have made has been hypocritical as hell lmao

  54. Jack1234 says:

    *most dense

  55. Friday night fan says:

    Jack I’m beginning to think your illiterate? McDowell is in CP region. They have to play them! Have you understood anything if said??? CP just had it’s best class Ever come through! Did I loose you yet?? We’re talking about last years team correct? YOU said they should move up in class and quit beating up on 4 A teams did you not?? They are playing 6A teams is the point! PR did not seat PCC any worse than CP did during the regular season. PR and CP were the only teams to beat PCC this year correct? They were not at there usual team agreed, but they still made in to The WPIAL finals. For example Bishop Hoban was in the top ten in the nation on max preps rankings. They had two common opponents with CP. they bot played Benedictine from Ohio. Cp beat them way worse. And they both played West Toronto Prep to about the same out come. So to me the national ranking aren’t that big of an indicator of anything. Meaning the top 100 teams maybe separated by 7 points or so. In the national catholic highschool football rankings Cp finished 3 Rd. Ahead of Bishop Gorman out of Vegas. I really can understand why people think you have to be in a certain class to be the best? I’m saying they don’t have the numbers to compete moving up most years. The last two years they could have talent wise yes, but loosing 2 D1 receiver/D backs and the lack of depth in back ups would have been magnified. Jack try to do some reading other than the Tribe review. I’m not the dense narrow minded one here.

  56. jacky1234 says:

    They beat crap 6A teams. Stop talking like mcdowell is even good, they were 5-6. With the D1 athletes ECP has on both sides, they should be beating teams like mcdowell. So if they beat the 6A teams they have to play, why don’t they move up then? Because clearly they have the depth to compete obviously. You seem to be avoiding that question.

  57. B. Powell says:

    There’s a chance for a schedule upgrade for ECP if they’re willing to play St Ignatius, St Edward, Thomas Aquinas or Cardinal Mooney. I see those teams looking for games this fall.
    McDowell and Erie high should try a few, too and with just a 3-team region, you’d think they could adjust what weeks and fit one in.

  58. M says:

    McDowell played St.Eds and Austintown Fitch last season. They used to play St. Ignatius, Cardinal Mooney, St.Eds, Austintown Fitch and Mentor all in the same season. Brutal schedule

  59. D10 Fan says:

    Iggys and Eds won’t play ECP anymore because it would hold no value to them since ECP isn’t in PA’s biggest classification. Something with Ohio’s point system for the playoffs, it discourages teams from going out-of-state to play teams in lower classifications. I think only CPs frosh can play Eds/Iggys.

  60. D10 Fan says:

    I miss the days when they could play though. Would’ve been some nice matchups the past few years.

  61. Jack1234 says:

    Although it’s been somewhat known, it’s been “officially” announced PR will play IMG academy for week 0 next season. Defiantly a year late but good for coach k for getting these types of game, great exposure for western pa.

  62. Billy Splain says:

    actually that wasn’t official and has been removed. No contracts signed yet

  63. WPIAL RULES says:

    IMG vs PR week 0! Would have been a better match last year!

  64. Billy Splain says:

    Id rather they beat a public school. The only solution to ending private school teams like that is to refuse to play them . my opinion

  65. WPIAL RULES says:

    @Billy we all know it comes down to PR’s ego! This might be the Year they get knocked down a peg or 2.

  66. Mike F says:

    I hope PR does not play IMG. The year to do it was last year not this year. PR is better off playing a Public power from Ohio like Mentor or Canton McKinley, Colerain, etc. i feel they lost too much to play a team like IMG (I hate the idea of IMG for all you Catholic haters you need to look at this outfit) and be competitive. My opinion of course.

  67. phillyboy says:

    philly to Billy: appreciate your opinion on ignoring and refusing to play these all-star type teams on principle and to not dignify it, but rather to starve it so to speak. On the other hand it could raise PR’s profile moreso so as to attract better talent to the program. So it is a little bit of a philosophical quandry.

  68. Billy Splain says:

    Philly, I have all the respect for Kasper. He takes his guys against the big boys all the time. Tep and a few others, they are ok but IMG is basically a pre-college team. I just don’t like what they stand for is all. But we’ll be there for that game rooting on the PA team.

  69. Mike F says:


    Agree 100%, people who hate the Catholic schools need to look at IMG. It really is a fraud to call them a HS team. Literally 100% of their team goes D2 or higher with most starters being D1 P5. The only hope a normal school had against them is that IMG is not gelling while due to conflicts on the team. They were ranked number 2 in the country last year for what that is worth so that is not an issue it seems. Again they are a joke to be called a HS team.

  70. WPIAL Rules says:

    @phillyboy….so this will help PR recruit better athletes? This would want parents to move into the school district? Just because they play IMG? Well, that sounds like a way to recruit, right?

  71. Jack1234 says:

    @wpial rules I think realistically the coaches and players both know this is game Isn’t very winnable. It’s to get exposure and experience against top level competition. There’s a chance of ESPNcoming as well. Are they doing it so PR is an attractive place for transfers that want exposure? Your guess is as good as mine

  72. SC says:

    state college will be the best public school in 6a football next year. will be interesting to see what the d12 to the western side of the bracket will mean. Doesn’t quite make sense considering the lack of competition d3 in 6a has given since CD won the championship. Unfortunate that a d3 or a d1 will make the championship. Any team coming out of the western side will effectively win now…

  73. Mcd65 says:

    PR will be overmatched for sure, but coach K is an incredible strategist and if there is a weakness he will take advantage of it. Yes, a PCL guy rooting for Pr in this one for sure.

  74. jack1234 says:

    I think Coatsville has a pretty good argument for that as well, and whoever comes out the WPIAL if it’s a public should be pretty good as well

  75. Jeff says:

    @ Friday Night Fan – I think your allegiance to ECP is clouding your judgment. I saw ECP and PR both play last year and have no ties to either school and IMO if they played it would be a very competitive game, but would give the edge to PR. If you think Mischler is a better QB than Jurkovec you’re delusional…not taking anything away from Mischler as he’s very good and expect him to do well at Miami, but Jurkovec is likely to be playing on Sunday’s in another several years, and there’s no question he’s a better athlete than Mischler.

    Most observers outside of D10 think it’s a joke that ECP plays 4A in the state playoffs, certainly all the fans in Eastern Pa feel that way (read the other boards), I don’t care what schools they play in the regular season, they are without a doubt one of the premier programs in the state and as such should at the very least be playing 5A in the playoffs. Also, the PIAA does not dictate what class a school plays, all they do is set enrollment guidelines and you can’t play BELOW that class, but nothing is stopping them from playing up like other elite programs like Aliquippa, Wood, and Imhotep do.

    Time for the PIAA to implement the success rule that was discussed on this board a few years ago. Since ECP won the last 2 4A titles that would mean they would play 5A the next 2 years, and since Wood won the last 2 5A they would move up to 6A.

    Your argument about ECP not having the depth to compete with the higher classes doesn’t cut it with me, their roster is as big as most of the 5A and 6A schools. Wood has a lower enrollment than ECP yet they play up in 5A, so why doesn’t ECP play up?

    The obvious conclusion is it’s easier to win a state title at 4A than 5A or certainly 6A, so apparently it’s more important to the administration to win a state title than do the right thing and play in the class they should be playing, the fact is ECP would still win titles at a higher classification because they have that good of a program, just not every year.

  76. Tully says:

    Tremendous post Jeff. Right on the money.

  77. Phil says:

    Coaches, ADs, media and fans need to pressure the PIAA into doing something, like instituting the Success Factor and implementing some sort of transfer rule. Meanwhile, the PIAA continues to sit on their hands and do nothing. While going to 6 classes was a step in the right direction for PA, transfer rules and the Success Factor would go a long way in leveling the playing field and making more competitive games during the year and especially in the playoffs.

  78. Drew says:


    While I do think the 5A discussion/criticism is fair I’d still like to point out that CP has benefited from one of the best SR classes in the history of D10 the past 2 years. The 3 years between winning in ‘12 and the back-to-back these past years they lost to McDevitt; didn’t even make it out if D10; and got blown out by TEP. Yes, those 3 years they were in the old 3A but their path outside of D10 was the exact same as it has been in the new 4A. The only change is everyone in D10 opted to avoid CP and they no longer are matched up with Wood in Hershey. IF they get back to Hershey this year I doubt they beat TEP with what TEP has coming back. So the competition outside of D10 is just fine in 4A. I will agree that i’d rather see them play in 5A but the notion that they’re going to sleepwalk to titles every year in 4A is false.

  79. sausmann9 says:

    I hope I am wrong, very wrong, but PR will get throttled on ESPN next season if this game is a go. IMG has more five-star (three of them as of now) than PR has all-state (two as of now) players on their roster. I can say this with 99% accuracy and that is IMG will get another half dozen four-star (or higher) players prior to summer practice starting and RP will get ZERO four-star or higher players by the start of summer practice. PR is a season late on this match up.

  80. David Mika says:

    We are moving the site to a new server. The forum will be shut down until we are done. I am going to shut it down at noon, Monday. Thank you!

  81. Tully says:

    Drew the new 4a is no where near as tough as the old 3a. Not even close. In fact just by math alone it is the lower 67% bubenrollment. You also lose perennial powers like Wood and West Allegheny. And who cares if ECP would occasionally runs into a superior team. Welcome to reality and isn’t the point to compete rather than choose the easy path?

  82. Offsides says:

    Cathedral Prep isn’t afraid to compete against anybody. They simply play where the PIAA puts them. The point of counting the number of boys in the school is to put them in fair classifications. They certainly aren’t afraid of any WPIAL teams. 4A playoff system is competitive for the schools in that class, that’s why they play there, that’s what the care about. Speaking of competing, how about all of the other 4A schools in D10 opting to “play up” to avoid Prep in districts, just to get dismantled in the next round.

  83. sausmann9 says:

    anyone have an updated roster for the Mercer County all star game this friday night at Greenville HS??? tx.

  84. Billy Splain says:

    Sausman….I will be posting the rosters for that, ken lantzy and the westmoreland game later today….We’ll have full game coverage, you going?

  85. sausmann9 says:

    @billy – yep, heading out to the Mercer Co all-star game at Greenville and trying to make it by kickoff. Leaving Lehigh Valley by noon hopefully w/ one stop near Clarion.

    Love that school Greenville where this game is being played, their new field is really nice, and Coach Stone and his crew are some old buds. I love that football up there too. Still have your small town teams that take a ton of pride in their programs ala Greenville, Hickory, Wilmington, Sharon back in D10 again now, etc…

  86. Billy Splain says:

    cool….our guy Shane Lux will be on the sidelines covering the game….rosters going up shortly

  87. B. Powell says:

    FLB stayed 4A with ECP this cycle.
    I guess we’ll see you week #12, but they didn’t run away this time.
    Figure it as a couple more weeks of practice for the younger kids before the D10 4A finals.
    You can dismantle us, how’s that?

  88. Tully says:

    Definitely agree CP will play anyone and always have a strong non-conference schedule. From the outside looking in tho it sure appears they are fine doing that as long as it doesnt hurt their chances for state championships. Seems thats the overall priority for the admins that make those decisions. It is crazy to suggest they should not fight at their weight class and play at least 5a if not 6a. I am talking caliber of competition not enrollment (the numbers argument isnt an argument especially when you are one the biggest and dominating in your current class). The new 4a in a six class system isnt anywhere as good as the old 3a in four classes where that argument might have held at least some water. Same goes for Wood and Tep. If I am that good I want to earn my rings against the best.

  89. sausmann9 says:

    a bit of info on Pine Richland’s week 1 opponent from USA today high school sports “Way too Early top 25”. If you have the time, watch some of the video on their linemen and how freakishly athletic they play.

    IMG Academy
    Location: Bradenton, Fla.
    17-18 Record: 8-0
    Final Super 25 Rank: 2

    The Ascenders can pluck the best talent around the country and they have won 37 games in a row. Of the top 50 senior recruits for 2019 in Florida, 11 of them go to IMG.

    The offensive line is impressive. It is anchored by: 6-7, 391-pound senior OL Evan Neal; 6-4, 345-pound senior Deyavie Hammond; senior Donte Lucas, a 6-3, 323-pound FSU commit; TCU commit Justin Osborne (6-4 and 275 pounds); and LSU commit Charles Turner, who is 6-4 and 260 pounds.

    That line will help open holes for two five-star senior RBs in Noah Cain and Trey Sanders.

    The Ascenders have two Div. I-level quarterbacks in David Baldwin and Bryson Lucero and Missouri-bound WR Shamar Nash.

    The defense is led by senior DE Nolan Smith II, a Georgia commit, LB Charles Thomas, a Michigan commit, senior LB Jaleel McRae, who is committed to Florida State, and DB Briton Allen.

  90. Offsides says:

    Nothing but respect for the Bison for deciding to play where their enrollment puts them and not being followers. I’m not promising any D10 title from CP, this is a whole new team. My point was the 4A schools playing 5A ball get their D10 title but then get mangled in the next round. Why not work all year to beat Prep and then compete against schools like your own in states.

    The last 4 years Prep lost to CASH and Wakulla, Fla. They then had to come from behind and rally to beat McDevit after a tough game with TJ and then got beat 40-3. The following year they needed a some 4th quarter magic to upset Tep in states and let’s not forget Berks Catholic going blow for blow with them in the first half this year, and it’s not like they walked all over Imhotep in the finals. If Cherp would let TJs kids play instead of telling them they aren’t good enough to beat a private school those games would be closer too.

    One thing for sure, Prep will have a tough time getting back to Hershey and even through the WPIAL and D3, that’s IF they get out of D10. Never say never FLB, just ask CASH.

    That’s ridiculous lol.

  91. Jack1234 says:

    Aj Beatty from bethel park appears to have transferred to pcc. He’s a player to watch, started as a soph and he looked good when I saw him play. How do some of the western teams outside of the wpial look this year?

  92. Pcc64 says:

    Jack what position does AJ Beaty play ? I doubt that the WPIAL will approve this transfer. I was told by Central principal that the WPIAL has approved one of the last 14 transfer requests (Approximately).

  93. Pcc64 says:

    I’ll be rooting for PR to do well against IMG. Personally, I don’t hate IMG, it’s a national type team and I admire them. FYI, I am a Central guy who lives half the year in the Pine Richland District, 8 minutes from NA and half the year in Florida, 15 minutes from IMG. I have some good programs to root for.

  94. Jack1234 says:

    @pcc64 he plays TE/DE. Isn’t pcc pretty deep on DE this year? If I remeber correctly they already have Dallas and few other kids that rotated in returning. I think if this new kids approved he can be a match up nightmare on offense, that’s if they throw him the ball this year.

  95. WPIAL Rules says:

    PCC64 AJ Plays TE and DE! If the WPIAL doesn’t approve it PIAA will!

  96. Pcc64 says:

    Jack, thanks for the info. I think they have some good defensive lineman but you could always use more. My inside source is no longer at Central so you know more about the Vikings than I do.
    WPIAL Rules, if he has legal representation he probably will prevail. But thanks for reminding me of that option.

  97. sausmann9 says:

    A big shout out to the kids that played in the Mercer Co v Erie Co all star game last friday night. Besser from sharpsville is one tough kid!!! I loved the fact that they played DEFENSE in this game. All star games have lost luster over the years b/c of the LACK OF hitting, attitude, and defense; not this game!! Kudos to the two kids from Sharon as well, tough tough tough! This was a fun game at a cool venue!

  98. river runner says:

    Rumors out of D9 that Sheffield maybe in some trouble. They may not have enough kids to support a team this year. Even with the COOP from Abraxas it isn’t looking good at this time. Could be another Warren County School joining Warren/Youngsville.

  99. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    WOW! Updated site looks great! Great work guys. Getting excited for the season to start. Save-An-Eye ALL-STAR game is this Friday!

  100. Billy Splain says:

    Thanks!! We’ll be there!

  101. D10 Insider says:

    Excited for the Save An Eye game too. Looks like the county will be the favorites this year with the city only being able to pull from 4 teams. Also, if you’re planning on heading out to see Mischler, Bauer, Scruggs, Roberts and Oedekoven you are out of luck because those all stars are already at camp. Should be a good one though, two great staffs going at it!

  102. Billy Splain says:

    Make sure u come say hi. I’ll be in my wpa green shirt

  103. B. Powell says:

    I hear a “success factor” has been approved by the PIAA, beginning season 2020-2021.
    These points will be accumulated by teams in the post season playoffs, correct?
    And for the sports of football and boys/girls basketball and perhaps soccer?

    Let’s see some more info from guys in the know.
    I’d think these points are only relevant (to be counted) during playoff advancement.

  104. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Billy-Seen you from a distance on Friday at the Save-an-eye. Had to big of a posse with me to stop. Thoughts on the game?

  105. Billy Splain says:

    fun game…great ending… should have pushed through!

  106. Mike A says:

    Anyone know what happened to the web site. Many of the links don’t work and the URL’s come back as invalid and most of the information is unavailable. Were they hacked?

  107. Billy Splain says:

    no idea, we are no longer affiliated.

  108. Mike A says:


  109. D10 Insider says:

    4A speaking, how is the WPIAL looking and has anyone heard anything about Berks and McDevitt? Assuming Imhotep is going back because they are loaded just trying to see anyone’s thoughts on 4A state playoffs. Love the site!

  110. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Who is headed to where on opening night?

  111. Billy Splain says:

    you KNOW We’ll be at the Wolvarena!

  112. D10 Insider says:

    I will also be in Turtle Creek. Gotta be the best match up in Western PA. Two of the best teams, where else would you go?

  113. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Thinking about heading down for Friday nights 8:00pm game with PCC and ECP.

  114. Foleman says:

    D10 Insider, Berks Catholic and McDevitt will again battle it out in the District 3 final. McDevitt has a ton of returning starters and is ranked 1 slot higher in the State Polls than BC. Berks Catholic might have the fastest backfield in Pa with Brandon George-FB who verballed to Pitt, Abdul MacFoy-6th in the State in AAAA 100 Meter, Quinn Foley-supposedly faster than MacFoy and Anthony Myers, they need to replace 4/5 starters on the o-line though.

  115. New2PA says:

    Come on down to the PR-IMG game. Maybe not as close of a game, but not many times you’ll be able to see multiple 4 and 5 star athletes on the field at the same time in Western PA!

    Will the PCC-ECP matchup be better this year? ECP lost a bunch?

  116. D10 Insider says:

    Foleman, thanks for the info. I’m well versed on George, he’s massive. Myers got a few reps last year too I believe and he was impressive. I think ECP lost a lot like PCC lost a lot the year before. Would have been nice to have these two teams play two years ago but what can you do. ECP will be competitive again, I’m hoping for a more entertaining game and I think we will this year.

  117. phillyboy says:

    jack, you out there? Calling 1-2-3-4 jack, jack1234. You’ve been awful quiet lately. Mum’s the word. Any insights or thoughts on the WPIAL 6A and 5A this year. Who’s the team to beat? [Every time I use that expression it reminds me of Jimmy Rollins who predicted that the Phillies were the team to beat in the preseason around 10 years ago. The Phillies started off the year with a bad losing streak so the headline in the Philadelphia Daily News was something like ‘Phils are the team to beat, and beat and beat and beat.’] But I digress.

  118. D9 BULLDOG says:


  119. Jack1234 says:

    @phillyboy been busy and this forum has been kinda dead this summer. Hope to see the discussion pick up during the season. The top 3 teams on paper in no particular order from 6A will be PR, NA, and PCC (per usual). It’s to early right now to pick a favorite as no team really has a clear advantage over the other, but if I had to pick (with some bias) I’d pick PR as the slight favorite. Their o line is going to be the best in the state, averaging 6’4 280 with multiple D1 guys on it. Their RB this year Is one of the fatest guys in the state and will be a threat to take it to the house everytime he touches the ball. Also the new soph QB has been looking like the real deal during practice and camp. He’s going to be a stud by the time he’s a senior. Also they Might have the best linebacker core in the state as well with Tyler king, Anthony Cerminara, and merrick Miller. Two sleeper teams in 6A are norwin and mount lebo. Both have very good skill players coming back, it remains to be seen if they have the lines and depth to compete with the big 3.

    In 5A I think penn hills is the clear favorite right now. Absolutely loaded with elite athletes, and they added a 6’4 WR transfer from PCC. If they can get it together and play to their potential they have a likely chance of being in Hershey. The key for them will be discipline (which has been their undoing in a ridiculous amount of games the past few years) and line play. Anouther team is gateway, although they lost a phenomenal QB they have elite skill players back including one of the top players in the country Derrick Davis. Their season imo will depend on the new QB(who Is a transfer from kiski area and I saw play against PR in 7on7, honestly did not look like that impressive) and especially their lines because when I saw them play a few times last year both their lines looked god awful and they truthfully made it to Hershey off their ridiculous skill players before abw exposed that. Wpial championship in 5A likely comes down to these two teams but 5A always has lots of good teams that you can’t count out, like McKeesport, West A etc

  120. Pcc fan 01 says:

    Central Catholic in 6A is looking like the top dog. Defense looks crazy good stacked with D1 recruits. D line is lights out big fast nasty. Has to be the two best def end combo in state with Dallas 6’4 220 and Beatty 6’5 230. Both fast strong relentless. Add 6’3 330 nose and Allen twins 240 at tackle. Umm this is high school? Good luck lbs and backs are hitters lights out!

  121. Jack1234 says:

    Stacked with D1 recruits? Outside of Dallas, Dodson, and Thomson who is D1 (Dodson and Thomson have Ivy League offers, Dallas is mac and fcs)? Also it’s pretty clear their HC and OC are very inept at offense. The offense I saw twice against PR looked like a joke that was wasting the talent they had. That’s been the story for a while now when they play a equal team or better. I’ll put pcc as the top team when they prove they can run an efficient offense and can beat nationally ranked teams.

  122. New2PA says:

    PCC Fan 01: Which kids have D1 offers besides the 2 Dallas has? I wasn’t aware that they had that much talent coming back after losing Green (ata Pitt) and another DE, all their LB’s, and Wethers and Laconi and Thomas on the back end?

  123. WPIAL RULES says:

    @ Jack1234 you are correct the OC is a complete joke. It appears that kids need to kiss his ass to be on his good side to see playing time! I think after the class of 2020 is done playing at the end of the 2019 season the HC may retire. If the HC retires, hopefully he will take the OC with him into retirement.
    PCC has to great QB and both are Juniors. Hopefully with that type of skill in the backfield they find some different plays instead of holding the ball on 3rd and long and running up the middle.

    @PCC Fan 01 – I have no idea what you are talking about, the only 2 on the D-line that has any offers are Dallas and Beatty. I’m sure other offers will come to the rest of the line after this season…. Maybe another will get D-1 but the rest will be D-2.

  124. Pcc fan 01 says:

    Jack and New, Dallas and Big nose are the only seniors on PCC d line! Dalls has two official more coming for sure from what I see hear probably Pitt. Beatty I was told was at Iowa and they loved him this summer coming to see him in fall, also Wisconsin, MSU and North western. Mac is all over him also. Elliott Donald soph already has ton of looks and was told Toledo offered. LB are solid and Dodson Columbia is Big physical shut down corner. Thorpe on other side has swagger and can play. Robson back at safety and solid LB. I’m telling you go see them in person. Was shocked at size and speed! Walked by me said shit looks like they play on Sat not Friday . Respect opinions just my observations no weaknesses I see on Def.

  125. Pcc fan 01 says:

    Jack and new2pa, just a fan here as I am alumni and work at pitt. I was at a practice observed and spoke to a few people, just my observations, and I agree would love to see off open and throw more and be balanced.
    Now Def from what I saw and was told look Big and fast. Dallas will have more offers no doubt. Allen twins and Beatty are juniors and Was told Beatty has lot of schools talking to him. Iowa had him at their camp in summer was told they loved him and coming in fall to speak to him, Toledo, Akron and Kent also. Allen twins lot of interest also from Mac. 330 NT 6’3 is fast and looks mean. Not sure if recruiting but should be. Soph Elliott Donald has Toledo offer already. Now with that said, Dodson is Columbia as he is a great student had others but school for him and football. Lbs are solid young and deep. Robson ack also on def and Harris so lot of junior talent here.
    Nothing personal I am a Mt Lebo fan also lol. Just I saw one hell of a team at practice for a high school at Pcc Go see for yourself. PR Oline against pcc d line might be a classic will be going to that stud fest for sure.

    Just a fan

  126. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    PCC is going to have their hands full next Friday with Erie Prep at a Neutral site. I was baffled by their offensive play calling against ECP last season. PCC may have more talent then ECP this season, However I think we all can agree that Coach Mischler’s staff can coach with the best of them. Should be a good one!

    P.S. Anything we should know about Wolvarena? Parking? Tailgating?

  127. ECL/METRO FAN says:

  128. Mike F says:

    Nice site set up good work Billy.

    Jack1234 says:

    “I’ll put pcc as the top team when they prove they can run an efficient offense and can beat nationally ranked teams.”

    Who has done this? WPIAL teams rarely play against nationally ranked teams that are not a fellow WPIAL team.

  129. Pcc fan 01 says:

    Jack and new, sorry didn’t mean to strike a nerve. I don’t have any kids or family on team just a pcc and pitt alum. A fan who attends some games. I was visiting and spoke to few people at practice watched. Now with that said I will say that def is solid period. I believe only two seniors on def line and lot juniors at lb and safety and corners. Thompson receiver and safety has d1 offers and Dodson does but all academics committed to ivy. Allen twins will and also. Elliott Donald soph d line has Toledo already. Beatty is being recruited by host of Big 10 including Michigan state, Wisconsin northwestern and I heard Iowa had him at their camp and love him. Might be be better tight end . Huge NT 6’3 330 looks to be a d1 also very quick feet for his size. Soooo not just one or two D1 prospect.
    I agree need to open offense up and be balanced if want to even think of beating east teams. PR has great o line one great backer and one good backer, but let’s be honest last year games were taken over by a special qb. Fan of his game and PR also, but won’t be the same without him. Will be very good but he accounted for most of td with arm or his legs. I am also a Mt Lebo fan hope that doesn’t get you more upset. great responses H2P first

  130. New2PA says:

    ECL: Parking at the Wolverina is not very good. Its tucked away in a valley. One nice sized lot but the stadium holds a lot of people. They may have shuttle buses running for this event though. I am not sure on tailgating rules.

    PCC Fan 01: I do agree that Jurkovec was special. But I think you overstated his impact a little in the first game (if that’s possible). Crawford had 6 rushing TD and 7 over all – in the first half. There was no more scoring.Of course, Crawford is gone too.

    Moderators: Why do posts take some much time to show up? You guys have day jobs that prevent you from being here every second of the day. LOL!!!!!!

  131. Billy Splain says:

    they are set to approval need because of spammers and people misbehaving….

  132. Pcc fan 01 says:

    let’s agree to disagree saw pine three times last year and EVERYTHING came off QB. Def drops they would run, pressure him he threw strikes or would see a hole and run himself didn’t he have more running yards then RB or close?
    There were better running backs in wpial last year then Crawford. QB set tone for everything. It was a good team without QB but great with him. Kid was a game changer.

    Sorry it is what is.

  133. Jack1234 says:

    @mike F they played two nationally ranked teams in 2016 and twice against one in 2017

    @pcc fan sorry no nerves struck here, I was just pointing out you were wrong. Receiving interest doesn’t mean they’re D1, I’ve seen plenty of guys recieve interest and never get offered. Until they’re offered by a school you can’t say their D1 (not to say they won’t eventually be). So 4 kids with offers then. Shows how much you know about PR if you think jurkovec was most of their success. They had one of the best defenses in the state, elite skill players all around, very good O Line, elite backs etc. Pretty much every starter had been in the weight room since the day after they lost to PCC in the semi finals up until the season. Obviously jurkovec accounted for a lot of TD’s he was arguably the best player in the country and he’s touching the ball every play, but Like new said Crawford scoring 7 TDs In a half or the defense playing lights out in clutch moments that must’ve been all jurkovec right?

  134. Jack1234 says:

    Hmmmmm Crawford averaged 8.8 yards per carry in 6A had over 1k yards and 500 yards receiving plus he scored 7 touchdowns in half against your supposed “stacked with D1 recruits” defense. Stats and film speak for themselves. I phil played O line and receiver and defense all by himself as well?

  135. Pcc fan 01 says:

    I may be mistaken but how many td did qb have and yards rushing? Lol come on don’t be mad good team. But great with qb. Sorry sounds as if one of the other kids is yours or family.
    Sorry again if it hits a nerve. Not like RB were like sanders when he was at Woody! Qb was at that level it is true. Lol I am being an honest fan of all of them and what I saw.

  136. Pcc fan 01 says:

    Jack who is d1 on or this year two lineman and Tyler king great lb? Honestly PR had a good few years PCC is good every year. No need to be mad. Again I am also a Mt Lebo fan. “Where I live”. Just Pcc alum sorry
    Not sure you are anything but a PR fan lol. Ya PR ran on mostly pass def! Everyone and I mean everyone knew can’t win unless you stop QB. Other coaches didn’t care about run! Lol really

  137. Jack1234 says:

    Seriously How old are you? You’re just gonna say “your mad” basically in every post? And I wasn’t saying Crawford was the best Back to come from the wpial, but imo he was the best back in the wpial last year.

  138. Pcc fan 01 says:

    NEW topic!!!!
    Bored with old one anyone know who will qb peters twp this year? Saw them last year and they had some really nice young receivers but qb graduated. not sure who can get them the ball this year? Any info?

  139. Jack1234 says:

    3 linemen are and king is. And if you think PR is done being good for the forseable feature you’re surely mistaken. They’ve always had talent in the pipeline, they were mediocre before coach K because they had a terrible coach. He comes in and now you’re seeing it on display. This team they have this year is going to be very very good, and the new QB looks like a good one. Your Arogance is making you look quite ridiculous

  140. Pcc fan 01 says:

    Really? You are obviously all in at PR and know very little or follow anyone else.

    Ok again done with topic and yes I don’t care for the love of god PR is good quit crying ha. I said in the beginning I like their team also just not in love like you! Sounds like you are not a phil fan ha….

  141. Jack1234 says:

    Not sure what any of that has to do with what I’m saying, but you seem to be the one that’s getting upset. If you don’t like what I post why don’t you just not look here? It’s simple.

  142. phillyboy says:

    Total respect for PR and Coach K, hope they keep it rolling. In regards to Crawford, without question he was the best RB in the WPIAL last year, heck maybe the state. Frankly I was surprised he didn’t get offers from some D1 schools. Maybe a school like Boise State or Pitt or even Iowa. I could see it, what he did last year was not in some youth football program, that was big time high school ball. Played large.

  143. WPIAL RULES says:

    If PR is so great and wonderful… why did the QB coach get caught recruiting out of Ohio? Why did the following happen at PR:
    1. QB coach was fired.
    2. OC was demoted to O-Line Coach
    3. Coach K was suspended over the spring until school was out in June?

    Oh wait… here it comes…. only private school recruit and PR is homegrown with White and Burns on the team.

  144. Jack1234 says:

    1. RB/assistant head coach was fired, had previous issues with administration was only a matter of time
    2.nope K was suspended during the investigation or whatever that ended around when school ended.

    Congrats, you’re wrong. Haven’t you said some other stupid stuff on here that was fabricated about coach k being suspended 4 games? You pcc guys crack me up. PR gets two guys last year (one was moving in w legal guardian) and you lose your mind but I guess when pcc gets guys over the years like justice Evans, weathers, Laconi, kyros Thorpe, Aj Beatty, Jacob hinish, cj Thorpe (I can keep listing) it’s all fine and they’re just trying to better themselves as “student athletes” right?

  145. Pcc fan 01 says:

    Man you still bringing this up!!! Wow just get it over with it and get PR tattoo on your forehead.
    Don’t drag me in on your crazy PR stuff!!! I was done yesterday with your one sided mind. You have nothing else to offer start a I love PR forum wow….

    Wow can you offer any positive thoughts for ANY other team in wpial?

  146. Pcc fan 01 says:

    On a another note good luck to all wpial teams scrimmaging this morning and prayers for safe healthy season.

    Can’t make any scrimmages today have a wedding to attend, so looking forward to some good honest reviews. Thanks

  147. Jack1234 says:

    Soooo you and wpial rules post wrong things and I correct that and that must mean I’m “mad” and I know nothing about the wpial other than PR? How childish are you? Go read my posts about the other 6A schools on the rivals forum. I’ll say it once again don’t like what I post don’t read this site. Simple as that.

  148. Billy Splain says:

    I opened the forum to posting out of kindness….you will notice your posts have been edited…no cursing, bashing, name calling, etc….all the stuff you have to tell children….it’s a forum for adult discussion….please keep it respectful

  149. Pcc fan 01 says:

    Agree sorry really have no desire for any of that. I apologize. Not even responding to that topic anymore. Just a fan of several wpial teams no negativity here.

    Nice set up of forum also

  150. New2PA says:

    Jacky is correct on the PR coaching situation.

    Anybody get to scrimmages? I was told that P-R looked really good on defense and passed the ball surprisingly well. Up the middle on defense was stout and new DE’s are very good but young. Secondary was not tested. OLine is dominated by seniors, skill by sophomores. Starting OL did not play much.



  151. Mike F says:

    Was at my in laws this past Saturday and read in the Butler Eagle that Butler HS has over 60 kids (up from mid 40’s last year) out for the Varsity football team this season and after not having a freshman team last year they have 40 Freshman this year. That is very encouraging for any school but especially one of the largest schools in the WPIAL as i feel those numbers are still low for a school that size. Hopefully those numbers continue to grow there, and else where. Not saying that I expect a better win/lose record, but it is nice to see participation going up some where when it seems like everywhere else the numbers are dropping. Apparently the new coaches really hit the halls hard and recruited kids. Good for them, that is what is needed today. Back in my day I went to 2 different high schools and the coaches never needed to do that for football, other sports yes but not football, the kids sought football out on their own. Hopefully there are enough coaches who are good sells-men going in these schools to get the numbers back up.

  152. D10 Insider says:

    I was disappointed Mentor cancelled the scrimmage with ECP, leaving them without a post camp test. It’s going to be hard for a lot of new starters to come out and perform under the big lights vs PCC. Prep is good, but not as big/talented as last year and PCC seems to be huge and fast. I just hope it’s not 40-7 either way.

    I think this one may come down to toughness and whose kids are better prepared. I have to give props to Mischler and his staff. They can dial it up.

    Early prediction Prep by 2.5 scores. Something like 35-14 or 35-21. Love the site!

  153. Pcc fan 01 says:

    D10 I think ECP experienced staff will have their team ready for Friday. I expect a good game and I agree their coach is one of the best around.
    I missed scrimmages Sat but was told PCC and McKeesport played their usuals hard hitting yearly event. PCC sat I believe 4 skill players 2 from def back field and it showed getting beat for two long passes. I was told Def line from PCC when starters were in shut down vaulted wing T run. Heard McKeesport kid Gaskins I believe could real good in 5A stood up to constant front pressure from PCC d line. Pcc off looked the same from what I heard and missed a lot of open receivers especially TE was open all game and yep didn’t throw once to him?

    ECP and PCC I believe will be a great game

  154. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Anybody have information for the event in Turtle Creek. Looking for ticket information or maybe a website with all the games.

  155. Jeff H. says:

    @phillyboy – Jack gave you his synopsis of 5A and 6A, and while Penn Hills does have a lot of skill players returning I would hesitate to consider them the favorites in 5A, as they have a history of underachieving the last several years. 5A is the deepest and most balanced classification in the WPIAL and has been since the move to 6 classes, not sure any other classification in any district in the state can count 7 former state champions among its members, and that doesn’t include Woodland Hills or Gateway.

    I like McKeesport this year and would label them the favorites, as Jack noted Gateway will be tough again if they can find an adequate replacement at QB for Brady Walker, and Penn Trafford is always very competitive having made the WPIAL final in 2 of the last 3 years (and should have beaten Gateway last year).

    Would also not count out new members Bethel Park and up and coming Peters Township, who along with Penn Hills dropped from 6A to make this classification even deeper than it already was.

    I also disagree with Jack about Penn Hills or any WPIAL 5A team making it to Hershey, the only reason Gateway got there last year was because Harrisburg was upset in the district 3 playoffs, and this year the path to Hershey goes through Archbishop Wood, enough said!!

  156. Jeff H. says:

    @ECL/Metro – tickets available at the gate, not sure of the cost, I’ll see if I can find that information and post, As for the games the list is as follows:
    Friday 5pm – Peters Township vs. West Toronto Prep
    Friday 8pm – ECP vs. PCC
    Saturday 11am – Imani Christian vs. Union (A schools, Imani Christian is one of the favorites to win the WPIAL title this year and lost a classic to Jeanette in last year’s title game)
    Saturday 2pm – McKeesport vs. Erie High (expect a very competitive game)
    Saturday 5pm – Aliquippa vs. McKinley Tech (Wash DC)
    Saturday 8pm – Woodland Hills vs. Woodrow Wilson (Wash DC)

    Limited parking in the stadium lot, additional parking available at the Woodland Hills Academy a couple of blocks away (former Turtle Creek HS building), also parking available on the side streets adjacent to the academy. Do not park in the CVS or Shopping Plaza parking lots as you will likely be ticketed and perhaps towed, more information available at the following site

  157. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    This is the only thing I can find:

  158. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Jeff-You left out 1 very important detail…… What about a local watering hole to have a few before the game? Anything decent?

  159. Jeff H. says:

    ECL/Metro FAN – not much to offer in Turtle Creek where the stadium is located, Shelly Pie’s has great pizza and lots of big screen TV’s but it’s a BYOB place, there is a local dive bar next door called Tin Pan Alley, both on Penn Avenue about 3 blocks from the stadium.. Another option is Churhill Haus on Brown Avenue/Route 130, which is about a mile or so from the stadium, depending on which exit you get off I-376 East (if coming from Erie will either be getting off at Forest Hills/Route 30 east exit, or Turtle Creek exit Route 130, the 130 exit is the more direct route with less traffic lights, and the Churchill Haus will be on the way to Turtle Creek on the left side in a small shopping plaza.
    There is also a more upscale place in Forest Hills on Rt 30 east called the Roman Bistro with lots of different beers on tap, that’s about 2 miles from the stadium and a 5 minute drive from there.

    I will be there and sitting on the ECP side even though I’m a WPIAL guy, like most of us diehards in the Pittsburgh area that are not PCC alums we generally root against PCC no matter who they play, and I thoroughly enjoyed the shellacking ECP gave them last year!

  160. D10 Insider says:

    Awesome information guys. I really appreciate the feedback. Especially about the watering holes lol. Excited for the showcase but shouldn’t the band have been WPIAL vs the World considering Erie High and Prep are both from Erie. Correct me if I’m wrong but isnt Erie on the western part of PA?

    I hope the PT/WTP game is a fast one. I’ve been waiting to see Central/Prep II for a year!

  161. Billy Splain says:

    The price for our showcase is $10 adult, $5 student both days. Tickets are for all day. Erie was scheduled because we needed another team. Parking at the High School with shuttles running to stadium

    Schedule is:

    5 pm Peters Twp vs West Toronto Prep Live Stream
    8 pm Central Catholic vs Cathedral Prep
    11 am Imani vs Richard Wright charter
    2pm McKeesport vs Erie
    5pm Aliquippa vs McKinely Tech Live Stream
    8 pm Woodland Hills vs Woodrow Wilson Live Stream

  162. ECL/METRO FAN says:


    Harrisburg Patriot-News

    Class 6A
    School (District) Record 2017 rank
    1. St. Joseph’s Prep (12) 13-1 2
    2. Pine-Richland (7) 16-0 1
    3. Coatesville (1) 13-2 3
    4. Parkland (11) 13-1 5
    5. Williamsport (4) 7-4 NR
    6. North Allegheny (7) 8-4 NR
    7. State College (6) 10-3 8
    8. North Penn (1) 9-3 NR
    9. Central Bucks South (1) 7-4 NR
    10. Erie (10) 9-3 NR

    Class 5A
    1. Archbishop Wood (12) 12-2 1
    2. McKeesport (7) 8-3 NR
    3. Penn Hills (7) 8-4 NR
    4. Whitehall (11) 9-4 NR
    5. Gateway (7) 14-2 2
    6. Hollidaysburg (6) 8-4 NR
    7. Springfield-Delco (1) 13-1 5
    8. Manheim Central (3) 13-1 3
    9. West Allegheny (7) 7-3 NR
    10. Meadville (10) 8-4 NR

    Class 4A
    1. Cathedral Prep (10) 14-0 1
    2. Imhotep Charter (12) 12-2 2
    3. Bethlehem Catholic (11) 13-1 3
    4. Berks Catholic (3) 13-1 3
    5. Bishop McDevitt (3) 10-3 7
    6. Thomas Jefferson (7) 11-2 5
    7. Valley View (2) 10-4 NR
    8. South Fayette (7) 11-1 10
    9. Bellefonte (6) 10-3 NR
    10. Berwick (2) 10-3 NR

    Class 3A
    1. Aliquippa (7) 12-1 3
    2. Sharon (10) 10-4 4
    3. Middletown (3) 14-1 2
    4. Scranton Prep (2) 13-1 5
    5. Loyalsock Twp. (4) 8-5 NR
    6. Conwell-Egan (12) 7-7 NR
    7. Wyomissing (3) 10-2 NR
    8. Grove City (10) 11-1 10
    9. Huntingdon Area (6) 10-2 9
    10. Mercyhurst Prep (10) 10-1 10

    Class 2A
    1. Southern Columbia (4) 16-0 1
    2. Steel Valley (7) 11-1 6
    3. Wilmington (10) 14-1 2
    4. West Catholic (12) 8-4 NR
    5. Dunmore (2) 14-1 4
    6. Ligonier Valley (6) 13-1 5
    7. Washington (7) 13-1 3
    8. Seton-LaSalle (7) 9-2 NR
    9. Clarion (9) 12-1 8
    10. Steel-High (3) 11-3 3

    Class 1A
    1. Farrell (10) 11-3 4
    2. Bishop Guilfoyle (6) 13-1 6
    3. Jeannette (7) 14-1 1
    4. California (7) 12-1 8
    5. Old Forge (2) 11-2 10
    6. Clairton (7) 9-3 9
    7. Portage (6) 8-3 NR
    8. Our Lady of Sacred Heart (7) 9-3 NR
    9. Rochester (7) 8-3 NR
    10. Williams Valley (11) 13-1 7

  163. Jack1234 says:

    @jeff it’s going to be hard for penn hills to underachieve in the regular season at the very least. playoffs are always a different story. The wpial put them in a weak conference (and I personally believe they dropped down just to play in said weak conference so they have an easy path to high seed in the playoffs). They’re going to have to try hard to fail with the type of talent they have imo. They shouldn’t have an issue breezing through their regular season schedule, and I heard they’re week 0 opponent will have a down year or something along those lines. Imo penn hills is the very clear favorite from the wpial in that class. I don’t know that much about the eastern teams but I do know that ABW lost a lot of their key players from last years team, they always field a great team yearly but you never know, guess we will just have to wait and see.

  164. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Anybody know if North Allegheny will play this Friday against COF Academy?

  165. Nate B. says:

    Billy are you doing a ranking this year of all the classes.

  166. Billy Splain says:

    Nate: Rankings coming Friday…. ECL: we have it covered!

  167. Jeff H. says:

    @Jack1234 – completely agree PH has a week regular season schedule and I could easily see them going undefeated, but I think they’ll get beat in the playoffs when they go up against a team like Gateway or McKeesport that is just as good as they are, time will tell.. I have seen them play numerous times over the last several years and the lack of discipline is always pretty apparent, it’s just hard for me to get past that and pick them to win the 5A title. Steubenville typically has a pretty competitive team so they should be a pretty good test, but maybe they are down this year, we’ll see tomorrow night!

  168. Jeff H. says:

    Intriguing crossover game tomorrow night when 5A Gateway travels to 6A Mt. Lebanon, expect a competitive game and good test for both teams, will give us an idea whether Mt. Lebanon can make a run at the big 3 in 6A this year, I have my doubts but if they can get past Gateway maybe they can hang with the big boys. .

    Looking forward to Jack’s commentary on the PR-IMG game, too bad they didn’t play last year because that would have been a tremendous matchup, still expect an entertaining game but I think PR will do well to keep it within 2 TD’s, I’ll say IMG 41-24.

    Regarding PCC vs. ECP, think most observers would agree Prep had more talent last year and the final score reflected that, this year the talent nod might go to PCC, but I still like ECP because of the coaching advantage, one of the best coaches in PA against a guy still using the Woody Hayes playbook, I’ll say ECP 31-21.

  169. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    Yes that is an intreging game between Gateway and Mt Lebo, I will keep my eye open for it.

    As far as the IMG/PR game. I hate this matchup. Yes last years PR would have been a better game but even then it is outrageous. People bitch on here about PCC/ECP/insert Catholic school name for recruiting on here all year long. Yet IMG is not even a school with a team like the Catholics have. It is a training center with a academic curriculum attached to it. This is not a good direction to take HS football, and I wish teams would refuse to play them. I say IMG by 3 touchdowns, anything more than that is a great job by PR.

  170. New2PA says:

    The thing with IMG that gives them a little bit of a pass is that they don’t compete for a Florida state championship. (They only hurt the schools they take kids from, not every school). Basically, they come, play and leave. Everyone moves on and a loss or a win is really just a test against the best of the best.

    I would have also liked for P-R to play them with last years team, but it will be a good learning experience for the P-R kids. PCC, NA, Mt. Lebo, Norwin won’t be anywhere near as talented as these cats.

    On the flip side of things, NA is playing a startup “school” that got shellacked 35-0 last week by some Canadian school. Much rather play good competition than a cupcake.

  171. jack1234 says:

    @jeff IMG struggled and was beat handily by a lesser public school team last week in a scrimmage. Although just a scrimmage, I watched plenty of the highlights and film, here’s a few things I noticed: IMG was beat deep on some passes and they were playing somewhat undisciplined getting multiple PI’s in the secondary. their O line is absolutely massive, but to me I think that’s an advantage to PR. None of those mammoths from IMG move very well, PR has better athletes and more speed on their D line, plus these kids aren’t small for PR either. IMG has a kid listed at 360 on their O line, these types of kids are always gassed by the second half imo. The PR kids believe they can win this and especially now after seeing the scrimmage film of IMG. none of the QB’s for IMG looked very good either, my guess is their going to be feeding the ball to their two stud backs a lot. If IMG struggles passing, PR defense is going to be stout against the run this year, that’s something to look out for. IMG didn’t look like they had much team cohesion either, and their players seem to hit the tweet button too much as well, a lot of egos.

  172. Mike F says:

    IMG 42 PR 0. Like I said, should never have been played. You want to play top out of the area teams? Then play top Ohio/NJ/Maryland or even a Florida SCHOOL. Don’t play a mini college team that looks nothing like a typical HS team.

  173. Jacob Manley says:

    Give credit to PR for playing a team of that caliber, guarantee no other team in PA would schedule them. The results have no implication towards standings or playoff seeds, and PR gets the experience of playing the best of the best. I’d rather them play good teams then cup cake teams. none of the schools pr plays will be even half as talented as this IMG squad was.

  174. PCC fan says:

    Hats off to all the teams who played tough opponents. PR Mt Lebo and PCC learned more about their teams no matter of score. Playing doormats shows you nothing.
    Saw Peters and Central both play and learned little about Peters as Toronto team was to be nice Awful not even JV quality.

    ECP and PCC was as billed. ECP is very well coached and reloaded. QB stepped up when running game struggled and def is fast and vey disciplined. Running back is Stud but struggled against good def.

    PCC def looked good after settled in with speed of ECP. Off struggled early until they found or started opening up and making def play honest. Gavin Thompson looks great. Fast great routes and hands like glue. AJ Beatty TE catch changed game and was a great red zone grab against good def. I thought his blocking in second half at tight end really wore down ECP def. nice to see a great blocking tight end again.

    Again games mean nothing but win lose tough games show you way more. Great job to the coaches who play the hard ones!

  175. D10 Insider says:

    Saw the PCC/ECP game and I agree that one was a good one. I would have loved to see CP get that onside in the 4th and either attempt a game winning drive or push it to OT. Even with the late start I didn’t want that one to end.

    CC converted turnovers into points, capitalized on the few mistakes CP made and not having a scrimmage really showed for CP. It didn’t look like they were ready for how physical that game was. I agree with scheduling greats, makes both programs stronger. Good luck PCC, represent for the catholic schools in 6A!

  176. Jack1234 says:

    Watched the PCC ECP game. PCC offense looks horrible. One dimensional and predictable. Looks like they went away from the pistol spread look they had last year and back to their I formation offense. Their defense won that game for them, the front 7 looks very stout. Secondary got beat deep a few times but QB for ECP struggled a bit and couldn’t connect. The new QB for pcc looks like he has some arm talent and they have playmakers on offense so it doesn’t make sense why they don’t open it up more. Perhaps because it’s his first start? PCC head coach and OC are wasting away talent, they should be much better. Can’t see them beating NA and PR if this is their offense.

  177. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider/PCC Fan – I too was at the game Friday evening and agree with all of your comments, PCC did wear them down a bit in the 2nd half, thought the lack of a scrimmage for ECP was a factor, and the interception was a turning point, could have run for a first down or at the very least gotten good yardage and instead made an ill advised throw on the run. Pretty well played game for the first game of the season, hats off to both coaches for scheduling this 2yr matchup, hope we see more of it in the future.

    Going forward think ECP needs to find more ways to get Lucas the ball in space, couldn’t understand why he’s in the backfield blocking on passing plays when they’re trying to come back, he is a good blocker, but put someone else in to block and get Lucas the ball more, surprised he didn’t get more touches.

  178. Jeff H. says:

    The most intriguing game for me tonight in the WPIAL is Norwin playing host to North Allegheny. Expect lots of points, Norwin has a high octane offense led by junior QB Jack Salopek, but think their defense is suspect, they will be involved in a lot of high scoring affairs this season. In a very competitive game I think the difference will be in the trenches, where I give the big edge to NA, I’ll say 34-27, but sure would be nice if another team can step up and challenge the big three. We’ll know a lot more about the pecking order in 6A after this game and the game next week between NA and PCC.

    In 5A certainly appears the top 3 teams are Gateway, Penn Hills and Mckeesport, all 3 had impressive wins last week against good opponents, was surprised Gateway handled Mt. Lebo as easily as the did. PH will roll big time over Latrobe tonight, Mckeesport will win fairly comfortably over Connellsville. Gateway hosts Penn Trafford in a backyard rivalry which is always a hard hitting affair, and a rematch of last years WPIAL title game, think PT will keep it close for awhile but Gateway has too much firepower and will win by 2 scores.

    Another interesting 5A game tonight is Peters Township travelling to Upper St. Clair, with Jim Render going for his 400th victory. I think Peters is an up and coming program and Render will have to wait another week for his milestone victory, winner of this game gets a leg up in the very competitive conference 1 (South, wish the WPIAL would go back to conference names!)

  179. Pcc fan says:

    Jeff fully agree with thoughts on games. Especially Peters they have great def and solid skill. My only question is QB very young. If he can manage game and get ball into quick receivers could pull the win.

    N/A and Norwin will be a great game. Skill qb goes to Norwin and line to NA. Big time players for Norwin show up strong and I can see an upset. Might head to this game instead of PCC as it might be better.

  180. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Not to many big games in D-10 tonight, but one that does stick out to me is Wilmington vs Farrell. Farrell is probably be heavily favored, but its always a hard hitting, action packed game.

    Other game of interest -St. Francis (NY) vs McDowell. Erie Prep has both of these teams on the schedule so I’m interested to see what happens tonight. McDowell got beat up by Seneca Valley last week. I believe this is the first game of the season for St. Francis.

  181. D10 Insider says:

    Erie is playing Austintown Fitch also up in D10. Prep is playing St. Joes from Canada who is rumored much better than Toronto Prep and the same affiliation to Clarkson who beat McDowell last year. I was surprised all 3 big D10 schools went down to Pittsburgh and came back with 3 losses I think 2 will bounce back this week.

    I’ve seen St Francis play for many years as an avid prep fan/supporter and they have been close to beating McDowell the last few years, I bet tonight is the night. I also think Erie bounces back but has to earn it. I will also be taking the Ramblers to even up their record and gain some momentum going into St Ed’s next week.

    Prep 42 – 14 St Joes
    Erie 30 – 28 Fitch
    St Francis 28 – McDowell 17

    Take em with a grain of salt gents, I was way off last weekend lol

  182. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    D10 Insider- I would agree with your assessment. Crazy to think that ECP and Ohio power St. Eds. could both be 1-1 next week when they meet as both teams lost the season openers. St. Eds lost their opener to Mentor 42-39, both of those teams started the season in the MAXpreps top 100 at 70th and 90th.

  183. phillyboy says:


    I didn’t know Mentor beat St. Edward, awesome. I think Mentor is one of those giant suburban high schools a la North Allegheny or North Penn. They seem to always have a good team, but I don’t know that they’ve ever won it all. Would love to see them finally take the Ohio Division 1 state title. I get why the privates exist, it’s almost a microcosm of free enterprise you might say and I totally respect that. But still, there’s something more compelling about a community based team’s journey to a state title.

  184. D10 Insider (Big School) says:

    St. Ed’s also lost to Cass Tech from Detroit this last Friday. Apparently they were winning late in the fourth and the Cass Tech QB scrambled free on a 4th and 30 and connected on a 65 yard (in the air mind you) cross body throw to the goal line for the 21-20 win. It’s on Twitter, one of the craziest HS plays I’ve ever seen. I can’t remember St. Ed’s ever being 0-2, gonna be a tough one for CP this week.

    I was definitely disappointed in St. Francis this year. I thought this was going to be one of their better teams. Maybe McDowell is pretty tough this year too. Gotta give credit where it’s due. Hopefully Erie can beat SFHS this week. McDowell will continue the Buffalo schedule with St. Joes. Rumored SJCI lost a ton and their returning RB was arrested and dismissed.

  185. Mike F says:

    Phillyboy stated
    “But still, there’s something more compelling about a community based team’s journey to a state title.”

    Maybe in the day when the communities were Berwick, Penn Hills, McKeesport, Aliquppia etc. Not very compelling when it is Pine Richland or the Mentor’s of the world. New communities that are start ups with no history and most of the players are 1st gen students in the district. Those first names I mentioned, you had kids who were 2nd, 3rd, sometimes even 4th generation playing for the district. That is compelling. At least that is how I feel.

  186. New2PA says:

    Pine(-Richland) won WPIAL championships in football in 1969 and 1970. I’d say almost 50 years playing football qualifies as a community history.

  187. Jack1234 says:

    Mike the amount of wrong things you post on here is hilarious. PR’s been around longer than that (Richland at one point). They also win mainly with kids that grew up in the district, you only have an argument against the Kenny white transfer and they still would’ve won states without him.

  188. Mike F says:

    Jack I love how you tell me how I am wrong on how I feel. LOL. I stated I feel schools with history are more compelling, as that is my opinion. If others don’t feel that way, fine there is no right or wrong.

    With that said, you must have reading comprehension problems to reach the conclusion you did. At no point did I say transfers, nor did I state that these kids are not home grown in the PR community. I stated that most (i would estimate probably in excess of 80%) of these kids are 1st generation students in that district, (i.e there mom and dad/ grandparents went to HS elsewhere other than PR or the schools that made up PR.) 20 years ago most of PR was still farmland and woods not the cookie cutter neighborhoods out there now. Are you really going to argue that?

    There is no history to sink your teeth into at PR and similar schools, like you can with a Penn Hills and talk about Bill Fralic, Tom Flynn, Neil Gordon the teams from the 90’s etc. Or the Quips where we would be talking for days on their history. Hell even Woodland Hills a still rather new district compared to most, has a ton of history. Most of those kids had parents and grandparents who played at WH or Turtle Creek, Swissvale, Churchill, Braddock, etc.

    With PR and schools like it, there is none of that as again barley anyone lived there it was farmland and woods. You can bring up 2003/4 and Neil Walker and then you bring up stuff so recent that the grads are still in college. But that is it. You are obviously are a PR fanboy and there is nothing wrong with that, but at least try to follow along to my thesis instead of imposing your angst into thinking I slighted your community. I understand it is a good school with a lot of upside and that is why many people move there because of that appeal. But it lacks history and to be offended by that shows how little poise you have.

  189. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Phillyboy-Mentor lost last year in the Division 1 state finals. They had a heck of a run though, beating St. Ed’s and St. Ignatius in back to back rounds. Lost in the finals the Pickerington Central 56-28.
    Prep vs St. Eds should be a good one. The fact that St. Eds is 0-2 is scary to me, albeit they lost to two tough opponents, those kids will be hungry. Prep got beat up vs PCC. Lost both starting DE’s, MLB, and a couple other guys. Hopefully those guys get healthy and can get back on the field this week. I’m guessing St Eds 31-Prep-28.

  190. phillyboy says:

    Yo ECL/METRO FAN, yeah I did check out the bracket from last year’s Division 1 Ohio tournament. Was ironic that they vanquished their two nemeses only to fall to a public that I believe had several L’s. After Pennsylvania, without a doubt I find the Ohio high school football state tournament to be the most interesting. I also like to see what’s up with the top Texas schools.

  191. D10 Insider (Big Schools) says:

    Ramblers and Royals hit the road and McDowell has another Buffalo school, all be it a depleted version of St. Joes who is without returning RB (arrested) and starting QB (transferred to HS in N.C.)

    Preps run game looked good against the Canadians but they were slow to go. They need more consistent play from the QB passing the ball if they are even going to think about repeating. It doesn’t get any easier for the Ramblers this week at St Ed’s, then Benedictine, then Canisius so hopefully they get it clicking. Also, where has the Seneca transfer Scarbino been? Not at LB, not at QB, is he still enrolled there?

    I was a bit surprised Erie only scored once against Fitch. Usually the single wing gets you a few times. The only team I’ve ever seen legitimately shut down the SW is Prep. Fitch must have a pretty good D. I like Eries chances if they can run the ball well and defend the pass, especially after catching the 2nd half of the McDowell/Francis game last week.

    My big school picks this week:

    Prep – 28
    Ed’s – 24

    Erie – 49
    Francis – 35

    Joes – 31
    McDowell – 21

    I think I’m 1-5 lol so again, take with a grain of salt.

  192. Jeff H. says:

    So much for the idea that Norwin might have a shot at challenging the big 3 in 6A this year, as they were overwhelmed by NA last week. Speaking of NA like their chances against PCC tonight, I saw PCC play against ECP and this is another typical PCC team like we’ve seen for the last several years under Totten, very good defense and special teams and mediocre offense, I don’t think they’ll score enough points tonight to keep up with NA.

    5A game of the week is Bethel Park at West Allegheny, IMO these 2 schools are in the next tier below Gateway, Penn Hills and McKeesport. I saw Bethel play last week and they are solid and think they’ll win a close one tonight on the road.

    Lower classes have some big rivalry games and rematches from last years playoffs, in 4A Belle Vernon hosts TJ, BV has beaten TJ twice in the last 3 years in the regular season, including last year, but TJ always beats them in the playoffs when it counts, I like TJ to win on the road tonight.

    Another playoff rematch in 3A with Aliquippa hosting Quaker Valley, I think the Quips roll tonight and exact a little bit of revenge for losing the WPIAL title last year, but the real revenge only will come with winning at Heinz in November.

  193. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    D10- Scarbino was out last week, he was still on the sideline however. Hopefully he will be able to take the field tonight.

  194. phillyboy says:

    I’m liking what I’m seeing with North Allegheny. Nice win over PCC. NA to PR: Take a seat boys, this is our year. NA might have something special brewing, we’ll see. I love their combination of smash mouth and talent. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again……major props to any former NFL guy who sends his kid to the big time public program and not to the sexy private program. IMO it shows mettle — mental toughness, independent thinking, and adherence to principle. I believe there was another son of an NFL player on PR last year. Totally respect that. In Philly the NFL guys all tend to send their kids to St. Joe’s Prep, it’s corny.

  195. WPIAL RULES says:

    @ Phillyboy…. Porter’s kids did transfer from North Catholic to NA after someone special lost their coaching job at North Catholic!

  196. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Speaking of young Mr. Porter, I see he just committed to PSU. Congrats young man!

  197. Billy Splain says:

    Hi gang…wanted to point out a new feature on that will begin later tonight….. Beyond the Keystone, a new feature for we’ll have reporters traveling the country bringing you features from games in other states..

  198. Jeff H. says:

    @Phiilyboy – it’s pretty apparent NA and PR are head and shoulders above the other 7 teams in the WPIAL in 6A this year, they don’t play until the final week of the regular season, and would expect a rematch at Heinz Field for the championship. NA should roll until that final game, Seneca Valley may give them a decent game in 3 weeks, but game at NA so would be surprised if they beat them, they also play a very solid West Allegheny team the week before PR, and if they are looking ahead WA might give them a run, but think NA too big on both lines and will ultimately wear WA down.

  199. Steve says:

    Who is McDowell playing on 10/19 weekend? Ashtabula Lakeside sure thinks they are:

    Also, this site is showing a 2nd McDowell vs Buffalo St. Joes game on 10/26. Is that correct?

  200. New2PA says:

    So, trying to figure out the WPIAL 6A and the two big question marks are PR and PCC. THrowing out IMG, PR hasn’t played anyone of note. Have a Norwin team this week that seems like a lot of noise but no substance. PCC has played SV and Hempfield in very close game, but those two teams are average at best. But they did beat ECP. So, that’s the question – is ECP down? DId they play a bad game? Or is PCC that good?

  201. Jack1235 says:

    Jeff, I agree with you. I think pcc is a year away from being a tough team. Very junior heavy this year with some sophomores seeing lots of time. Lost playmaker Robson for the season against NA, tough blow for them and the kid after missing all of last year as well. After a close game with Hempfield the past week people are wondering how good they really are this year. Seneca valley is pretty good this year and I expect them to give PR and NA battles but I also heard their starting QB was injured again last week and will be out for some extended time. The backup has a start this year (against pcc’s talented defense) and played pretty decent. Something to keep an eye out for.

  202. D10 Insider says:


    To answer you’re questions about ECP:

    Are they down?
    Well, anyone would consider this team down after graduating the past 2 or even 3 senior classes they had. This team is solid, but not the caliber of recent years, yet.

    Did they play a bad game?
    They certainly didn’t play good enough to win. I think the lack of a scrimmage game plagued ECP from the start. That score may have been different had that happened. Not sure who to blame on that one.

    Is PCC that good?
    I was impressed with their front 7 and their offensive line. Again, ECP isn’t what they have been but still formidable and PCC owned them in the 2nd half. Any team that can line up, with the other team knowing what’s coming, and still can’t stop it is pretty good. So I’d say yes. They’re pretty good.

    Prep did get slaughtered by St. Ed’s. I’d say St. Ed’s Beats PCC by 3 scores.

  203. New2PA says:

    D10 – thanks.

  204. Jeff H. says:

    New2PA – PCC is a decent team but nowhere near as good as a few years ago, agree with Jack they will be better next year. I think they are going to have their hands full with a very solid Bethel Park team this week and wouldn’t be surprised at all if they lose, I also expect PR to beat them by a couple of TD’s next week, and could see the final score being very similar to what NA did to them a few weeks ago, as they will have lots of problems moving the ball on offense and scoring against PR’s defense. I would be very surprised if PR and NA don’t play in the WPIAL final in a couple of months, I don’t see PCC, SV or Mt. Lebo beating either of them in the playoffs.

    @D10 Insider – completely agree the lack of a scrimmage before the PCC game was a factor, I was there and like you mentioned PCC wore them down in the 2nd half and part of that was due to not having a scrimmage, their offense was also not sharp, some due to PCC’s defense, but lots of new personnel and the lack of a scrimmage were also factors, I personally think if they played again ECP would win.

  205. Jeff H. says:

    I see mostly 5A teams in person each week so I have a pretty good handle on that classification, and after watching them barely escape a mediocre WH team last week I will say unequivocally that Upper St. Clair is overrated, many state wide polls have them in the top 10 (PennLive has them #6 this week), and they’re just not that good. Render’s teams rarely beat themselves and are always well coached, I just don’t see a whole lot of talent this year. I think there’s a good chance they lose to West Allegheny tomorrow night, and expect them to lose to both Mt. Lebanon and Bethel Park later in the season.

    Seems pretty clear at this point that Penn Hills and Gateway are a level above everyone else, and then there’s a handful of good, solid teams after that, with not much separating McKeesport, Penn Trafford, WA, BP, Peters, etc.

    Another overrated 5A team is North Hills, PennLive has them #10, I think they lose to Peters Twp tomorrow night and then get rolled by Gateway next week.

  206. phillyboy says:

    Yeah checked out the schedules of Penn Hills and Gateway, so far so good. Based on the results I would give the slight edge to Gateway. Would love to see one of those guys take out Wood in the playoffs. Tired of seeing them steamroll to the 5A title. And good luck to Erie High, seems like they’re making progress. They may be able to usurp the dominance from ECP as that program gains momentum.

  207. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Pittsburgh Central Catholic is now 4-1 but sheesh that’s a shaky 4-1 if you asked me. It used to be that they’d win every game by a score of 45-7 give or take a few points. Looking forward to the PR game this upcoming weekend. After dealing with the likes of IMG Academy, PCC will feel like a li’l bitty all star team.

  208. D10 Insider says:

    Phillyboy – Erie is on the rise and can compete with the likes of McDowell, but neither are on Preps level right now. Even during a “rebuilding year” for ECP. I watched that game last night, and was able to see Prep brave out the storm the night before.

    My take away is Prep is the only team that is working on defense in region 8. Erie’s special teams lost them that game last night (43-41) McDowell is very slow on defense, and not explosive on offense. Henderson was a disappointment. Erie is explosive on offense, but can’t play a lick of defense. Both special teams looked like it was their first time going out there. McDowell had a chance to blow that game wide open and couldn’t do it.

    Prediction: Prep mercy rules both teams.

  209. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    He’ll yes USC is overrated they have been since the mid 2000s. They are not well coached, whatever Render used to have he lost it at least by 8 yearsago when I moved in this district and started following them. they beat up on bad teams but as soon as they play a good team they fold at first sign of adversity.

  210. Jeff H. says:

    @PhillyBoy – I don’t think PCC will give PR much of a game this week, might be close for awhile, but PCC will have lots of problems moving the ball and scoring on PR’s defense, expect the final score to be something like 28-7. Only team in the WPIAL that has a chance to beat PR this year is NA, and at this point I would say PR would be about a 1 score favorite in the final game of the regular season, would also be shocked if those 2 don’t meet at Heinz for the title.

  211. New2PA says:

    I’m looking to see if P-R can pass the ball against PCC. If they can do that, then I think they have the inside shot to the championship. There is little doubt they can run the ball, but they need something from the pass game when teams start crowding the line with reasonable athletes. I thought Norwin would be that test, but their big guys didn’t really show up. Maybe PCC will be better.

    The P-R defense is the best I’ve seen since the 2015 PCC defense that had something like 9 or 10 D1 players on the field.

  212. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    @ New2PA

    You made some nice points about the PR – PCC game but conspicuous by its absence was a prediction. Do you think PR can pull the upset and take out PCC?

  213. New2PA says:

    Upset? P-R is the #1 team in the WPIAL and have trounced everyone they have played besides IMG.

    Pine-Richland 41 Pittsburgh Central Catholic 7


  214. Jeff H. says:

    @New2PA – agreed, as I stated earlier I think PR wins this game by at least 3 scores and doesn’t get a real challenge until the last game of the regular season against NA. Good point about the passing game, I don’t think they are going to need it to beat PCC or any other WPIAL team until they get to NA, but they will need to be able to pass the ball effectively if they’re going to advance in the state playoffs. PCC does have the best defense they will face for the next several weeks so will be interesting to see if they can make some plays in the passing game.

  215. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Seneca Valley is a beast this year, almost took out NA tonight. And almost beat PCC a few weeks ago. If I remember right, didn’t that Scarabino kid transfer out of there to join Erie Cathedral Prep? See, if he had just stayed there that could have made the difference, they could have been the top dog in the WPIAL 6A this year. Meanwhile ECP is dogging it this year. Huh-huh, a bit of poetic justice I guess.

  216. D10 Insider says:

    Speaking of poetic justice, check your facts. Scarbino transferred from Seneca, a small AA county school. Maybe if you knew anything I would reply to your “ECP dogging it” this year comment but clearly you don’t know what your talking about. Huh-huh, lol

    Also, he transferred to prep and was listed 3rd on the depth chart at QB and got beat out by a sophomore at MLB. AAAA isn’t AA and most certainly isn’t big time 6A WPIAL ball, I doubt he would be the difference maker if you were even close to being right. The kid does have a TD in the last two games and is playing DL now. Making his presence felt.

  217. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Yo D10, look man, I’m way on the other side of the state in the opposite corner. I’m lucky I knew about Seneca Valley much less Seneca. You guys were talking about this transfer last year. Huh-huh, I must confess, I wondered why he would transfer from the Pittsburgh suburbs (that’s where SV is located, right?) all the way to Erie. Ah, now it makes sense. Do appreciate all your insight though.

  218. New2PA says:

    Had the score almost right for offensive TD’s in the P-R vs. PCC game!

    Didn’t think about the onside KOR for a TD or the Pick-6.

    PCC Defense is talented. There are no words for their offense.

  219. D10 Insider says:

    I can see where one would get confused. My apologies if I came across harsh I couldn’t tell if that was a shot at prep or not. It’s hard to sense emotion in a forum. Most people hate ECP and I for one will stick up for them when anyone comes at them because not a lot of people like them. They play McDowell next week!

  220. jack1234 says:

    @phillboy SV is very solid this year and when healthy they might be better than PCC just due to the fact that they can actually score some. NA might’ve had an off night on offense but SV has a good defense.

    My thoughts on the PR-PCC game is that PR dominated the first quarter and they had a chance to put the game away and mercy rule PCC in the second. Coach K got too comfortable and called an onside kick that wasn’t executed properly and was returned for a TD. That was a huge play that gave PCC some life and then their defense started clamping down and making tackles and stops. PCC’s defense in the second half was playing well enough for them to win imo. Their offense was whole other story. Atrocious doesn’t even begin to describe. After a pick 6 from PCC defense I think they were within three scores and with the way their defense was playing if they were anyway competent on offense they easily could’ve come back into it. Between the turnovers and bad play calling it was just a mess for the start for them. I think they had something like 7 or 8 turnovers on offense and special teams, and they easily put the ball on the ground at least 10 times. PR’s defense made some great plays to force turnovers but some were bad mental mistakes. PR didn’t play a clean game themselves either, had a few costly turnovers that gave PCC some momentum and they went flat on offense in the second half. PR passing game is still a work in progress imo, which is what was to be expected after losing phil and all those receivers. They missed on some open passes that would’ve been touchdowns, one particular where a pcc DB tripped up and the receiver was wide open and had an easy walk in but he alligator armed it. PRs running game has been very dominate so far, but they need to hit some of these passes that are open. They haven’t had a intermediate-deep passing game this season yet. WR’s are getting open, QB needs to hit them in stride better.

    My take on PCC as a team is that their defense is very good with some depth there and none two way kids, but unless they change something on offense they aren’t going anywhere this year. They are a young team but some of the stuff they run and call is head scratching even as an opposing fan. PR

  221. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Good info jack. Should be interesting to see PR and NA go toe to toe later this year. They seem fairly evenly matched when analyzing the results of common opponents.

  222. D10 Insider says:

    I know I mostly talk about the bigger D 10 schools but I have to draw some attention to the Northwestern Wildcats out in Albion. I blinked and they were 5-1. Coach Brooks (former ECP DL) has a great thing going out there. It takes a special guy to get a group of teenagers and a community to buy in like they did.

    It’s rivalry week in Erie with the two biggest dogs in the yard going at it Friday at the Vet. McDowell is coming in at a surprising 4-2 but credit is deserved because they find ways to win. If they can get by Erie in districts I still don’t see them beating SC. CP is starting to click with the new QB under center and if healthy look like they could make another run. The WPIAL and D 3 winner will be a very tough game for the Ramblers.

    I know I said it earlier I think the mercy rule is coming in this one. I’ll say it again. Roll Ramblers!

  223. WPIAL Rules says:

    Big Changes coming to PCC Offense…. This could be the start of good things to come! We will see this Friday! Exciting times back at PCC.

  224. New2PA says:

    @WPIAL: Is PCC going to spread things out and throw the ball? Or put #5 at QB full time? Or play some of those defensive guys on offense?

  225. WPIAL Rules says:

    @New2PA: That’s crazy to think that they will change the play calling. LOL!

  226. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – TJ is a huge favorite to win their 4th straight WPIAL title, but for the 4th year in a row expect them to lose to Prep in the quarterfinals, think the game will be a lot closer than last year but like Prep’s chances, agree with you about the D3 winner, either Bishop McDevitt or Berks Catholic again will provide a tough test in the semi-finals.

    Also agree that neither McDowell or Erie will beat SC, speaking of SC they have a big game this week against Harrisburg that will tell a lot about how good both teams are, Harrisburg has been playing very well since getting blown out by Coatesville in the first game of the year.

    There will not be a D10 vs. WPIAL matchup in 5A this year, as 16 teams make the 5A WPIAL playoffs, and the winner enters the state tournament in the semi-finals to almost certainly face Archbishop Wood, since the PIAA flipped D3 and D12 in 5A and 6A for the next 2 years.

  227. D10 Insider says:

    This site and the Erie paper only picked Prep to win by 10 points. Maybe I’m missing something here. I guess their have only been 2 or 3 blowouts in this rivalry the past 10 or so years so maybe it will be closer than I think. It was also brought to my attention that these seniors of McDowell beat Prep at the JV level TWICE (34-6 and 27-6) when they were sophomores maybe they have their number.

    I’m still taking the Ramblers: 42-14

  228. Jeff H. says:

    Looks like Gateway made a little bit of a statement on Friday with their 63-3 shellacking of previously undefeated Franklin Regional, rolling to a 56-3 halftime lead and coasting to the victory. I have not seen Gateway in person yet this year but appears they are even more dominant than last years team that won the WPIAL title and advanced to the state championship game where of course they were beaten up by perennial power Archbishop Wood. They have not missed a beat with Brendan Majocha replacing the graduated Brady Walker at QB and in fact their offense may be even more explosive than last year.

    Looks like Gateway is the team to beat in 5A in the WPIAL, Penn Hills is obviously very good and has a lot of weapons but at this point I’d say Gateway is the clear favorite, imo they just might be the best team in the WPIAL this year, including PR and NA.

  229. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Wow Jeff H., nice, will have to check out Gateway on the triblive website and hopefully later in person if and when they meet Wood. Best wishes to the Gators, hoping they bring it big time.

  230. Jeff H. says:

    @ The artist – TribLive has a real nice write-up on QB Brendan Majocha, he was their player of the week. I thought Franklin was going to keep it close for awhile and end up losing by 2-3 scores, similar to the way Gateway pulled away from Penn Trafford to beat them 27-7 earlier in the year, but Gateway just smoked them from the start.

    Will be interesting to see what happens between Gateway and McKeesport in 3 weeks, their games are always a slug-fest, but the way Gateway is playing hard to see McKeesport staying within 2-3 TDs. Gateway’s defense is a lot better than last year and their offense is just as good, if not better, which is saying something because Brady Walker was an excellent HS QB and finished 2nd on the WPIAL all time passing list.

  231. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Yeah Gateway is another one of those prominent programs like Woodland Hills that has never one the big one, PIAA gold baby. Even remember about 10-12 years ago they were ranked in the preseason USA Today Super Prep 25, then they kind of fizzled. Man, if they’re for real, would love to see them kick Wood’s bootox. I’ll be out there doing the giant arm clap like Tim Tebow, you kidding me?!

  232. Jeff H. says:

    @ The artist – I’m with you, I’m a Woodland Hills guy myself but would certainly love to see Gateway, or anybody else for that matter, knock off AW. Doesn’t appear AW is as dominant as they have been in recent years, will be interesting to see how they fare against SJP this week, but I’m not sure Gateway has made up the huge gap from last year, we may find out because there’s a good chance they’ll be playing in the Western finals in 7 weeks.

    And you had to mention WH not winning the big one, us Woody High faithful will go to our graves believing we were a better team than Neshaminy in 2001 and would have won that game if it was not played in a torrential downpour and Steve Breaston didn’t sprain both of his ankles in the quagmire (that was pre-turf at Hershey, the field turned into a mud pit). I’ve watched high school football for 45 years and Breaston in his senior year was as dominant as any offensive player I’ve seen.

  233. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    @ Jeff H. — You’re probably right, the best team doesn’t always win. That Woody team was favored and more talented across the board. But Neshaminy with their horse Brittingham and hard nosed play along with good fortune was able to pull it out. I’m sure it hurt, that was the year they should have taken it. I was always curious about that game so I bought the DVD from PCN just a few years ago. I knew the outcome of course but was still intriguing to see it play out. One other thought: what about 2009? Didn’t WH win the WPIAL that year and then lose to State College in the western final who in turn lost to LaSalle? Perhaps another missed opportunity. Yeah, the old D7/D1 (highest classification) state finals were awesome. If the WPIAL champ can handle SJP in the semifinal there’s a good chance it could happen again. Tall order though.

  234. New2PA says:

    @artist – the only chance D7 has to beat SJP is if P-R wins the WPIAL and beats State College. I don’t think any other team can score enough to keep up with the SJP QB.

    @WPIAL_Rules – how was PCC’s new offense this past week? Did they do anything differently that gives you hope that things might be changing?

  235. Jeff. says:

    @ artist & New2PA – I don’t think the WPIAL winner, which I believe will be PR, will beat SJP this year, it certainly appears SJP and Coatesville are the 2 best teams in 6A and are the clear favorites at this point to meet in the final. PR would certainly not be intimated by playing SJP like a lot of teams are, I just think SJP has too much firepower this year and will beat them, but you’re right, PR is the only WPIAL team that has any shot.

    Regarding the 09 Woody High team, they sustained some significant injuries in a bruising 10-0 victory over Gateway in the WPIAL championship game so they were crippled when they played SC the following week, their top 2 running backs didn’t play (one was Lafayette Pitts who went on to play at Pitt and is now playing for the Bills), and several other starters were banged up, so they didn’t have much of an offense against SC the following week.

    01 was definitely their best team, they went undefeated again in 02 before losing in the state final that year to a better Parkland team with Austin Scott. Woody’s second best team was 99 when they won the WPIAL and then lost a classic to Erie Prep 27-23 on a last minute TD, that was one of the best HS games I’ve seen in person as there were several future NFL players on the field for both teams. ECP then had CB West on the ropes in the final until they blocked a punt for the winning TD very late in the 4th quarter for a 14-13 win and their 3rd title in a row.

  236. Jeff H. says:

    I never thought I’d be typing this a month ago but the 6A team on upset alert this week is Seneca Valley when they host 5A Woodland Hills, who at 2-5 is much better than their record indicates and have been getting better each week. The reason WH has a good chance to pull the upset is their defense, having given up only 7 points in the last 4 games, which include shutouts over Baldwin and Kiski; while both teams are mediocre they each have scored at least 21 points in all of their other games this year, and neither came close to scoring against WH. The only TD the defense has given up over this 4 game stretch was on the first drive of the game 2 weeks ago to West Allegheny, the defense shut them down after that and their only other score was on an 85 yard kickoff return after WH had tied the game at 7-7 early in the 4th quarter.. In the narrow 16-14 loss to Upper St. Clair 4 weeks ago the defense dominated SC’s offense and all their points were scored by their defense on a pick 6 and special teams (safety and fumble recovery in end zone when WH was punting) .

    Obviously SV has a very good defense, so this certainly looks to be a low scoring game similar to SV losing to NA 10-6 a couple of weeks ago, I think SV might be looking ahead to playing PR next week and ripe for an upset, I’ll say WH wins 13-10, which would surprise some people given the records or each team and 6A vs 5A.

  237. Mike F says:

    Wow it is dead in here? Does anyone follow HS football anymore? Let’s try to get this place alive again.

    NA vs WA tried to implement a running clock the entire game, but now that is against the rules it is a normal game. What does everyone think of their initial plan? While I understand the reasoning, I think it was crap and I am glad it is now a normal game.

    Playoff are coming soon. Who are favorites, contenders, and pretenders. I will answer in another post

    What classification does everyone think is the deepest/most interesting to follow this year? I say 2A. Both WPIAL wise and WPA wise.

    How has attendance/environment been at the games you attended? Must admit neither attendance nor environment have been good at most games I attended. Mostly USC games still.

    Come on lets get the talk going?

  238. New2PA says:

    I like this site because it has different posters than others. But the layout makes it hard to follow things. Adding topics would help alot instead of one long page.

    I’m excited for this weeks game. I think SV and PR could be a good one. SV defense is playing great and they have some size to match up with PRs OL. I’m not convinced they can score enough. P-R needs to cut down on penalties and continue to get better passing the ball. If they can do that, they have a great shot to get back to Heinz.

  239. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Yo Mike F, I hear you clucking big chicken. I tell you right now, the sexiest potential match up is St. Joe’s Prep – Coatesville in the state final of the ‘main event.’ SJP is the clear favorite, they just throttled Wood last week and have beaten some pretty stiff competition. Meanwhile Coatesville has a pretty special core group; just don’t know if it’s enough to stop the Prep train. Prep got so much talent and depth. If a key player gets hurt, they don’t lose so much with the replacement (Heck, PR might have won the ’14 state title if John Reid didn’t have a season ending injury. Swift, the replacement, although just a sophomore probably helped their cause more so). That’s why I absolutely believe teams like PR, NA, Harrisburg, Parkland, Wilson West Lawn, North Penn, etc. should stack their teams with the best talent possible to push back. There should be more proactiveness amongst the established programs. Would love to see the WPIAL 6A champ take out Prep in the semifinal actually. Coach K and Art Walker, dudes are class acts. I don’t go to so many games in person anymore, but I tell you for the that semi I’ll have to break out my leather jacket and get myself a 24 oz. hazelnut coffee with Irish cream at Wawa beforehand, you kidding me?!

  240. Mike F says:

    Here is where I stand this week

    WPIAL State
    6A- Favorite: Pine Richland St Joes (Why they are WPA is beyond me)
    Contender: North A Pine Richland
    Pretender: SV/PCC North A/ Coatesville

    WPIAL State
    5A- Favorite: Gateway Gateway
    Contender: Penn Hills West A Manheim Central/Penn Hills
    Pretender: McKeesport/PT West A

    WPIAL State
    4A- Favorite: TJ TJ/ECP
    Contender: South Fayette Bishop McDevit
    Pretender: Blackhawk/Belle Vernon Pottsgrove/ Valley Veiw
    WPIAL State
    3A- Favorite: Aliquippa Aliquippa
    Contender: North Catholic/Derry Lancaster Catholic
    Pretender: Beaver Falls/EF Grove City

    WPIAL State
    2A- Favorite: Steel Valley/Avonworth/Shady Side Southern Columbia
    Contender: Charleroi WPIAL Champ/ Wilmington/Ligonier Valley
    Pretender: Burgettstown WPIAL Champ/Delone Catholic

    WPIAL State
    1A- Favorite: Jeannette/Clarton Farrell/Jeannette/Clarton
    Contender: no one Canton
    Pretender: Rochester/OLSH everyone else

  241. Mike F says:

    I would like to apologize for the layout of my last post, as it is hard to read. The way I initially had it laid out when I wrote it did not carry over to this page, and now it looks all discombobulated making for a hard to understand read.

  242. Mike F says:

    New2PA- that is a big match up this week, we will learn more about SV after this week for sure. Are they contenders or pretenders

    NA vs WA should have been another nice match up but with the ways the coaches talked this past week not so sure anymore.


    I am a western PA boy so the match up I am looking for is PR vs St Joe’s. Coatesville is a legit team to the winner of that matchup. IMO Coatesville will have the advantage of not being in as big of a dog fight the week before the state title like the western rep has. Other than that, get that WaWa crap out of here. Sheetz all the way. LOL

  243. Mike F says:

    Other big match ups in the WPIAL this week between teams w/ 1 loss or better.

    Blackhawk vs Beaver Falls
    Avonworth vs McGuffey
    Rochester vs Monessen

    What makes the McGuffy and Monessen games intriguing is that they have great records but didn’t really play anyone yet so this is the first test. Monessons 1st game against Charleroi got canceled so they lost that test. They lost to an ok West Green team. So there is no test till now.

    McGuffey hasn’t played anyone of substance until last week. They started 7-0. They may finish 7-3 w/ the loss to Charleroi, this week against a strong 1A Avonworth team, and finish the season against Wash High. Tough way to finish a season heading into playoffs for sure.

  244. New2PA says:

    P-R and Coatesville are similar type teams – spread that can score. I don’t know about Coatesville D, but P-R’s is pretty good. In 6A, to have a shot against SJP, you have to be able to score 35+ and get a few stops. No other team out west can do that besides P-R.

    On a related note, I hope in 2020 they change back to east versus West because that could be the next chance for another incredible showdown between P-R and SJP. Both have very good sophomore QB’s and classes.

  245. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Regarding PR’s defense, from the little I know it seems that their strength is at LB. DL is fair, the concern is in the secondary. They lost two studs to graduation in White and Burns. Hard to replace that.

  246. Jeff H. says:

    @Mike F. – wanted to follow-up on your mention of the controversy surrounding the WA vs. NA matchup this weekend. I think it was a horrible idea to even consider a running clock, it cheapens the game and is a disservice to the fans. I understand the coaches concern of not wanting to get anyone hurt in a game that has no impact on the playoff standings, but to tinker with the rules is not the proper way to approach it and is a discredit to 2 great coaches. This was promising to be a very intriguing matchup between 2 solid football teams that have high playoff aspirations, now it’s probably going to be similar to a glorified scrimmage.

    Interestingly Bob Palko did not feel the same way in 2014, when in week 7 undefeated and top ranked Woodland Hills in 4A traveled to WA to face the 3A #1 Indians, both were ranked #1 in the WPIAL and some state rankings (PennLive had them both #1 at the time), and in an instant classic WA defeated WH 42-41 in OT on a missed extra point, fantastic game, one of the best I’ve seen in person, and both teams left everything on the field. Even though WH lost I left that game feeling it was great for high school football that 2 traditional powerhouses from different classifications would play and go at it like it was for the state title. Now, fast forward 4 yrs and Palko is singing a different tune, it’s a shame and definitely not good for the game.

  247. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Anyone know why the Erie High vs ECP game will be played Thursday?

  248. Billy Splain says:

    you guys need to tune in to a fresh set of downs tonight!!

  249. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    Very well stated. I forgot all about that West A/ Woody High game having that as a background to it. Yes what the hell changed in the past few years in Palko’s mind?

  250. me888 says:

    “ECL/METRO FAN says:
    October 17th, 2018 at 10:48 am
    Anyone know why the Erie High vs ECP game will be played Thursday?”

    EHS requested the change due to their Homecoming Weekend, for whatever reason.

  251. Jeff H. says:

    @ Mike F – I have a lot of respect for Bob Palko but this was a really bad idea and wonder who actually came up with it, that game in 2014 was in week 7 and not week 9, but the circumstances are very similar.

  252. Jeff H. says:

    @New2PA & Mife F. – I saw Seneca Valley last week and their defense is as good as advertised, I think both their offensive and defensive lines will match up pretty favorably with PR. Intriguing matchup between the highest scoring offense and stingiest defense in 6A, I don’t see PR putting up a lot of points on that defense, but I also don’t see SV offense doing a whole lot against PR’s defense, think the final score will be something like 21-10 or 21-14 in favor of PR. If SV wants to stay in this game they can’t commit all the stupid penalties like they did last week, I don’t know the final total but probably had 100+ penalty yards, case in point first and goal at the 3 followed by illegal procedure, illegal shift and then holding and all of a sudden it’s first and goat at the 23 yd line, they did manage a field goal on that drive but they can’t make mistakes like that if they hope to have any chance of upsetting PR.

    If any team is going to crash the anticipated NA vs. PR championship game it will be SV, don’t think PCC and obviously the other 2 qualifiers (likely Mt. Lebo and Canon Mac) will beat either NA or PR.

  253. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    SV/PR should be a good one, wish I could go. It is senior is Senior Night at USC and my niece is a senior cheerleader so family first.

    I do agree that the match up is NA vs PR but if PCC quits its impression of Pitt of doing the same thing over and over again throws a change up and a curve on offense, I could see them pulling an upset because there is a ton of talent on that team. I am a big believe that you can run an old school offense over the spread and be successful, but you still need to be unpredictable and keep them guessing.

  254. Jef H. says:

    @Mike F – I would be surprised if PCC beats either PR or NA in the semi-finals, offense is way too predictable, and think their defense is somewhat overrated, I’ve seen both teams now and imo SV defense is better than PCC, no question PCC has some great players but I’m just not impressed with what I’ve seen from them so far this year, I think there’s a problem with team chemistry. With that being said I do think PCC would have a better chance of beating NA than PR, so if PCC plays NA in the semi-finals they could pull the upset, but still think NA wins that game at home. I also think NA would prefer to play PCC than SV again.

  255. Jeff H. says:

    @Mike F – my predictions/thoughts on WPIAL/state championship contenders

    6A – as previously stated expect final to be PR vs. NA, I like PR, will almost certainly play State College again in quarterfinals, expect a close game but a PR win, then comes SJP and unfortunately that will be the end of PR’s season, think SJP will win by 3 scores, in fact I could see the final score being reversed from last year, 42-21 for SJP, hope I’m wrong but don’t think I will be.

    In the east Coatesville is a big favorite and would be very surprised if they don’t get to Hershey, if they face SJP expect lots of points like last years shootout in the eastern final, SJP is clearly the favorite but give Coatesville a puncher’s chance of outscoring them, could be a great game.

    5A – imo most balanced and deepest classification in WPIAL, Gateway and Penn Hills are obviously the favorites, but lots of solid teams like McKeesport, PT, WA, Bethel, Peters, and Mars, should be some very good quarterfinal and semi-final games, I’ll pick Gateway to repeat.

    On a statewide level Archbishop Wood is still the team to beat, although they are not nearly as good as the last few years, they are vulnerable if they don’t get their starting QB back for the playoffs, look for a great game in the Western finals between the WPIAL winner and Wood, in the east I like Manheim Central out of D3, think they are better than any of the D1 teams.

    4A – TJ huge favorite to win their 4th straight title, South Fayette might give them a decent game in the final but expect TJ to win, and then lose for the 4th year in a row to ECP, although expect the game to be closer than last few years, the D3 winner of Bishop McDevitt or Berks Catholic will give ECP a run for their money in the semi-finals. Favorite to win 4A is Imhotep, there’s a reason they’ve been ranked #1 in most state polls all year

    3A – would be a huge upset if Aliquippa does not win 3A, expect them to face either Conwell Egan from the PCL or Middletown from D3 in the final, could be 3rd yr in a row Middletown faces a team from Beaver County in Hershey.

    2A – another very deep classification in the WPIAL, I like either Shady Side or Charleroi, but don’t count out Wash High, they’ve been flying under the radar since getting beaten up by Charleroi early in the season. All of the 2A teams are playing for 2nd place on the state level as I think Southern Columbia is the biggest favorite in any classification to win a state title.

    1A – have Jeanette and Clairton as co-favorites, OLSH is also very good, all the top 1A teams are in the West this year, the Farrell vs. WPIAL winner will be a big favorite to win in Hershey.

  256. New2PA says:

    @Jeff H

    You mentioned PCC Team Chemistry. From everything I have heard out here in Pine, its an offense vs. defense mentality. The DC is pretty motivational from what I’ve head (Chain Gang), but also is angling for the head coaching job. He’s the guy doing interviews and such.

    I wnat to see how P-R plays against SV. If they can come out and score 35-42, I’ll have a good feeling heading into NA week and the playoffs. I too think they most likely scenario is what you mention about PR getting to SJP then losing, but PCC and NA are always dangerous. And if SV can find any offense….

  257. Mike F says:

    Jeff H that’s for your thoughts, it’s nice to get some football talk going. I agree with most you say. 5A is deep and interesting but I still vote 2A as the deepest and most interesting up until the state title game. SCA is that good.

    New2PA that is interesting what you heard about PCC. That is something to keep an eye on, not just this season but off season too.

  258. Mikefln says:

    Billy I read your writeup on Playoffs, that’s for the info. It is nice to hear about districts I’m not as familiar with. Why so many D10 schools opting out of play offs for?

  259. D10 Insider (Big Schools) says:

    I don’t know much about the other districts but I know D10 pretty well:

    6A Championship
    McDowell vs Erie

    McDowell has taken two beat downs in a row and could be on the ropes heading into the D10 final. They do play Toronto Prep this week to get back on track and Erie has to play the Ramblers tonight for the region championship. McDowell beat Erie in the regular season last year and then lost in the final. I see the same thing happening here.

    Erie 40
    McDowell 35

    General McLane vs Oil City

    This class is a joke. None of these teams are even 5A schools and are just playing for the D10 title. Meadville, Warren, and Franklin all moved up a class to avoid playing Prep in the title game but aren’t even going to try and take it from GM or OC? Bunch of cowards. Enjoy the D10 title because they are going to get pounded the next week.

    GM 3
    OC 0

    Prep vs Ft. LeBoeuf

    The last 3 years D10 opponents have been running away from Prep to punish them for being a private school. The last 3 years they were in the state championship winning 2 of them. I don’t think that worked out for D10. Props to FLB, for being brave enough to try and dethrone the champs. They have a tough group of seniors that will compete, but will ultimately fall short against CP. CP could make another run for Hershey, but I wouldn’t be surprised if they get knocked off by maybe TJ if they win WPIAL or McDevitt if they win D3. I don’t see anyone else beating them before chocolate town.

    I don’t pay too much attention to the smaller schools but I’ll throw what I know out there:

    Mercyhurst vs Grove City

    GC is smashing teams and obliterated Sharon who knocked out MPS in the final last year. I think this class is a 3 man race, but will pick Grove City to beat Mercyhurst after and if MPS gets by Sharon. MPS is a good team, but lack competition during the regular season that has consistently hurt them in the playoffs. Mind boggling that they don’t play better non region games, but they are another team just playing for districts and not for states.

    This is Wilmingtons to lose. I’d love to see the Wildcats from Northwestern make some noise in the playoffs but I think they are still a few years away from winning the district.

    Farrell and everyone else.

    I think Erie/McDowell winner, GM/OC winner and CP/FLB winner all beat the Pittsburgh City league champions the following week but only Prep will advance after that. It’ll be basketball season for the rest.

    Grove City has a slight chance against the WPIAL champ, would be nice to see them compete but I think they will lose by 2 scores. If MPS were to win, I think the score mercy rule will come into play, the Quips will be tough.

    Wilmington and Farrell could make a run.

  260. Mike F says:

    D10 insider- thanks for the info. Why are there so many teams in D10 not competing in the playoffs? I get your frustration with 5A but i always viewed General McLain as having a proud tradition even if they are just trying to escape ECP by playing 5A. What is going on up there. I do admit Wilsmington and especially Farrel are tops dogs in that area. D3 sounds like a fun race up there to follow.

  261. Jeff H. says:

    @New2PA – I will be surprised if PR puts up 35-42 on SV’s defense, if they do they will clearly be the favorite to win the WPIAL title, and perhaps give SJP a more competitive game than I expect, From everything I’ve heard and read from the Philly guys SJP is loaded this year and better than last year and their sophomore QB is a stud, not taking anything away from PR who is very good, I just think SJP has too much talent this year, and unfortunately for the rest of the state a lot of the talent is in their sophomore and junior classes.

    @D10 Insider – was wondering if any of the D10 guys thought Grove City had a shot against Aliquippa. They were over-matched in 5A when they took on West Allegheny a few years ago, when they were a small 4A trying to compete with the big boys, but nice to see them competing again against schools their size. Their big win against traditional power Sharon earlier in the season got my attention, I think they might be able to hang with Aliquippa for a little while but eventually the talent and overall team speed will wear Grove City down.

    Agree that Wilmington and Farrell might make deep runs, both have a decent chance of getting to Hershey, their games against the WPIAL winners should be very competitive.

  262. D10 Insider (Big Schools) says:

    Sharon has athletes but I don’t want to say they have them “like” the Quips because they are on another level and GC handled them pretty good. Tough, we’ll coached kids, always capable of the upset. They knocked off CP in 2011 so they have slayed the giant before.

    IMO they opted out because they knew even if they did win districts they would be outmatched in PIAA play, probably taking a worse beat down then if they played CP. CP is a classy program and do things the right way if they get up big. GM is a proud program, but Wells hates CP and would complain to anyone who’d listen about how they cheat. Even though he went to a Catholic HS.

  263. New2PA says:

    @Jeff P-R’s offense has played sporadic in the past several games. Come out very hot then taper off. Would like to see them play a complete game. From everything I’ve read, it does seem like SJP is the cream of the crop. But like you said, if they can score against a very good SV defense, they should be the prohibitive favorites to win 6A all else being equal.

  264. Jeff H. says:

    Is it just me or does anyone else think Canon McMillan has a chance to make things interesting tomorrow night against PCC, not saying they will beat them, but make it a lot closer than most people expect. One of the more surprising results in the WPIAL so far this year was their win over Peters Twp. a few weeks ago, Peters is a solid team with a pretty good defense and they put up 35 on them, so that tells me they have some talent. PR handled them 2 weeks ago, do any of the PR guys who saw that game think the Big Macs have a chance to keep it close or even pull off a big upset?

    These teams will likely play again in 2 weeks in the first round of the playoffs, so the coaches might not roll out the entire playbook tomorrow, I think Canon Mac has more incentive for this game than PCC and have a hunch this game will be a lot more competitive than anyone would have predicted a month ago.

  265. Jack1234 says:

    @jeff I saw canon Mac play pr and PR didn’t handle them as much as the score may seem. Not sure if it was an off night for pr’s defense or what but they ran all over PR. Their o line didn’t look like anything special but they were getting 5-6 yards a pop with #13 josh O’hare. Pr offense was pretty stagnant alot of the game as well. It was scoreless for a while in the first half and they threatened in the red zone twice until bad playcalls on 4th down ended those drives. #13 was injured and that’s when PR was able to get stops and pull away but from what I remeber he had 14 carries for about 90 yards in just the first half. He was the second leading rusher in the wpial at that point as well. If hes healthy he makes them a tough team to play, they aren’t super athletic or that talented but I thought they played well as a team. Last week they converted a receiver to rb who went off on norwin for like 300 yards so I’m not sure if #13 is healthy or not. If #13 is back they now likely have a nice 1-2 punch in the backfield. I most certainly see them keeping it close, but I think even though pcc has a bad offense and they’re undiscplined no other team can handle their front 7 for 4 quarters besides NA and PR. The competition is so down in the wpial against most teams they’d only need to score 14-17 because no team can match their defense especially their D line. Something interesting for PCC is that they started using Gus sunseri, one of their starting LBs, as a wildcat type QB on offense and they scored their most points of the season (even though it was against awful butler). I definitely see him playing more offense giving them a boost on offense, not necessarily with the passing game but as an added big play threat out of the backfield.

  266. Jack1234 says:

    It’s also worth adding that CM played NA very close as well and was leading at points in the game until NA was able to pull away. CM is likely gonna need some big throws from their QB as well, which I didn’t think he was all too impressive against pr

  267. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Whoa, Pine Richland and North Allegheny had some tough games last night. It’s good that Seneca Valley is apparently surging as a program. It’s good to have several solid programs. Peters Township is nobody’s joke, they could give a higher seed a scare in the tournament. Meanwhile Pittsburgh Central Catholic, the dejected bunch felt some kind of way, came out swinging. Out of necessity they’re embracing the dangerous underdog role. NA is definitely undefeated, they’ve had to grind out a few games which shows mettle, we’ll see if they can peak at the right time.

  268. new2pa says:

    The PR-SV game was excellent. P-R absolutely pounded SV defense the entire game. This is not a P-R team of last year. Ground and pound. Probably ran the ball 60 times and tried 15 passes. Their OL is very very good. There were bodies flying everywhere. The didn’t do much through the air. Looked like they had guys open by Spencer pulled it down and ran a lot. Meckler is a threat. He won’t be caught if he’s in the open field.

    The defense was also very good. Gave up a few big plays but stoned SV in redzone at least once.

    Should be a battle next week vs. NA. I think SV may be the second best team in 6A at this point.

  269. D10 Insider (big schools) says:

    I read on the PIAA website that the 4A District 8/10 winner will play the District 6/9 winner in the first round of the PIAA playoffs. Does anyone know anything about the schools in that area? I see clearfield is undefeated and usually are, how is the competition down that way? I know Prep has played Dubois and Bradford and haven’t had much trouble with them but Clearfield has been ranked consistently in the top 10/15 of 4A, wondering what kind of team they got down that way.

    Also, Erie ended up not getting mercy ruled by Prep last week. CP didn’t have their starting QB but Erie was much more talented than I expected. I don’t know how McDowel beat them earlier. Hats off to the Royals, maybe some competition in Erie for the Prep finally!

  270. wpialcoach says:

    Class 6A – Everyone will be chasing Pine-Richland, North Allegheny will be a test this Friday and maybe a preview of the Championship.

    Class 5A – Gateway and Penn Hills, everyone else will be in the shadows.

    Class 4A – South Fayette and Thomas Jefferson…agan.

    Class 3A – Quips

    Class 2A – Shady Side Academy – just too explosive, maybe Steel Valley or Burgettstown if they slow down the game. .

    Class 1A – Jeanette or Claiton, OLSH will make some noise but their lack f speed will hurt them.

  271. Jack1234 says:

    imo PR is gonna need to figure out a way to control the penalties, that’s their biggest issue right now. The holdings are killing drives. NA’s WR’s will test PR secondary if they decide to air it out on them. I think PR should be able to run the ball well on NA, I don’t see them having much success against the NA secondary, they’re very athletic.

  272. Jeff H. says:

    @the artist – Peters is 5A for this cycle, but you’re right, they will be a dangerous team in the playoffs, not surprised they beat Bethel Park on Friday but shocked at the final score, wondering if BP didn’t have some key guys not playing..

    @Wpial Coach – not sure I agree everyone else besides Gateway and PH will be in the shadows, those 2 are certainly the favorites to meet in the final but I think 5A is the deepest classification in the WPIAL, and there should be some very good quarterfinal and semi-final games, Peters Twp could put a scare into either of those teams, and I wouldn’t count out Penn Trafford or McKeesport winning a couple of games. Will be very interesting to see how McKeesport fares this weekend against Gateway, particularly how their offense does against Gateway’s vastly improved defense, if Gateway blows them out like they have everyone else then they are the big favorites to repeat imo.

    I said at the beginning of the season on this board it wouldn’t surprise me if Penn Hills went 10-0 in the regular season and then lost in the playoffs, their quarterfinal and particularly semi-final opponent will likely be better than any team they have played all year, so we’ll see how they do when they step up in competition, sometimes a weak regular season schedule comes back to haunt you come playoff time.

  273. Billy Splain says:

    CLearfield is the real deal. They have state title talent.

  274. D10 Insider (big schools) says:

    Billy – really? State title talent? I’m sure you’re aware of the talent on Imhotep and CPs roster the last 3 years, they have that kind of talent? That’s actually exciting. Could this be another CASH vs CP upset in the making? Doing a little research I noticed Johnstown has knocked them out of the playoffs in the past and their team was 6-5 last year. Just curious what you see in them that makes them state title talented. Not trying to call you out, just love the info.

  275. Mike F says:


    I must agree with Jeff H, in that Gateway and Penn Hills are the favorites in 5A but that is one deep classification. I understand Holl is a better coach than Terry Smith was but Gateway lost many of games where they had more talent than their opponent and went to the locker room defeated. The Dark Horses in 5A are strong.

    Also I cannot say that Shady Side is too explosive in AA. Again this is a very deep class that is up for grabs as far as I am concerned.

  276. wpialcoach says:

    Don Holl is the best coach in 5A, he made a mountain out of a mole hill when he was a Seneca Valley and Gateway has been almost unstoppable since he has taken over, winning a state title last year. Penn HIlls has the athletes but Coach Ledonne is questionable, he only won 3 games in 3 years while at Shaler Area. Peters Township is having a great year, I saw them against North Hills, great athletes but they lost to a Canon-McMillan team that is 3-5, which looks like poor coaching, they may put a scare into a team until halftime, can’t do that against Gateway or PH, and PT will disappear once they move back up to Class 6A. Penn-Trafford already got pummeled by Gateway 27-7. McKeesport may be a good game, they have some big wins, but a 20-9 loss to Penn-Trafford. It will come down to the best staff when teams meet a second time, who made the necessary changes? I would never count out Jim Render at Upper Saint Clair, they Peters week 2 and have gotten better evry week.

    Shady Side beat every team they have played by at least 20 points, including a 56-36 win over Steel Valley, last years conference and state champ, but maybe Steel Valley can beat them the second time around. SSA plays a tough team in Avonworth this week, but they have not won the conference since moving to 2A. The only other undefeated team is Burgettstown and they are no threat to SSA. .

  277. wpialcoach says:

    gateway played in state title game in 2017, my mistake

  278. sausmann9 says:

    Cannon Mac – any old school Cannon Mac contacts out there??? Looking for early 1970’s info and will make it worth your time. tx.

  279. sausmann9 says:

    D10 INsider – you don’t need Ihop or ECP talent to be considered state title talent. Those schools have a plethora of talent that’s not really their own but the general area those two schools are located.

    Now lets talk terms you will understand; Wilmington and Farrell have state title talent on their rosters but may not win a title. Those are two damn good public school football programs/teams that have the talent that SHOULD win them a title but sadly they’re public schools (with state title talent) have to face teams along the way that transfer, trade, or deal to get their talent; much developed by other coaches and schools.

    One day we will finally see a true state title weekend where only true public schools abiding by the same set of rules will battle for a true state championship at the high school level. school v school, community v community, town v town – what PA football is really about!

  280. D10 Insider says:

    Sausmann, I’m not going to argue public vs Private the numbers speak for themselves. To say Preps talent isn’t their own is childish. The majority of those kids live in the city of Erie, and ALL of them in the surrounding townships.

    Last year the QB, 2RB, FB, C, LT, RG, 2WR, NG, both DEs, 2/3 LBs and 3/5 DBs were all parochial, Catholic grade school kids. Technically Preps “feeder system” so to say the talent isn’t their own is preposterous.

    The state playoffs work themselves out. Public schools go as far as they can and if they fall short they can have the UCF-like crown of public school state champion. Notice how St Joes isn’t claiming to be the 6A Private school champion. Also, last year didn’t public schools win 4/6 football titles? Quit your crying, coach em up, play ball.

  281. Jeff H. says:

    @ Sausman9 – if you’re talking about smaller schools like Wilmington and Farrell I fail to see where the public vs. private argument comes into play, at least this year (and last year for that matter). Public schools are the overwhelming favorites to win A and 2A this year just like last year, unless you don’t consider Southern Columbia a public school. The winner of the match-up between Farrell and the WPIAL winner (likely either Jeanette or Clairton) will be the clear favorite to win in Hershey. I’m with D10 Insider, strap em up and play, back in their heyday schools like Woodland Hills took great pride in beating PCC, we need to make some changes to the current rules, like the PIAA has started to do with transfers, not create separate playoffs for public and private schools. Whatever happened to the success rule idea that was talked about at length on this board a few years ago, is that dead or still on the table?

  282. Jeff H. says:

    @WPIAL coach – I think USC is overrated, they will win their first round game if they play at home but likely lose in the quarterfinals no matter who they play, and if it’s Gateway or Penn Hills they will get beat by several scores. This assumes they beat Bethel Park this week at Bethel, which is no sure thing, because if they lose they finish 4th in the conference and will be on the road in the first round, and if they play a team like McKeesport they could be 1 and done. I agree the Peters loss to Canon Mac is a terrible loss and an enigma, my guess is they either had some starters not play or they took their opponent lightly in a game that had no bearing on the conference standings, but having seen them play think they can hang with Penn Hills and maybe Gateway into the 2nd half.. Also wouldn’t discount Penn Trafford, their loss to Gateway was in the 2nd game of the season and they have won 7 straight since then, and if they meet again in the playoffs would expect the game to be closer, not saying they would beat them but would be a competitive game.

    I will be very surprised if Gateway does not get to the final, as I think they are the best team, but wouldn’t surprise me if Penn Hills gets upset by a Peters, PT or McKeesport, we shall see, I’m anticipating some very competitive games.

    At 2A I agree Shady Side is the favorite, but there’s lots of good teams, that’s another pretty deep classification, and I wouldn’t count out 1 loss teams like Charleroi and Wash High.

  283. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Somebody opined recently that Gateway is the best team in the WPIAL regardless of classification. What do you guys think, is there any merit to that or was he experiencing a pleasant caffeine buzz or something? I miss the old 4A and 3A, was so much deeper. At any rate have never seen Gateway in person, be cool to check them out.

  284. New2PA says:

    I think an argument could be made that Gateway has the best offense in the WPIAL this year in terms of just having the ability to score passing the ball. I think they would be hard pressed to run much against the top tier 6A teams – would need to air it out. However, the Davis kid is a real talent at RB and if he got in the open field it would be over. I just think it would be hard for that to happen consistently. Similarly, on defense their skill guys are top notch, but I think they would struggle to stop the run. I think if they played a team like P-R, the score would be something like 49-42 and the team with the least turnovers wins.

    Related to all this, when Gateway plays Penn Hills, take Gateway by at least 14. Probably more like 28. It would come down to coaching. Gateway is very very well coached.

  285. sausmann9 says:

    Ooops, stepped down a level, my bad.

    Yeah I guess you all need to get out a bit more, or at least East a bit more. Prep claims that bullcrap every year, you are just not that close to their league. As for coaching up, lmao, explain to me how you coach a team up against a team that brings in starting players DURING the season and playoffs??? You sound like one of those funny guys who think you can coach kids up from 5’7″ 165 to 6’3″ 225 over the summer, lol.

    As for your parochial schools in Erie – I didn’t know ECP was the only one. And if you talk feeder systems, how many parochial elementary and middle schools are in the city of Erie – I bet a many many more than some of the 5A and 6A programs in that area.

    PIAA only just started to respond b/c many public school programs got tired of the crap and started talking of getting out of the PIAA and going back to a football system that actually works for all involved. I know I know, 4 out of 6 last season, glad to know thats the norm rather than an anomaly.

  286. D10 Insider says:

    Well the western PA Prep has never made that claim, must be an eastern PA thing.

    CPs skill players were all 6 ft or under last year even if your looking at their heights on the roster and still dominated. You do that with good coaching and by character development. Maybe some of the public schools that complain about everything should start working harder and caring more. Actually doing it instead of just crying about how unfair life is. Such a joke.

    Also, their are I think maybe 4 parochial schools that go all the way to 8th grade, that produced 2 football teams last year, that eventually ended up in 1 combined team. So To answer your question about how many teams are in Preps “feeder system” it’s 1. With about 40 guys on it that aren’t all going to Prep. I’m sure the public schools have more than 1 age group and team in their systems. Coach em up!

  287. Jeff H. says:

    @New2PA – completely agree with everything you said, the only team in the WPIAL that may be better than Gateway is PR, and that game could go either way, I would take Gateway over the other top 3 6A schools of NA, SV and PCC. I too think Gateway will handle PH in the title game if PH gets that far, but PH has to get there first, will be very interesting to see how the WPIAL seeds the 5A bracket. You’re right about Derrick Davis, he’s a stud and they would not have won the WPIAL title last year without him as he was all over the field in the final and clearly the game MVP as a freshman.

    Archbishop Wood is down from the past couple of years, but they are still a running machine, they did a number on Lasalle last week, I expect a rematch of Gateway and AW in the semi-finals this year and the $64,000 dollar question is will Gateway be able to slow down AW’s running game.

  288. Jeff H. says:

    @Sausman – all reasonable people agree it’s a travesty for a team to bring in new players during the season like has been done in recent years, and the PIAA has taken some steps to address that issue, although not enough yet imo. I said 2 years ago it was a joke for Micah Parsons to be able to transfer from CD to Harrisburg during the middle of the season and play and subsequently lead Harrisburg to the state championship game. Yes, I am well aware of the backstory and the racist incident that happened at CD that led to the transfer, but kids should not be allowed to play for 2 different HS teams in the same season, period, end of story, and the PIAA has started to address that.

    I just don’t think going with separate playoffs is the right solution, there’s not enough private schools in the state to make it viable, and we’re really only talking about at most a dozen private schools across the state that are consistently competing for district and state football championships.

  289. Mike F says:

    WpialCoach, I follow Upper St Clair closely. They are not a well coached team. I do not know what Render had in the 80’s-mid 2000’s but I can assure you he doesn’t have it today. The team has talent but they are not 1 unit. Back in 15 they had 2 OL who went to Pitt. 1 OL who went to and Started at Robert Morris since freshman year, running back who went to Yale, a power fullback who is at D3 school, plus a qb who is playing baseball but was hell of an athlete. That team limped into the playoff and got hammered by PCC in the 1st round. I am talking mercy ruled. I know PCC was loaded to bear that year, but a team with the talent USC had that year should have to limp in as the lowest seeded team and play PCC in round 1 andbe mercy ruled against. That kind of talent should have fought at least till the 4th qtr if not till the end and keep it respectable. USC is overrated.

    There is no question that Gateway followed by Penn Hills are the favorites in 5A, I just am not going to write off Penn Trafford, West Allegheny, and Mckeesport so quickly. They play the game for a reason and either one of those teams are good enough to bring their A game and come out with a victory.

    In 2A, again Shady Side may be the favorite but Charelroi, Washington, Steel Valley, etc are not going to be intimidated and roll over for SSA. They will make it tough for SSA.

  290. Mike F says:

    Sausaman, I have stated this a million times to you. The school district does not own the rights to the kids who reside in the district. If anything the residence own the school district. Kids owe nothing to the school district. Plus there are things called feeder schools for The parochial schools. I never stepped foot in a public school from pre-k to college I was always in a Catholic school.

    But in your view I would have been a City of Pittsburgh’s student/talent not the Catholic schools I attended. I just cannot go along with that warped logic. Most of the kids in these schools are just like me, never having stepped foot in a public school. I bet less than 5% of all parochial HS students did.

  291. Mike F says:

    Artist/Phillyboy. I agree I miss the old 4 class system. This 6 class system has killed rivalries which leaf to lower attendance faster than it already was. But hey 2 more teams get to make the playoff even though too many were already making them before, and we get to have 2 more State Champions even though it cheapens what a State Champion used to mean.

  292. D10 Fan says:

    D10 Insider – I’m interested in your opinion on something I discussed with a few Erie High fans last week. We had a discussion about how that wing offense they run needs to go. They have decent size and great athletes but I feel that offense handcuffs them. You need to get those guys in space. I was very impressed with their qb but the majority of his yds came on broken plays and scrambling when he was able to get himself some space to operate. I know their coach is all gung-ho about that offense but he needs to change his tune if they’re ever going to compete on a statewide level in 6A.

  293. D10 Insider says:

    In my honest opinion I think coach mats as done a great job bringing those 3 schools together to compete for district titles and state playoff spots. When he first got there he ran the spread but didn’t have guys that were fundamentally sound to be successful consistently, I think that’s why he went to the single wing.

    That offense does blow teams away if you don’t prepare for it. I like it to an extent, but agree they won’t win anything in Hershey with that offense because they can’t even beat CP with it. I would say it works for the most part but agree they need some kind of wrinkle. Similar to offenses who run the wing t. When they have to pass what are their schemes? Post wheel? Deep balls? Not hard to prepare for.

    They arguably have the most talented team at the skill position in the city. It showed against CP last week. Penalties killed them and with that offense if you have 1st or 2nd and long or get behind the chains because of a pentaly you’re in a hole that is tough for a single wing team to get out of it.

  294. D10 Insider says:

    I forgot to mention the QB. He was very quick and hard to see behind the big line. He made some CP players look very slow in the open field. Their is no doubt in my mind that some of those guys if they are at CP are starting over some of the current players. With him at Q and a healthy Foster I don’t think McDowel has a chance tomorrow.

    If I were mats or a guy on his staff I would have a package (I bet they already do) that is 2×2, 3×1, and Empty and have a handful of pass plays for each set. Run them everyday in 7 on 7 periods at practice to have them Incase you need them. I’m sure he’ll have a wrinkle for the Trojans tomorrow.

    Also, no one is talking about this Canadian team coming to play Prep tomorrow. Clarkson has to be coming to Erie with a lot of confidence after beating McDowell last year and Erie this year. Why not beat Prep too? Not sure where I’m heading tomorrow night yet. I’m usually at CP games but Erie McDowell for the title is must see.

  295. Billy Splain says:

    @d10….Their QB just committed to PSU….they have two WRs that are 6-3, 6-4 and will be all state candidates..A good sized line the plays well. Their defense is solid .CP is down this year, still good but no where near what theyve had the last couple years….those were special years. Tep doesn’t look like the team I thought they would be either. Clearfield was an extremely young team last year.

  296. Billy Splain says:

    Jeff, the titles aren’t cheapened. they’re more even now. there were some major differences in school sizes. If your were a mid to lower 1A school you had to go through what are now 3A schools…That makes a HUGE difference when you’re that small a program. Plus, the demographics have changed. There are so many schools combining lately that the numbers in 3 and 4A were starting to get crazy. Lower 4A schools especially. something had to be done because the demographics and geographies of schools are changing at a rapid rate in the past 10 years. Look how many schools are combining and how many districts are growing quickly while others are dying. If we were in the 4 class system this year it’d be ugly. What you guys in the west are seeing is the result of the WPIAL not keeping up and adapting. Their old system of playing by class isn’t working anymore. there’s just too much disparity. Thats why statewide 6 classes works, because in every other district in the state they don’t force nor have ever forced teams to stay in their classification. There isn’t one conference outside the wpial, well D10 but thats another debacle, that has conferences made up of strictly one class. The wpial has to let go, they’ve fallen way behind. As for the success factor, it is in play now, but has to do with transfers.

  297. D10 Insider says:

    Billy – thanks for the info. QB to PSU? That’s pretty impressive I had no idea. Sounds like if both teams get out of districts we’re going to have an interesting sweet 16 matchup. I agree both Prep and Tep are down this year. I actually think McDevitt is the team to beat right now. I wonder where they would play that Clearfield vs CP game if they both win their districts.

    And yes. The past two even three CP teams were extremely special. That being said, I wouldn’t be surprised though if they win 3 in a row.

  298. B. Powell says:

    The Clearfield QB is going as a preferred walk-on, meaning, he must be a nice kid and has decent grades and will have to work his way into the lineup. As an old Penn State guy, I wish him good fortune and am happy he chose us.
    Maxpreps is pretty accurate this time of year and going from past history, D9 hasn’t fared well vs D10 in playoff football and I can remember a time (or two) in the 90s Clearfield came to Erie with an identical type of team and got smashed. Prep and Erie Central at the time were too big and fast for them and Clearfield’s vaunted QB was running for his life. I seem to remember that Clearfield QB was going to PSU also?? I believe it was middle 1990’s.
    Maxpreps has Cathedral Prep with a rating of 37.3 and strength of schedule, 23.6.
    They list Clearfield as 29.5 rating , but strength of schedule, -2.4 and therein lies their dilema. Prep is battle hardened.
    The same thing would happen if Farrell and Wilmington meet D9 teams again…going on past history. D10 teams play a faster game.
    I’ve seen Prep this year and they are still pretty dang good.
    I pay taxes to and follow FLB and we are the next in line for ECP. Let’s just say, it’s only a 10 mile drive and we have the halftime entertainment covered with a decent band. lol.
    After we go out, I follow the paths of the other D10 teams and can usually rely on history, most years.
    It usually takes the D6 teams and the WPIAL to knock our football teams out of the playoffs.
    Hey, maybe I’ll be wrong but no more wrong than this site was having Sharon rated above Grove City all year until they met…and how did that go for Sharon?
    I’ve seen Sharon twice this year and saw Grove City, too and I could see that one coming.

  299. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – don’t count out Berks Catholic, I wouldn’t be surprised if they beat McDevitt for the D3 title. They played a much tougher non-conference schedule than in years past and will be battle tested come playoff time. I don’t see anyone in the East beating Imhotep so expect them to be in Hershey again.

    @Billy – that wasn’t me who said the titles are cheapened, that was Mike F., and I don’t agree with that. I would have preferred the PIAA go to 5 classes and not 6, when they’ve expanded the classifications in past decades it was one class at a time, they added 4A back in 1980, so they were due to add another class, I just think the move to 6 classes spread out the traditional powers too much, at least in the WPIAL. And I do agree with you that the WPIAL is way behind the times and needs to rethink conferences so we bring back some traditional rivalries. USC and Mt Lebo should play every year, so should North Hills and NA, and Woody and Penn Hills, etc.

  300. B. Powell says:

    That Clearfield team was 1994 and the QB was all-state, Chad Kroell. At the time, he had set a few state passing records and they came to Erie that year, flying high. He did go on to Penn State and got a little time under Joe Paterno. Just a bit.
    But I had seen Erie Central play that year and I I knew what was in store when Clearfield came to town and it finished 48-6 Erie Central? Central then went on and lost a close game to a Brandon Shorts (PSU) led McKeesport team.

    I mean, if Clearfield meets Cathedral Prep, I hope its a much better game because I plan to be there.
    But something seems all too familiar…
    I know…DO something about it. Clearfield can do something about it.

  301. Mike F says:

    Billy that was me who stated that the move to 6 classes is bad and I stand behind that statement. Your not going to change my opinion (which many fans share), and I am not going to change your opinion (which many fans share as well).

  302. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Yo Mike F, YOU were the one who made the alleged complaints about the PIAA going to 6 classes. Were you just going to let poor Jeff H. take all the blame? Shame on you, no just kidding man. I love the Splain Man’s insights but 4 classes was the ‘Goldilocks’ amount, it was just right.

  303. D10 Insider says:

    I will never underestimate a strong township with good tradition in the playoffs ever again. CASH humbled CP Nation once and so did Grove City. Prep will be seasoned, but also banged up. Great info on Clearfield guys!

  304. D10 Fan says:

    D10 Insider – Agree with you on the job matz has done and some of those kids would definitely see the field if they were at CP. One of the Erie High fans I was chatting with joked that their QB is nice but he’ll probably transfer to prep and become an all-state WR. Not a serious comment, just joking but the talent is definitely there at Erie.

    CP is down for sure but still good enough to get back to Hershey. It just won’t be a foregone conclusion like the past 2 years. I think Mischler and his staff have done a phenomenal job putting the pieces together and finding the right spots for the new faces. Most coaches would’ve just trotted Scarabino out there at QB and just went with it. But they took their time analyzing his talents and have found something in the H Back/DE. He will be a big time matchup nightmare for anyone they play in the playoffs. They did a lot of rotating early in the year so they can see who worked where and have finally seemed to have settled into their rotations. Getting Jalen Carson back from injury is a big addition. CPs junior class is very very strong.

  305. D10 Insider says:

    I think I’m going to head down to Prep tonight to see the “best HS team in Canada” is what’s been said. When I saw the Erie paper pick Prep to win 31-28 I was intrigued. These guys must be pretty tough at 4-5 with losses to St. Xavier, Ignatius, and Moeller and Elder from Cincinnati, also Baltimore’s St. Frances who no one wants to play. Could be a tough one for the Ramblers.

  306. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    If any of you guys are curious about Coatesville, can check them out at Live streaming starts at 7 pm. Downingtown East is no slouch. Can only imagine how good they might have been if they were still one united team with D West.

  307. Mikefln says:

    Down goes Pine Richland. If this game proves 1 thing is that: You cannot count out NA or Art Walker Jr ever. NA is a proud program and Walker is one of the best in the state. These 2 are the 6A favorites, it will be interesting to see what adjustments Kasperovich makes as I feel he too is one of the best in the state.

    In PA I say WPIAL phase 4 of the top 10 coaches.


    HM Holl

  308. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Major thumbs up to North Allegheny and Mt. Lebanon and State College too. I had a feeling NA was the top dog in the WPIAL this year. A power team with a commensurate swagger, keep it rolling boys. Won’t be easy but expect NA to win the rematch in a few weeks if things hold form. Props to Lebo and State College for taking care of business.

    Meanwhile I have concerns about Coatesville, sure they have a few excellent players but if they play a prime time program I wonder if they might turn into this year’s version of last year’s Harrisburg. If you just look at their final scores everything seems great but they’re vulnerable. Their big play capability has covered a multitude of sins so to speak. If they play a team that crosses their t’s and dots their i’s they could be in trouble. Garnet Valley’s odds of taking a potential rematch have just increased in my view.

  309. New2PA says:

    NA dominated P-R on both sides of the ball, including a 28-0 shellacking in the second half.

    The game was won and lost up front. NA ran left every down and P-R had nothing to stop them. Offensively, Meckler did have some nice runs, but no breakaways and when the weather got worse in the 2nd half, they really couldn’t run the ball when it mattered. I counted at least 4 big plays where P-R couldn’t get a yard. Then they got behind and it came down to a bunch of inexperienced skill guys on the perimeter …. and it showed.

    But Kudos to NA. P-R got lucky I guess in the playoffs missing SV, PCC, and NA until the finals. I think they play the winner of Mt. Lebanon and Canon-McMillan.

  310. Jeff H. says:

    @New2PA – surprised with your description of the game and PR only scored 7 points, I figured both defenses would dominate and would be fairly low scoring. No offense intended for Mt. Lebo but I would rather face them in the semi’s than the SV vs. PCC winner, which I think will be SV. I do expect both of these teams to meet again at Heinz and we’ll see what coach K. can come up with for the rematch. I certainly hope I’m wrong but I think either of these teams will be in for a rough game against SJP and will do well to keep it within a couple of scores.

    In 3A shocked that Central Valley beat Aliquippa, the Quips still the big favorite to win the WPIAL title, but maybe Grove City has a legit chance to beat them.

    @the artist – game will be at Coatesville and think they have way too much firepower for Garnet Valley, I will be shocked if they don’t get to Hershey because I think the are at least 2 scores better than any team in D1 and will handle the D3 winner in the semi-finals.

  311. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    @ Jeff H. — On the surface I would agree with you that Coatesville should be a solid favorite over Garnet Valley and possibly beyond that. But they can’t keep expecting to convert on 3rd and 26 and 4th and 12 or whatever. When you’re playing merely good teams you can get away with that but when you start playing very good and great teams things get tighter, suddenly latent weaknesses become apparent. Don’t get me wrong though, it’s some tough love — C’ville is my first choice all the way.

  312. Jeff H. says:

    @the artist – I think the quality of play is down statewide, it certainly is in the WPIAL, and the talk on the eastern boards is same, it’s definitely down in District 3 as well. I just don’t see any team stopping Coatesville from getting to Hershey, but they may be exposed when they run into SJP in the final. I think the first really good/great team they will play is in the state final, and that includes North Penn, GV, anyone else in D1 and presumably Harrisburg again from D3.

    To give you an idea of how the talent level is down in the WPIAL I heard on the triblive scoreboard show last week driving home from a game that the WPIAL is going to have it’s fewest number of Power 5 conference recruits in history.

  313. Jeff H. says:

    Now that we know the 16 qualifiers for the 5A WPIAL playoffs and order of finish in each conference I’ll take a stab at how the WPIAL steering committee will seed the brackets, Keep in mind seeds can be adjusted up or down a line to avoid conference rematches in the first round.

    #1 Gateway vs. #16 Kiski
    #2 Penn Hills vs. #15 Latrobe
    #3 Peters Twp. vs, #14 Armstrong
    #4 West Allegheny vs. #13 Shaler
    #5 Penn Trafford vs. #12 Woodland Hills
    #6 Mars vs. #11 Franklin
    #7 McKeesport vs. #10 Upper St. Clair
    #8 Bethel Park vs. #9 North Hills

    If seeds hold that would leave a quarterfinal round of Gateway vs. BP, Penn Hills vs. McKeesport, Peters vs. Mars and West A vs. Penn Trafford. The only road team I think that has a realistic chance of winning is USC against McKeesport. We’ll see it the WPIAL agrees on Monday night but one thing is certain is Gateway is clearly the favorite after giving up a ridiculously low 4.3 points/game in the regular season.

  314. D10 Insider says:

    I agree that the talent statewide is down. If you guys are saying so in the WPIAL and the eastern boards I can tell you first hand it is down in District 10 also. Not that the players are bad or anything, but their aren’t a lot of D1 coaches making the trip to Erie or the surrrounding areas this year. Sure their are a handful of D1 guys. But nothing to the extent of recent years.

    This is a perfect example of why the multiplier doesn’t work. It punishes teams for success. Success is usually senior heavy. Just a small example is looking at CP. The last two years they were LOADED. Now they are good and contenders, but not heavy favorites. This team struggled against PCC (6A) early, got crushed by St. Ed’s (D1/6A) and overpowered by Clarkson who was enourmous, from Canada. It’s not like CP and Imhotep have been blowing teams away in the playoffs either. Berks could have beaten CP last year (tied at the half) and Bethlehem Catholic pushed Imhotep. I would feel bad for the seniors of both teams if they had to play against 5/6A numbers.

    And yes. Sympathy for NB schools, they are HS aged football players too.

  315. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – You hit the nail on the head, there’s lots of good high school players and a number of low D1 players in the WPIAL and I think statewide, but the high end talent level is down, just look at Prep, I don’t think they have kids going to Notre Dame and PSU this year like last year. The other thing I’ve noticed is team size in general is way down, there’s far few kids playing today than even just 5 years ago.

    I think 4A is definitely more balanced this year than the last few years and I would say there are 5-6 teams that have a legit shot at the title, think TJ will give Prep all they can handle in the quarterfinals, game will be down here this year, and the winner of D3 between McDevitt and Berks will definitely have a legit chance to beat the Prep/TJ winner. I was at the Prep/Berks game last year and agree BC was very competitive, they just couldn’t stop Billy Lucas. Also expect Imhotep to get challenged by Beth Catholic and perhaps Valley View, we’ll see what happens, but I don’t think we’re headed for round 4 of Prep vs.Tep.

  316. wpialcoach says:

    Mike F – USC not a well-coached team? You do realize Jim Render is ONE of only FOUR WPIAL coaches to win 300 games. As you pointed out, the talent level may have dropped, but not the coaching.

    CLASS 5 A

    1-Gateway vs. 16-Kiski
    2-Penn Hills vs. 15-Latrobe
    3-Peters Township vs. 14-Armstrong
    4-Penn-Trafford vs. 13-Woodland Hills
    5-West Allegheny vs. 12-Shaler
    6-Mars vs. 11-Franklin Park
    7-McKeesport vs. 10-Upper Saint Clair
    8-Bethel Park vs. 9-North Hills

  317. wpialcoach says:

    Mike F – USC not a well-coached team? You do realize Jim Render is ONE of only FOUR WPIAL coaches to win 300 games. As you pointed out, the talent level may have dropped, but not the coaching.

    1-Shady Side Academy vs. 16-Serra
    2-Burgettstown vs. 15-Riverside
    3-Charleroi vs. 14-Beth-Center
    4-Mohawk vs. 13-East Allegheny
    5-Steel Valley vs. 12-Seton LaSalle
    6-Washington vs. 11-New Brighton
    7-Freedom vs. 10-Avonworth
    8-South Side Beaver vs. 9-McGuffey

  318. Mike F says:

    Talent does seem to be ticking down. Hopefully this is just a bad cycle and it goes up again. I remember my senior year was right after LaVar’s Senior year and the everyone stated the WPIAL was down that year and off the top of my head there were still 16 kids who went to what is now P5 schools. That number is great compared to this year.

    As far as Central Valley beating Quips, we all still need to remember 1 thing. Even in the Pro’s there are major upsets, now add the addition of teenagers and how immature they can be (not singling out kids today, any year from the beginning of time to 1,000 years into the future.) and any given Friday the more talented team can loss.

    Jeff H,

    If there is one thing that your 5A class shows, is that too many teams make the playoffs. The top 8 seeds should be plenty enough if you must top 10 with a first round bye for the top 2.

  319. Mike F says:

    WPIALCoach, I stated that he was a good coach in the past but he loss whatever it was he had.

    Talent level down? In 15′ he had on his team 2 OL go to Pitt (both will probably be starters next year), 1 OL go to Robert Morris (started as a Freshman), 1 RB to go Yale (as a DB, but still a talented HS RB), and a kid at QB who chose baseball over football in college (mostly because Render screwed his recruitment) among other players who were solid if not great HS players. That team didn’t just loss to ever good team ( they played 5 teams that year who were good or better), they got demolished by 3 touchdown to all but MT Lebo which was 13 points. The only team they played that year that had superior talent was PCC. The rest were equal or less, in the case of Bethel Park and Mt Lebo way less talent. Now I understand losing to PCC that year, but losing 49-0 and being Mercy Ruled the whole 2nd half with the talent I mentioned? There was no reason not to be in the game at least till halftime and keep it in reason in the 2nd half.

    Still think he is a good coach with no talent? Lets talk 16′ where they still had a lot of talent so much so they were preseason 5A #1 by EVERYBODY who did a poll that year. I didn’t think they were and I stated that on this forum. They still managed to loss 4 games to the 4 good teams he played, even though they had at least equal if not more talent than those other teams. The best example of his poor coaching was the playoff game against McKeesport.

    I forget all the particulars of exact score, exact times, etc, but the gist is they were down by 2 touchdowns towards the end of 3rd qtr. They had the ball on the 3 yard line and USC called a time out. The QB snaps the ball, goes to hand the ball to the fullback, and a nice hole is open on the left, where clearly the play is designed to go. The refs blows the whistle because they needed to adjust the game clock. The refs who had a time out to adjust the game clock, or could have just let the play go then adjust the clock as it would have either of been a turnover on downs or a TD, blew the whistle MIDPLAY in a critical situation, to adjust the clock. Render who’s favorite pass time is yelling at refs, didn’t say a word to the refs on how they just made the TO worthless because Mckeesport saw everything, he stood there emotionless. The USC players look to the sideline for the new play call, Render with his hand, motions it in a circle, to rerun the play. The players on the field try waving it off, but again the signal to rerun it again. The crowd is screaming to change the play, we all know what it is. Mckeesport knew what it was too. They moved FOUR, again FOUR players from the right side and moved them to the left side. There were barely any Mckeesport players on the right side just a DE, OLB, and CB, The other 8 were in the middle and left side.

    The ball is snapped, the fullback is hit in the backfield as he accepts the handoff, yet he drags the defender into a steaming pile of crap and get it just inches shy of a touchdown. Ball turned over on downs, Mckeesport gets the ball on less than the one yard line up by 14, with a minute or 2 left in the 3rd. USC players quit right then and there. You could see their emotion that their coach just failed them. That game was televised that night and we DVR’d it. When this junction of the game came, the cameras showed the Mckeesport coach, and he was laughing at this gift that was given to him.

    This year again USC has talent. They have four very good/great skilled players. They have some tough guys in the trenches including a kid going D1 in wrestling at heavyweight. Yet of the 3 good/great teams they played, they only beat 1 and that was in the beginning of the year before Peters Twp. really got things rolling. Don’t feed me this crap that Render has no talent. The shame is that he does have good assistants, but Render himself, lost whatever it was he had. He stayed on longer than he should have because he wanted 400 victories. Hopefully now that he reached that feat, he will ride off in the sunset, because he is not the same coach that i am assuming he was in the 80’s-mid 2000’s.

  320. wpialcoach says:

    Mike F.

    My mistake. Jim Render has 400 WINS. The most in WPIAL history.
    FIVE WPIAL titles,
    TWO state championships
    Career record of 400-138-6 that unmatched in Western Pennsylvania.
    Nationally, only 18 active coaches have 400 wins, according to

    You just do not forget how to coach. Maybe it is personal for you? Is your child on the bench?

  321. Mike F says:

    you listed Renders lifetime achievements, which are great. Obviously showed he was a great coach at one point. Doesn’t mean he is still a great coach.

    You don’t forget how to coach? Take the crimes away but Joe Paterno. Everyone knows it was mostly Bradley at the end of the regime. How about Chuck Noll. Stuggled like hell his last few years, then Cower comes in and wins the division his first year. It happens all the time.

    There are hundreds if not thousands of coaches who has the game pass them by for multitude of reasons. Loss of passion, not able to adjust to new schemes, too suborn to change, not able to connect with today’s kids, ego gets too big to not focus on the details, etc. etc. Those examples are not to suggest what Renders ills are, those are just some of many reasons why great coaches go bad.

    Again I gave some hard evidence showing that Render is not a great coach RECENTLY (i.e. last decade). What evidence do you have showing that he is a great coach RECENTLY.

    As far as it being personal for me, my son is in 5th Grade and hopefully assistant Robbins or Corr is the HC if my son chooses to play by then. I did have a nephew who was a 3 year two way starter so sorry, not a personal vendetta here. Just a guy who does not see a great coach in Render, maybe on a good day I consider him a good coach today, but most time just average. Again his overall resume, yes great coach, but he should have left years ago.

  322. wpialcoach says:

    OK. RECENTLY. How about stats: in the past decade 72 wins and 37 losses. That is a 66% win percentage.

    Including 16 – 6 last two years.

    2018 J. Render 8-2-0
    2017 J. Render 8-4-0
    2016 J. Render 6-4-0
    2015 J. Render 5-5-0
    2014 J. Render 4-6-0
    2013 J. Render 11-1-0
    2012 J. Render 10-2-0
    2011 J. Render 11-2-0
    2010 J. Render 8-3-0
    2009 J. Render 6-4-0
    2008 J. Render 6-4-0

    2007 J. Render 7-4-0
    2006 J. Render 16-0-0 State Champion

  323. Mike F says:

    Uncle Jim is that you?

    Who did you beat and who did you lose to?

    8-2 this year 2018. They only beat Peters Township in the beginning of the year. PT would kill USC now. They got demolished by West A and Bethel Park. Will probably lose in 1st round

    Last year 2017 8-4

    Lost to Stubenville, Bethel Park, West A and first round of playoffs. Only good team they beat was South Fayette 34-33 and SF is 4A compared to USC being 5A.

    I explained 2015 & 16 already and I explained the talent he had all of these years. 2014 4-6 nothing needs said there. Basically you are holding onto 2011-2013 when the talent level was similar to every other year I already mentioned except he had 2 of the best QBs in the WPIAL on those given years. If you want to say the talent is not what it was because of that so be it, but great coaches don’t always need the best QB to win.

    Ok hold your hat on those there years 2011-2013, because I know those 2017 & 2018 records were won against bad teams. They lost to all good teams they played just like they will in the playoffs, despite being more talented than the teams they lose to.

  324. wpialcoach says:

    I offer you facts.

    You offer only excuses.

    Facts speak for themself.

  325. Mike F says:

    Excuses? What excuses, I gave clear examples which are facts also.

  326. wpialcoach says:

    Maybe I should say opinions, not excuses, and certainly not “clear facts.”.

    It is obvious you are not a coach. I have coached 20 years in the WPIAL, from Class 1A to 5A, and against Render, I can assure you that you are in the very small minority of people that would consider Jim Render a poor coach. They may think he is arrogant, but he knows football. Especially after the past two seasons, the game has not passed him by, no one is reinventing the wheel when it comes to high school football.

    I also forget to mention Jim Render has won Coach of the Year FOUR times and speaks at many coaching clinics, including NIKE COY.. He has also helped place over 40 student-athletes into college programs and he serves on the PSFCA Board of Directors and is actively involved in several projects with the BIG 33 Football Classic.

    He has been inducted in both the Pennsylvania Scholastic Football Coaches Hall of Fame (1998) and the Western Pennsylvania Sports Hall of Fame (2005).

    You offered no facts, just opinions of why he won and his opponents.

    He beat quality opponents and lost to quality opponents.

    USC beat Peters Township (8-2)
    Lost to WA (7-2)
    Lost to BP (6-3)

    Steubenville won the State Championship in OHIO.
    WA went 7-3
    BP went 8-2

    You talk about holding on to 2011-2013, but fail to recognize his record the past two years. Jim Render has had ONE losing season since 1989.

    Please stop with your nonsense, you are only demonstrating your lack of football knowledge. In fact, it sounds quite personal for you as you disregard all his achievements.

  327. Jeff H. says:

    Ok, I’ll wade into this debate on Render, I’m in Mike F’s camp, he was certainly a great coach and his record speaks for itself, but it’s pretty clear to me he has not gotten the most out of his talent in the last several years. I was at the Woodland Hills vs. USC game in 2014 when WH beat them 48-0 at USC on homecoming, there is no way in the world that WH team was 48 points better than USC that year, and the kids did seem to quit on him in the 2nd half. I was also at the WH vs. USC game this year and to say they were very fortunate to beat a mediocre WH team is an understatement, they did absolutely nothing on offense the whole game and only won 16-14 due to Woody’s ineptitude as their special teams and defense scored all 16 of their points in a 16-14 game that should not have been that close, as USC has more talent than Woody this year.

    Just like George Novak at WH he stayed on too long, both of these guys are/were indisputably great coaches, but both have stayed longer than they should have in my opinion, I love Novak and everything he did for the school, but he should have retired several years before he did and so should have Render.

  328. Mike F says:

    I am not a coach, you don’t need to be one to know/understand football. You believe what you want I will believe what I want, but I do believe you are failing to comprehend what I am actually stating so I will try one more time. Render had a great career, there is no taking away from it. I never said he wasn’t a great coach (career base), it would be stupid to suggest that, his accomplishments speak for itself. I am saying I no longer consider him a great coach today (2014-2018 not over his career). There are a lot of coaches out there, that I would put in front of Render today in 2018. If I had to put Render in a category today it would be the bubble of average/good. He beats the teams that his talent is vastly superior to, which is the basis of a good coach. He rarely ever wins anymore when the talent is equal. Yes that is my opinion of his coaching the last 7 years I followed USC. In that time I never saw them beat a good team o0ther than PT at the beginning of this year, and PT is a much improved team since then. There has been plenty of talent at USC, so I will not buy that argument at all. The assistant coaches look like they know what they are doing. Render make game day calls that make one really scratch your head. That is where I put the blame on 1 and done playoffs for the USC team.

    So again to state it clear on my position. Render is a great coach when talking about his career. Render is not a great coach talking about the past few seasons. If you see it differently fine. We don’t need to share the same opinion.

  329. wpialcoach says:

    You keep saying he has lost it in the past couple of years. That is your opinion…..

    ….but the facts say something else.

    Here are facts:

    Render coaching record the past decade 72 wins and 37 losses. That is a 66% win percentage.

    The last two seasons where Render supposedly “lost it.” = 16 -2 last two seasons. That’s a 72% winning percentage.

    Please show me the coaches with better win percentages the past two years. Maybe Pine-Richland and North Allegheny and Central Catholic.

    In Class 5A..Gateway and Penn Hills. That is it.

    Not Peters Township. Not Penn-Trafford. Not McKeesport.

    In FACT, Not any of the other 20 teams in Class 5 have coaches with better records. TWENTY teams behind USC when you base your information on facts, not emotions.

  330. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    Thank you for explaining it better than I. At no point do I feel Render is a bad coach, but he stayed too long. Robbins or Corrs (sp?) should be in charge now. But Render wanted that 400 wins, and he knew his talent was good enough to go a few years winning at least 6 games to get him there. Hopefully now that he has it, one of the younger guys can step in. That does not suggest that he isn’t a great coach when veiwing the macro, but to suggest the micro of the last few years is great is misleading.

  331. Wpialcoach says:

    I guess we’ll have to take 16 wins and 6 losses the past two seasons as your “proof” for Render being a bad coach LOL

  332. Mike F says:


    What was Mike Z’s (not even attempting to spell his last name) record at Aliquippia? What is his record at Ringold? You think the talent mattered?

    Same thing with USC. While not on the Quips level as far as high rated skill players, USC is filled with FCS/D2/D3 level skill players and linemen plus the occasional P5 lineman like Ford and Houy. Most of those other schools you mentioned even the 6A schools, don’t have that. Hell most might only have 1 kid go D3, USC send at least 3 a year D3 or better. Talent alone wins against 4A South Fayette, Baldwin, CV, Fox Chapel, Moon, etc.

    You talk about having facts and not emotions, you are the emotional one. OK you stated 20 teams behind USC the past 2 years in 5A. How many teams made it further in the playoffs than USC the past 2 years? This season appears to be 1 and done again, we will know for sure this weekend. Again, today in 2018 season he is a good coach, not a great coach. Over his career, yes great coach, no question about it.

  333. BigDog says:

    You have two arm chair coaches questioning Render. The coach with the most wins in WPIAL history.

    Guys stick to coaching your Madden video games and being spectators

  334. Wpialcoach says:

    Just give Mike time at Ringgold. It’s his first year. Every coach will tell you they need four years to install their football philosophy

    Again I offer only facts not one emotional comment

  335. Mike F says:

    Wpialcoach says:

    “I guess we’ll have to take 16 wins and 6 losses the past two seasons as your “proof” for Render being a bad coach LOL”

    Please show me where I said that he was a bad coach? I said today and the last few seasons he was not a great coach. Maybe that is your problem. You lack reading comprehension skills. I called him average, I called him good, I called him not great in reference to his RECENT results. I never once called him a bad coach, because he isn’t. A bad coach loses to teams that are vastly inferior to your talent wise. His teams do not do that so he is at least still a average/good coach.

    Please tell me your proof that he is a Great Coach when his teams haven’t gotten further than the 1st round since 2013? Off the top of my without looking it up these 5A schools have: McKeesport, Penn Hills, Gateway, Penn Trafford, West A, Woodland Hills. Not sure if Franklin Regional has or not without looking it up. Let me tell you, USC has had equal if not more talent then most of those schools since 2013.

  336. BigDog says:

    If these guys actually coached football maybe they would understand more.

    Or maybe they’re are already on USC staff and just trying to undermine Coach Renders accomplishments.

    Either way it is obvious they do understand football enough to actually be a head coach

  337. Mike F says:

    Big Dog,

    Again Question Render in the 80’s-mid 2000’s no I would not, I would be a fool to. Questioning what I saw since 2013? Yes. Even Joe Pa was losing it towards the end. Chuck Noll, Steve Spurrier, Bobby Bowden,etc etc. All of them Great coaches, all of them stayed past their prime. Why is it so hard to imagine that Render stayed on longer than he should have also?

  338. Wpialcoach says:

    His resume is the best in the business. And in a time where coaches rarely have any longevity, he’s managed to survive all the whining. Every coach the wpial trsidvtd then man. This is what proves he is a great coach.

  339. BigDog says:

    You show your lack of understanding by comparing the NFL and NCAA to high school football.

    I have said enough. The mic has been dropped

  340. Mike F says:

    I’m done. When people make stupid statements like:

    “You show your lack of understanding by comparing the NFL and NCAA to high school football.

    I have said enough. The mic has been dropped”

    What else is there to say? People in all walks of life regardless if the job is coaching/teaching/accounting/doctor/construction/etc lose the skills and abilities that made them great as they age, and can’t keep adapting to changing times, but not HS football coaches. Not the Great Jim Render.

    You guys keep coaching HS football, you clearly lack brains to do anything else productive in life.

  341. Jeff H. says:

    @WPIAL Coach – niether Mike nor myself has said Render is not a great coach, obviously he is but the fact is he should have retired several years ago but stuck around selfishly to get to 400 wins, which by the way is an unbelievable accomplishment and will probably not be equaled in the WPIAL in any of our lifetimes. You are wrong with your facts for the last few years, both PT and McKeesport have had much better records and success in both the regular season and the playoffs than USC, with McKeepsort losing a heart breaker to WA in the 2016 final and of course PT losing to Gateway last year, also add the fact that PT lost to PCC in the 4A final back in 2015, and probably should have won that game. PT also beat up on USC last year in the semi-final at West Mifflin, I was at that game and Render was clearly out coached.

    I would take a number of coaches in the WPIAL over Render TODAY, which is what we’re talking about, John Ruane of PT, Don Holl from Gateway and the retiring Bob Palko from WA to name 3 in 5A, as well as Art Walker Jr. with NA and Coach K. with PR, would also take Cherpak from TJ over Render. I have closely followed high school football for 45 years and sorry to disagree Big Dog but I don’t have to be a coach to know what the hell I’m talking about, so please don’t insult my intelligence by making a snide remark about sticking with Madden, which by the way I have never played in my life.

    USC will likely lose to McKeesport in the first round this weekend, and if they somehow win that game they will get smoked by Penn Hills the following week, you can take that to the bank.

  342. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    Thank you for explaining it better than me again. I would also add Joe Rossi at SF. Also how could a person not say right now Methany at Bethel Park when his team beaten USC more than not the last few times they played with less talent. All the coached you mentioned and I mentioned may not be better coaches overall than Render, but right now in 2018 they are. Again, these are not talentless USC teams. They may not be stacked, but they are talented and should be doing better than losing in the 1st round of the playoffs in an era when too many teams make it. Back in the 90’s when I played and only the top 2 made the playoffs, USC would not have made the playoffs since 2013.

  343. Jeff H. says:

    @Mike F – forgot about Rossi at SF but agree he is a much better coach today than Render, also think Metheny at BP is a very good coach. It’s a fact some great coaches stick around longer than they should, and you cited several good examples in the NCAA and NFL, I mentioned Novak with WH as a high school example, I don’t understand why it’s so difficult for some people to get that. Neither of us are taking anything away from Render, his record speaks for itself, but what has he done in the last handful of years with the amount of talent he’s had, we both completely agree his teams have underachieved recently, others can disagree and that’s fine, but to say we don’t know what we’re talking about because we have never coached before is ridiculous.

  344. Black Panther says:

    Please tell me how going 8-2 is losing your skills? USC beat a sound Peters Township team that just moved down from 6A and the aforementioned Woodland Hills, as well as a 9-1 South Fayette team coaches by Joe Rossi.

    Trade with Penn-Trafford or McKeesport. You would have almost the same results……Since 2008

    McKeesport 89-28
    USC 83-37
    Penn-Trafford 77-33

    Jeff Metheny from Bethel Park has been running the same program for 27 years and Bethel Park is 6-3 and not one person is saying he needs to change. Football is still based on passing, catching, running and tackling. You clearly have no football intelligence, I guess that is why you are the one making such stupid comments lol. Maybe you should actually try coaching instead of commenting on it. All the teams you say Render has lost to, he has also beat all those teams, including a win over Woodland Hills this year…….. This is also about character. I agree Don Holl is a great coach, but he was also fired from Seneca Valley, Art Walker was run out of PCC, Kasper was suspended for one month at PR. All great coaches, but character has a place in high school football as well.

    Yes, I question anyone’s intelligence when they never coached, maybe never even played a down of football, and yes you should be a coach to know what you are talking about because you clearly have no idea what goes into being a head coach. Instead of offering BS opinions with emotional responses , maybe you should throw your hat into the ring. You are nothing more than a SPECTATOR, so
    let the coaches coach while you continue to be a SPECTATOR and watch the professionals from the stands. You are not the man with multiple WPIAL and STATE championships, or a career record of 400-138-6 that unmatched in Western Pennsylvania. You have not been inducted WPIAL Hall of Fame or serve on the PSFCA Board of Directors . Render is in both the Pennsylvania Scholastic Football Coaches Hall of Fame (1998) and the Western Pennsylvania Sports Hall of Fame (2005). And the biggest laughter, you say “you clearly lack brains to do anything else productive in life.” Yet YOU HAVE THE MOST POSTS ON THIS PAGE LOL. Are you sure you have time to do anything else but be an arm chair coach?

    Being a high school coach means more than winning games and game planning, it means assisting student-athletes with their college choices, working with college coaches on recruiting, assisting the school in discipline.

    USC may lose in the first round, but he has also won in the first round many times. No matter what happens, it will never take away from what Jim has done for USC, and he will continue to coach as you will continue to whine.

    Ryan Croyle is being personally groomed to be the next head coach, that is why he was brought in.

    USC may very well lose this week, but it is not because Render has all of the sudden lost his football knowledge.

    Jeff H and MIke F (or one and the same) maybe you should start playing Madden because your opinions on football are garbage.

  345. New2PA says:

    I haven’t been here long enough to go way back, but the only complaint that I’ve consistently heard about Coach Render is that his offense and defense got stale. Maybe he could be faulted for that (I don’t know), but it seems like the rest is pretty cut and dried. I do believe that this year they have changed things up and maybe (or maybe not) that has lead to a very nice record against quality teams.

  346. Jeff H. says:

    @Black Panther – you\re entitled to your opinion, we’re entitled to ours, that’s why boards like this exist. I never said he wasn’t a great coach, clearly he is, and I know he’s done great things and continues to do great things for his players and the St. Clair community, just like Coach Novak at Woodland Hills. My point is that he has continued coaching a few years longer than he probably should have, and his record the last 5 yrs is slightly above average at 31-21 including 1-3 in the playoffs thus far, and if you take out this year his record the last 4 yrs is 23-19. I have nothing against the man, he deserves all the accolades he gets, and it’s tough to walk away from something you’ve been doing passionately for almost half a century. I agree with New2PA that his play calling on both sides of the ball has gotten a little stale and predictable, the Woodland Hills faithful like myself would and did say the same exact thing about Novak, but that doesn’t take anything away from his accomplishments either.

    I must admit his record this year is better than I expected, based on what I saw in person against Woodland Hills, they were lucky to win that game and this is one of the worst WH teams in school history, I was surprised they beat Peters and also thought they would lose to Lebo, I just think it\s time to get on with his life’s work like Chuck Noll used to say, and I think he’s probably going to retire after this season ends.

  347. Jeff H. says:

    Well, the WPIAL steering committee didn’t agree with me or Don Rebel at triblive who predicted the same bracket as I did, bracket as follows:

    #1 Gateway vs. #16 Kiski
    #2 Penn Hills vs. #15 Latrobe
    #3 Peters vs. #14 Armstrong
    #4 Mars. vs #13 Woodland Hills
    #5 West A vs. #12 Shaler
    #6 Penn Trafford vs. #11 North Hills
    #7 McKeesport vs. #10 USC
    #8 BP vs. #9 Franklin

    Only road team I can see winning is USC, but I think McKeesport will win, they’ve had their number the last few years, otherwise hard to see an upset among the other games based on the way teams have been playing the last several weeks, usually the 8-9 could produce a road winner, but hard to see Franklin beating BP with the way they’ve lost the last 3 weeks. Should be a good tournament, too bad the final is at Norwin and not Heinz.

  348. Mikefln says:

    Jeff H must agree I see 1-8 winning too and I still stand by my call earlier that 16 teams making playoffs is too many. I understand any given day but too many teams that have no chance.

    Black Panther,

    It is clear that you and WPIALCoach have a hard time distinguishing between past accomplishments vs present accomplishments and the whole body of work. So I am going to say agree to disagree.

  349. wpialcoach says:

    Since when is going 8-4 last season (2017) and 8-2 this season (2018) considered “past accomplishments” There can literally be nothing more present then the last two seasons.

    Your opinion may be USC should be winning more, but that is subjective because in many peoples eyes, 16-6 the past two years is great, especially with wins this year against a great South Fayette team and a solid Peters Township team. As far as being predictable. It is high school football. Not one coach in the WPIAL has invented a new offense or defense. They go with what fits your personnel. Some team run a spread one year, then power I the next. North Allegheny immediately comes to mind.

    Your only argument is the game has passed him by, but the two most recent seasons prove you wrong. They very well may lose in the first round, but they will come back next season just as well prepared as they have been every season under Jim Render.

  350. Mike F says:

    What you just described about the past 2 years is called good coaching not great coaching. What he did in the 80’s and 90’s, that was great coaching. What he did since 2013 is just good coaching. 16-6 is good not great. Pine Richland, Gateway, Penn Hills records the past 2 years are great. 16-6 is over 2 years is good. 31- 21 over 5 years is average especially when there was more talent those years with the 3 linemen I mentioned before along with the RB. You know what is great. His overall record and the WPIAL and state titles.

    I am done debating this. To each there own as no one’s opinion is changing.

  351. wpialcoach says:

    Again, people disagree with you. Obviously the USC school bard and administrators who keep renewing his contract believe he is doing a great job, and they certainly more know than the both of us. Unless of course, you happen to be a rm chair administrator also.

    Your 5 year stats are correct, but go back just one more year and these are the numbers.

    Past 2 years = 24-2 Past 6 years = 48 – 20

    Penn HIlls:
    Past 2 years = 18-4 Past 6 years = 32 – 20

    Upper Saint Clair
    Past 2 years 16-6 Past 6 years = 42 – 22

    Every team fluctuates as some point, but over the long, Jim Render has persevered and will continue to do so. Hopefully this week.

  352. Billy Splain says:

    I see a bunch of guys who go to a lot of games who should BE WRITING FOR US!!! What say you guys? anyone interested in being on our team?

  353. Black Panther says:

    Since you are so big on recent records to define “great”. I think finishing in the top five the past two seasons record wise is “great”, but I am sure you could do better Coach ;).

    1-Gateway (21-2)
    2-Penn-Trafford (19-4)
    3-Penn Hills (18-4)
    4-McKeesport (16-5)
    5-Upper Saint Clair (16-6)
    6-Peters Township (15-6)
    7-Mars (15-6)
    8-West Allegheny (14-5)
    9-Bethel Park (14-5)
    10-Franklin Regional (12-5)
    11-North Hills (11-9)
    12-Armstrong (11-9)
    13-Woodland Hills (10-11)
    14-Latrobe (8-12)
    15-Fox Chapel (8-12)
    16-Moon (7-13)
    17-Baldwin (5-14)
    18-Chartiers Valley (5-15)
    19-Plum (5-15)
    20-Hampton (5-17)
    21-Shaler (4-16)
    22-Kiski Area (4-16)
    23-Connellsville (4-16)
    24-Albert Gallatin (3-17)

  354. Mike F says:

    Black panther,

    Like I said I am done with the conversation. You have your opinion I have mine.

  355. Mike F says:


    Like I said I am done with the conversation, but your argument that people disagree with me proves nothing because there are also people that do agree with me. It is called an opinion and everyone is entitled to form their own. Your on one side I on the other so agree to disagree.


    Thanks for the offer but I am not much of a writer.

  356. wpialcoach says:

    The only people that need to agree with me are the School Board members and administration, They obviously believe Jim is doing a “great” job as they keep renewing his contract. And not one person has come to a school board meeting to say otherwise. So, you and your friends are either silent cowards, in the minority, or most likely both. That is the end of any debate on Jim Render’s coaching greatness.

  357. B. Powell says:

    How does a Canadian team travel to Erie and beat not only Erie High, but also Cathedral Prep and (22) 4th qtr points against Prep?
    That must be the best team in Canada, for sure, and must be, give that team 4 downs instead of three and they’re formidable.
    D10 Insider may be right and ECP needs to regroup a bit.
    Fortunately, FLB this week and we’ll be trying, but do you have to put your next opponent on your website already? LOL.
    I wish we had something for ya but I’m proud of the boys, regardless.

  358. D10 Insider says:

    Can we get back to HS football talk on here and stop comparing coaches records. You guys do know the playoffs are starting this week and have already started for some right? Plenty of other topics.

  359. D10 Insider says:

    Clarkson North averaged probably 6’5 300 across the offensive line and just ran straight at Prep. CP also played with an entire backfield of back ups, and still ran for 500 yards. Not the same CP as previous years, but that Canadian team was something else. If Prep is totally healthy they win that game by 2 or 3 scores.

  360. wpialcoach says:

    I will be scouting the West Allegheny vs, Shaler game. I will get to you all then.

  361. Mike F says:

    I will not be at a game this week. Pitt plays Virginia on Friday. As much as I hate college football being played on a Friday that is not Black Friday after Thanksgiving, I am glad Pitt playing is week if they must play on a Friday. Traditionally speaking, there are not many close scores, and I do not see many interesting match ups that I would be upset missing to watch Pitt. With that said, again I hate College football on Friday, but money rules all, so it is here to stay.

  362. Jeff H. says:

    Has anyone seen Mars play live this year. I think the WPIAL has over seeded them at #4, yes they are 9-1, but they play in by far the weakest conference in 5A and their non conference schedule of West Mifflin, Moon and Greensburg Salem is not exactly murderers row, I felt both WA and Penn Trafford should have been seeded ahead of them, they lost to Penn Hills, the only really good team they have played, by 3 TDs. If Mars played either WA’s or PT’s schedule I can pretty much guarantee they would have more than 1 loss. Woodland Hills is pretty mediocre this year, I’ve seen every game as my daughter is in the band, but they do have a pretty solid defense that keeps them in most games, and I think this game might be a lot closer than a lot of people expect. If there’s a lower seed upset other than USC over McKeesport, which would not be much of an upset, I suspect it will be WH over Mars, that’s probably wishful thinking on my part, but I’m wondering how good Mars really is, guess I’ll find out Friday night.

    @Mikefin – completely agree with too many bad teams making the playoffs, it’s been a problem in the WPIAL for years. Classic example is 3-7 Kiski against 10-0 Gateway. Woodland Hills beat Kiski 47-0 earlier this month, just imagine what Gateway is going to do to them, they could literally put up 100 on them if they wanted, instead it will probably be 49-0 at half and Gateway will rest their starters in the 2nd half. I fail to see how total mismatches and mercy rule games in the playoffs benefit anybody, it’s not good for the kids who get pounded into oblivion, and what good is it for the kids on the superior team, I think it would be better for everybody involved to give the really good teams byes and cut down on the number of teams in the playoffs. To ask high school kids to play 16 weeks in a row is more than even the NFL does, and giving the top tier teams a bye the first week of the playoffs is a better solution for everyone involved in my opinion and better for the sport overall.

  363. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    @ Jeff H. — Agree with you regarding how too many inferior teams qualify for the playoffs. Generally I love these games, but the hard reality is that some of these teams have no business in the post season — especially when it requires a match up against a top seed. There was a recent article about this on Regarding the NJ non-public state tournaments sometimes teams literally say: ‘thank you but no thank you’, and bail. Camden Catholic was supposed to play Bergen Catholic I believe in the first round and voluntarily forfeited the game. Public teams had been doing this in NJ (regular season games) for a while but non-public forfeiting to another non-public is telling.

  364. sausmann9 says:

    another ridiculous game being played is Wilmington at 9-1 v Greenville at 3-7. Wilmington beat them first time around 40-0 with 2nd team in at halftime and clock running entire second half.

  365. Mike F says:

    The WPIAL and all districts for that matter need to explain why these 1st round games are needed. What good do they accomplish? Don’t tell me “so the kids and the district can experience the playoff” nonsense, because it is just that, nonsense. The kids know they don’t deserve it at 3-7. The neighborhood knows and don’t rally behind the team at 3-7 just because they “made” the playoffs.

    Look at David Adams from PCC, one of the best LB to come out of this state in the last decade had to quit football his before sophomore year at Notre Dame (not sure if he is on a medical hardship scholarship or not) because in HS he played 16 games a season and his body was too beaten up. The state championship game should be game 14 (preferably 13, but that might be too much of a squeeze ) but 15 or 16 games for kids not getting paid is too much. That may be OK for a team like Quaker Valley last year who is more than likely one and done going that far. But your ECPs/PCC/PR/ST Joe’s, it is too many games for perennial contenders.

  366. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Maybe St. Joe’s Prep is onto something, They usually play 2 or 3 less games than other playoff teams. That’s a calculated move, it reduces the risk of injuries and refreshes them.

  367. Jeff H. says:

    @ The artist – completely agree about SJP, they’ve been doing it for years, they treat their program like a college does and schedule off weeks, most of the public schools don’t have that luxury, but the districts could help out their top tier teams that have state title aspirations by giving them a week off before the playoffs start instead of playing a mercy rule game and risking injuries to key players and just the wear and tear of another game, even against an inferior opponent.. WPIAL is doing it in 6A this year out of necessity, and they should consider doing it in the other classes as well. In 5A it’s ridiculous 16 out of 24 teams make the playoffs, they could just as easily take the top 4 teams in each of the three conferences for a field of 12 teams, give the 3 conference winners and the top 2nd place team a bye, and then have the other 8 teams play in the first round, that makes far more sense to me than a watered down 16 team playoff which includes several teams with losing records.

  368. Mike F says:

    How this season should have looked. This is WPIAL based, since other Districts are smaller and run differently, they would adjust accordingly to accommodate game/week 1 to State championship:

    Week1 August 24
    Week 2 August 31
    Week 3 Sept 7
    Week 4 Sept 14
    Week 5 Sept 21
    Week 6 Sept 28
    Week 7 Oct 5
    Week 8 Oct 12
    Week 9 Oct 19
    Week 10 Oct 26 1st week of playoff Half the teams don’t make so this is qtr finals
    Week 11 Nov 2 WPIAL semi finals
    Week 12 Nov 9 WPIAL Finals
    Week 13 Nov 16 Western Finals
    Week 14 Nov 23 PIAA state title

    No reason at all to go into December with HS football. PA has one of the longest running seasons in the country and the ones who run as long are generally southern states. Ohio finishes on December 1, we currently go to Dec 6. 16 games is just too many games for these kids at the perennial contenders schools.

  369. sausmann9 says:

    @ Artist – SJP does this every season, just another “way around” things that some schools can do. One season they had their TWO bye weeks right before the LaSalle game and the NP game (I think it was NP). I do know many schools are in leagues that require them to play ever team but one, some of those leagues have 10 or 11 teams in them.

    This also allows them to scout out their opponents for two weeks instead of one.

  370. me888 says:

    “sausmann9 says:
    October 31st, 2018 at 7:22 am
    another ridiculous game being played is Wilmington at 9-1 v Greenville at 3-7. Wilmington beat them first time around 40-0 with 2nd team in at halftime and clock running entire second half.”

    D10 adopted an all inclusive playoff system a few years ago. Every team makes the playoffs. They also permit teams to “opt-out” of the postseason “before the playoff schedule is decided upon”. Many teams choose that option when they believe they have no chance. Greenville chose to play for whatever reason. The district didn’t decide who and how many teams were in. That’s not the same as the WPIAL that decided the playoff structure prior to the season. This situation is on Greenville, not the D10 organization.

  371. sausmann9 says:

    @me888 – thanks, didn’t know that about D10 and WOW what kind of nonsense is that!!! What D10 should really do is drop that first week of “studs v duds” and start week 2 games right away, then give the champs a bye week as the rest of the districts are hammering it out. Not sure if that could be done but as a D10 I would think they would want to give their representing teams the best chance they could.

    Don’t get me wrong though, the extra game is always extra experience for the younger guys so there is a positive to it, at least for Greenville but damn Wilmington risking injuries and crap like that is just uncalled for in a game like that.

    With that said – Go Trojans! Upset of the decade about to unfold.

  372. sausmann9 says:

    WPIAL championships – my apologies if this is posted somewhere on this site but I couldn’t find the info on WPIAL championships this season. Anyone have the times and date for the games??? I am assuming Nov 17 and only 3A, 4A, 5A and 6A are playing there; is this anywhere near correct??? tx.

  373. Mike F says:


    No the WPIAL has the 5A game at Norwin and the 2 A game at Robert Morris on either 11/23 or 11/24 . The other 4 will be at Heinz on the 16th or 17th.

  374. Jeff H says:

    @Sausman – Mike F. is correct, 1A, 3A, 4A and 6A games at Heinz on Saturday 11/17, times to be determined, 5A at Norwin on Friday night 11/23, and 2A at Robert Morris on Saturday afternoon 11/24. Both 2A and 5A have 16 team brackets thus the extra week of playoffs, both enter the state playoffs in the semi-final round, in 2A the WPIAL winner will likely be playing Wilmington from D10, and in 5A the winner will likely be playing 2 time defending champ Archbishop Wood

  375. B. Powell says:

    It isn’t quite bad as you think up here and we keep the competitive spirit and the American Dream alive. LOL.
    It’s not completely all-inclusive as Meadville couldn’t get in for 5A, three or four schools in AAA didn’t make it and 1 or two in class A didn’t have a shot.
    At least they leave it up to the schools to decide -at the end of the season- if they want to continue for 1 or two more weeks.
    FLB has little chance against ECP this week but we decided at the 4A head count we were staying 4A for this 2-year cycle and play Prep.
    Like I say, we have the halftime covered and we get to play of turf in Erie stadium, which is a welcome mat for us and not at our rice paddy.
    Anyway, Prep is wanting -and expecting- a game from someone this week and we’ll be there; we aren’t poor and as said below – this is two more weeks of practice for the underclassmen.
    5 years from now the SR’s can say they finished with Prep at Erie Stadium.
    And we are teaching our kids not to run away from life’s challenges.

    Some ot these other districts are so large, (Districts 7 and 3) there’s plenty of time to have near all inclusive playoffs here.
    Dream big, even if the locker room pep talk lasts 5 minutes.
    And so what…in the end, so what.

  376. D10 Insider says:

    B – If you’ve looked on Twitter at all surrounding the hype for the game their is a lot of respect for FLB coming from Prep. I agree with everything you said and who knows, what if they knock em off? After last week I will say this, Prep won’t take them lightly, and FLB deserves the Ramblers best shot. Looking forward to two good programs and staffs that do things the right way competing the right way. Good luck to both teams!

  377. wpialcoach says:

    The First round of the Playoffs is to simply raise money. The school get the gate and the WPIAL gets the ticket sales. Eliminating the first round makes sense, especially considering teams are making it in with losing records then getting mercy ruled. It would also help shorten an incredibly long season.

  378. sausmann9 says:

    God I hate the PIAA for screwing up something that was soooo freakin’ AWESOME in the WPIAL championships at Heinz! If the WPIAL ever leaves the PIAA I will forever drive to Heinz and support those championships and continue to skip Hershey as we are currently doing.

    For those that never went to a WPIAL championships back in the day before the PIAA came up with 6 classifications, they just wouldn’t understand why its so cool and important to the schools of D7. Right now I am ONLY three WPIAL champiionships events behind state championship events. Being that I will not be attending any more Hershey games, in three seasons I will have attended more WPIAL championships than PIAA championships.

    Oh yeah, Bethlehem to Hershey = 1 hour
    Bethlehem to Heinz = 4 hours

    we really don’t need the PIAA and their circus they bring to town.

  379. Mike F says:


    You mentioned something that others will not understand. They never understood why WPIAL teams/kids cared more about the WPIAL championship than the state championship. No other district covers as many teams as the WPIAL does/did. Back in the day winning districts for most teams was just a small prize because their district was small. Basically you had to be better than 15 or so other teams which is no small feat, but not a hard grind either, so it was not a grand feat either? After that those teams finally worked through the grind of the state playoff with their main price being the state title.

    The WPIAL was and maybe still is a different animal. Back when I played in the 90’s, our goal (and every WPIAL teams goal) was to get to 3 Rivers Stadium. That was the main goal of the season. It amazes me how well balanced each class was as there were 4 classes with 4 conferences of 7-8 teams so 28-32 teams per class. To be a top 2 team ( or a wildcard 3rd) in a conference to make the playoffs meant you were good. None of this 4-6 record nonsense. There were teams 8-2 not making the playoffs. Then you had 2 hard hitting/grueling playoff games to endure. If you overcame that grind, you reached the first part of the main prize, getting to 3 Rivers Stadium. Yes the place was too big for the crowd, but who cares. You are at 3 Rivers the home of our idols the Pittsburgh Steelers. Once there a huge test stood in your way of completing the second part of your main goal of being WPIAL champs. You had to beat an opponent (who also went through the grind) on the grand stage of 3 Rivers Stadium while playing on TV, (not heard of at that time for non championship games). If you won, you achieved your seasons goals.

    After that you were automatically in the Western Final. You went from 3 Rivers to if your lucky Slippery Rock, NA, or Altoona. If not lucky South (Cupples) or some other horrendous field. to play a game to achieve a prize that was never mentioned as a goal before or during the season. It only became a goal, after you achieved what was already your main goal. The other teams were still on mission for their main goal.

    I never made the playoffs, but those were our goals. Kids I knew on State champ teams from other schools who I spoke to, also stated those were their goals. People not from around here do not understand that.

    Not sure if it is still like that with 6 classifications (with 1 class with only 9 teams so what kind of prize is a WPIAL title with that). But back in the day. It was 3 Rivers/Heinz and WPIAL Title or bust for us WPIAL folks.

  380. Jeff H. says:

    @WPIAL coach – couldn’t agree with you more, first round is simply about making money, imo would be better for everyone involved for fewer teams to make the playoffs and give the teams a bye week, it’s an awful lot to ask high school kids to play 16 weeks in a row, not even the NFL does that anymore. District 3 has started to see the light this year and I hope other districts follow suit, they have 28 teams in 5A, with 14 making the playoffs, and their top 2 teams get byes (still too many making the playoffs imo but they are on the right track).

    @Mike F – you hit the nail on the head, not many people in other parts of the state understand how every teams goal in the WPIAL was/is to get to the district final and play at 3 Rivers/Heinz, that’s unique among districts across the state. D1 for example doesn’t even use neutral sites, so the highest seeded team is at home, even in the district final. One of the big reasons the WPIAL was reluctant to even join the state playoffs when they started back in 1988 was concern over the impact it might have on the district championships at 3 Rivers, if you remember USC won the WPIAL 4A title in 1988, but they declined to participate in the state playoffs, so runner-up Central Catholic went instead and they ended up winning the first 4A state title.

  381. D10 Insider says:

    I see Thomas Jefferson had another undefeated regular season, and are the number 1 seed in the WPIAL, again. I find it interesting, well interesting may not be the word so let’s use funny, that Cherpak has no problem beating teams 62-0, 48-0, 70-21. Beat AG by 60 2 years in a row. Beats LH by 50 3 years in a row, Trinity by 40 3 years in a row but has to complain about ECP every year. The Ramblers, no doubt are struggling right now, and may have their hands full tonight. This could be the perfect year for TJ to knock them off, but their schedule and their coach will more than likely be the difference maker. Good luck to all D10 teams! Win the state!

  382. Jeff H says:

    D10 Insider – do you really think Prep is going to have their hands full tonight, I see them winning by several scores. And I expect they will play TJ again in the quarterfinals for the 4th year in a row assuming they beat a pretty good Clearfield team, if TJ is ever going to beat them think this is the year, but I have my doubts, and we’ll probably have to listen to Cherpak whine again.

  383. D10 Insider says:

    I can’t help but to give respect to FLB and think their staff and players will be more than prepared for this game. I also don’t think you guys understand how hurt Prep is. They are using back ups at QB, RB, DE, S, and have played more bodies at LB this year than in any I’ve ever seen. I thought no way Clarkson would have beaten Prep and they did. FLB is not Clarkson, but I do think they can hang with CP and take a few of the punches from the guys filling in for starters.

  384. sausmann9 says:

    @Mike F – you got it brother!!! WPIAL championships are second to none. I had a cousin that graduated from Mt Lebo in 86′ or 87′ and another family member go to Cannon Mac back in the early 70’s. I was always jealous of him as a kid when he was talking about shooting for Three River Stadium. Hopefully something will happen to either get the WPIAL out of the PIAA and back to four or even five classes or the PIAA will eventually pull their collected heads out of their money-hungry butts!

  385. B. Powell says:

    Be careful, Saussman…
    Seems like when there’s a hearing with the PIAA, they win and send us home.
    But in your case, that could be a good thing because, as you say, the WPIAL has it going on pretty good.

    D10: Farrell wanted to come back to the WPIAL and the were stuffed in a bag and told to stay in D10 and get along!
    Then McDowell was wanting to come back to the WPIAL (like the were when James Conner played?) but were told to go home.
    Bye, bye. Too bad, so sad. You have a nice peninsula in Erie.
    Bye, bye.

  386. B. Powell says:

    Talking about playing on Heinz field has me thinking about another nice one…
    In Western, NY they have their section finals at the Bill’s stadium this weekend and even the small, class C and class D teams get to play there. These schools are so small, most of the class C and D teams are a co-op of 2 or 3 towns playing together as one.
    But, how cool is that for these kids and their fans?
    If they win and go on, in a few weeks they finish in the dome at Syracuse.

    NY is very fan and school friendly to the football teams.

  387. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – I knew Prep was dealing with some injuries but not to the extent you described, still, I’d be very surprised if FLB keeps this game within 3 scores, no disrespect meant to FLB but think Preps 2nd team could beat them, based on some of their blowout loses this year, Sharon crushed them in their last game, are you saying Prep with all their injuries are still not better than Sharon? Don’t get me wrong, Sharon’s got a very good program and great tradition, but they’re not Prep.

    @ B. Powell – it ‘s pretty unrealistic for McDowell to join the WPIAL again with the move to 6 classes, was the same thing with Altoona before they left, they would have a 2 hour plus bus ride each way to conference games in the South Hills and Westmoreland County, if they could just play the northern suburb schools like PR, SV and NA that would be one thing, but to travel to Hempfield, Norwin, Mt. Lebo and Canon Mac is a bit much, and vice versa for the WPIAL teams going up there, not just the teams but the bands, cheerleaders, fans/parents, etc.

  388. B. Powell says:

    I can cover for D10 Insider –
    As a FLB grad and tax payer, he is being nice and showing respect. Well done on his part because Prep and FLB play each other in most sports. It wouldn’t be the same if we didn’t play them (and McDowell and Erie High) and part of me wants to be in the region with them, once again. I think (2) years ago we were hanging in with McDowell 13-18 midway through the 4th Qtr and on a change of possession, our kids looked over and saw the McDowell offense coming back on the field and we had to turn around and play “D”.
    The wind went out of our sails and McDowell added two more late scores to make it seem like they owned us, but we were hanging.
    That and we lost (2) QB’s, both consecutive years, when we played those big teams to career ending injuries. Prep, Erie and McDowell are a bit much for us at the moment and we need our numbers back up in the 40’s for varsity again. 40 or 50 who can play.
    Before Erie High combined, we beat Strong Vincent, Central and East in the same year and now look.
    The paper picked a generic 35-14 score tonight to keep people calm and that score is always used as “code”.
    They don’t want phone calls and want to sell papers.
    After tonight, I’m a D10 fan for all the teams who move on to the state brackets.

  389. Jeff H. says:

    @ B. Powell – understood, thanks for clarifying, hope for all involved it’s not a blowout and no one gets hurt.

  390. Jeff H, says:

    Well, I was right, Mars was definitely over-seeded, the WPIAL blew that one, Woodland Hills dominated in 14-0 win that wasn’t really that close, Mars never threatened to score and couldn’t handle WH team speed. The other surprise was Franklin blowing out Bethel Park 56-28, shocked they scored that many points, don’t think anyone saw that coming.

    Looking ahead to next week we have 2 conference rematches, doubt Gateway will beat Franklin by 60 again but they will coast and expect them to win by 3-4 scores, WH and WA went to the wire in the first game with WA winning 14-13 by stopping a 2pt point conversion at the half yard line with a minute and a half to go in the game, expect another hard fought low scoring game next week that could go either way. In the other half of the bracket Peters vs Penn Trafford should be a battle and not sure who I like in that game, two very good teams in what could be the best game of the week in any classification, also think Mckeesport will challenge PH but expect PH to win by 2 scores.

    In 6A SV put an end to PCC’s disappointing season with a 15-14 win and think they will give NA all they can handle next week, expect the PR vs.,Mt Lebo game to be closer than the first game and don’t think PR will jump out to a 28-0 lead but PR will end up winning by 2 TDs.

  391. D10 Insider says:

    B – 14-6 with a minute to go in the first half, I would say FLB hung around as long as they could. If CP doesn’t get that score before halftime that game could have been a little closer. Prep slowly dismantled FLB but the kids played tough and went toe to toe, took every punch with the two time defending champs. I think that’s great.

    I predicted the 5A game as being a 3-0 snooze fest and it turned out to be. 14-12 Oil City, the 5A representatives from district 10……one thing that is impressive is the RB for OC has run for 3k yards this year. I had no idea. Maybe next year Wells! Was OCs line too big and linebackers too fast?

    Jeff H – great WPIAL info as always. Couldn’t believe SV got CC like that. To your earlier post about CP/FLB even with all the injured Prep players yes I do think they would soundly beat Sharon.

    When Prep gets Lucas and Johnson back on the field they are state contenders again. Regan Schleicher and Luke Sittinger have done great jobs filling in for them during their injuries but those two guys are the difference makers after Thanksgiving. Prep needs them back or they are in for a fight, which I still think they can win.

  392. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    The North Penn Knights win again. Admittedly, they haven’t exactly been dazzling this year nor do they have a plethora of Division I talent if any, but it reminds me of what the late, great Buddy Ryan once said about Cris Carter after cutting him: “All he does is score touchdowns.” All NP does is score W’s. I expect to see them in the District 1 final, should be interesting.

  393. D10 Insider says:

    If ECP and Clearfield win (both are heavy favorites) any thoughts or ideas on where that game would be played? I can’t remember when or if these two districts played each other in the past.

  394. B Powell says:

    I think that ECP vs Clearfield game could be played anywhere from DuBois, Clarion U or Meadville and I believe Slippery Rock U wouldn’t make sense.
    Maybe it was 1993 ? when Clearfield came to Erie Vet’s stadium and got whipped by Central when Erie Central was coached by Joe Tarasovich. It was the qtr final round and different times and I doubt they use Vet’s for this game.
    I believe Prep’s strength of schedule gets them through against Clearfield – just by looking at rosters and results on Maxpreps.
    I know Billy is high on Clearfield in his rankings, but I’m experienced with past history and D10 results vs D9. If Prep has their guys back and aren’t looking ahead to TJ, they win.

  395. Jeff H, says:

    @the artist – i realize this is a western board but since you brought up North Penn I think they are going to have their hands full with Neshaminy this week and wouldn’t be surprised at all if they lose that game, I have a hunch they don’t make the D1 final, and if they do they will get beat by Coatesville by at least 2 TD’s.

    @B. Powell – agree with you about D10 vs. D9, Clearfield has a solid team this year but I would be shocked if they beat Prep, they haven’t played anywhere close to the schedule Prep has played and in fact Prep will be by far the best team they have played all year, and when a team takes a major jump in competition they usually don’t fare too well (case in point was Mars against Woodland Hills on Friday, they came in 9-1 but the only good team they played all year was Penn Hills, whereas Woodland Hills played a handful of teams that were better than Mars, and it showed on the field). Same problem when TJ plays Prep, they will not have faced any team all year the quality of Prep, and it shows when they play them, TJ is just another game for Prep as they have played several teams better than TJ, but Prep on the other hand is a big step up in competition for TJ.

  396. D10 Fan says:

    The brackets got flipped around again for the new cycled year so to answer your question D10 Insider my guess would be somewhere along I-80. District 6 or 9 gets to host the sub regional this year, and I would expect Clearfield would want as much as an advantage as possible so expect that one to be at Dubois. What this means however is if Clearfield beats Prep I believe District 7 would host the next round, but if Prep wins, District 10 will host the WPIAL Champ again. Thus giving us another cry baby rant from Cherpak if they make it out of Heinz Field.

  397. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    I agree having a great record is nice, but at some point you do have to ask “who did you beat and who did you lose to”. Obviously ECP played a more challenging schedule than TJ or any WPIAL team to this point in season. With that said, TJ played a solid schedule with some good teams in it and they won. Not like Mars who lost to the one good team they played in the reg season. Also once they come out of the WPIAL playoffs, they will have faced good/great teams. It is not fair to say they never played someone as good as ECP during the Reg season, because normally ECP is head and shoulders better than everyone else. I do believe this is the year that TJ( assuming they make it out of the WPIAL) has its best shot at ECP. I see that game being very close this year with who ever makes the least mistakes winning.

  398. wpialcoach says:

    West Allegheny looked great in a win over Shaler, whose offensive line was not able to block anyone. Should be a great game against Woodland Hills. I thought Heinauer would have Mars better prepared for WH, but they played great, Hats off to the WH staff.

    Thomas Jefferson was no surprise, should be a great match with South Fayette.

    Looking forward to seeing Burgettstown vs. Freedom.

  399. Jeff H. says:

    @ Mike F – I disagree with you about TJ’s schedule this year, they have played 1 good team, Belle Vernon, and beat them soundly, the rest of their schedule is comparable to Mars. The 5A team they played was a weak Connelsville squad, also played 3A Central Valley who was so-so, and the rest of their 4A opponents outside of Belle Vernon were mediocre or below average. They will have faced some good teams in the playoffs, not great, South Fayette is very good but I wouldn’t consider them great. Their relatively weak schedule has come back to haunt them in the past in the state playoffs, they had a great team 2 years ago and I thought had a legit chance to beat ECP, but they ended up losing 30-13 in a game I attended at Baldwin and did a write-up for Billy for this website. It was very evident in that game that TJ had not faced a team like ECP and made mistakes they normally wouldn’t make, must have dropped at least a half dozen passes when they had guys wide open but either tried to run before they caught the ball or were looking over their shoulder for the defender, in part because they were going up against kids who were bigger and faster than anyone they had played all season.

    I do agree the game this year will be closer than the past few years and think they have a chance to beat them if they play a mistake free game, I certainly would like to see TJ knock them off this year, think the game will be in the Pittsburgh area, so if they are ever going to beat them this is probably the year.

  400. Mike F says:

    Jeff H stated:

    “It was very evident in that game that TJ had not faced a team like ECP”

    That is my point. The 2016 & 2017 ECP team were a special group. I really beleive that last years team could have won 6A, that is how talented they were. There was/is no playing teams comparable to them to prepare, as very few of those teams exist in the whole nation. Plus if they did faced teams comparable to those ECP teams, that would have meant a lot of travel and more losses.

    This years ECP team, while still talented is still more in line to a normal HS teams than the super power they were the past 2 seasons. Will ECP be the best team TJ or whoever the WPIAL rep plays all year? Yes. Is TJ going to be battle tested enough to contend against them this year. I say they will. Belle Vernon, West Mifflin who is down but plays tough, New Castle who is down but plays tough, Blackhawk who is good and respectable and either SF or Belle Vernon again. That should be good enough to take on this years edition of ECP. Against last years edition of ECP no, but they don’t have to play last years team. I like TJ’s chances.

  401. D10 Insider says:

    A healthy CP is going to beat TJ this year. I also think the game is going to be up here this year due to the new 2 year cycle. If CP gets Johnson and Lucas back they are a completely different team. The back ups are doing well and Sittinger is becoming a workhorse for the Ramblers. If they get healthy they are going to be a problem.

  402. B Powell says:

    I agree with that one and ECP plays SO well at Vet’s Stadium. They sure looked good against us (FLB).
    I’ll be there and I’m hoping the Erie News takes a road trip to Pittsburgh and interviews the TJ coach a week beforehand.
    That rant stuff is some good reading!
    The one wildcard is Clearfield, but Prep seems to know how to win those games they are supposed to and oftentimes, the win soundly.

    I hope the TJ coach is ready to vent and let it out. lol.

  403. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    No offense to all you D10 guys but I think Cherpak is the man. The dude has fire in the belly, he sees an injustice and it rubs him the wrong way. He’s not going to act like the emperor has clothes on. Btw, loved that team that pounded Wood in the state final several years ago (back when it was free to live stream on PCN, then some Wharton graduate decided they could ‘gagner de l’argent’). Best Wishes to Coach Cherpak and TJ,

  404. D10 Insider says:

    With all due respect Phillyboy, we’ll have to agree to disagree heavily on Cherpak. The guy is a front runner. When things are going great (they usually are because they go 9-1 or 10-0 every regular season) he has no problem beating teams by 50. When he has to face REAL competition the guy cowars and goes to his rolodex of excuses and complains about all star teams. He might be a good coach for SW Pittsburgh but the guy on a state level is a joke. He had a team up in Erie 3 years ago that should have clobbered Prep, the year after down at Baldwin on Cherpaks doorstep another lost opportunity because they had similar talent to Prep, last year they got run off the field becuase that was Preps best team. He psychs his kids out by saying Prep has kids from all over the country (which they don’t) and recruit the best athletes in Erie (which they don’t) Does anyone really think Erie High, Mercyhurst or McDowell would have a football team if Prep was allowed to recruit? MPS and Erie are arguably more athletic then Prep and 100% have more speed, so if they do recruit they aren’t very good at it.

    Cherp has no problem beating on teams that are less than them. When he faces somebody who can take their punch he has to mask losses with excuses and say it’s unfair. SV best PCC last week, Sharon will probably beat MPS this week and Clearfield or TJ can knock off Prep this year. Those 3 schools are the best 3 Private schools in the west so strap up and put ur best 11 out there.

  405. Mike F says:

    D10 Insider says:

    “He might be a good coach for SW Pittsburgh but the guy on a state level is a joke”

    The guy has 3 state championships, and he is still winning WPIAL titles. Like I said earlier this is his best chance at beating ECP in the past few years. Those ECP teams had too much talent that was well coached to not win. I say that game is 50/50 right now.

  406. D10 Insider says:

    The guy hasn’t gotten out of western pa since winning his last state title. Seems like every year they go 10, 11, 12-0 then lose to Prep or in the WPIAL playoffs. I did say the guy is a great coach, in SW Pittsburgh. So you saying he’s still winning WPIAL titles has nothing to do with a state level. He still runs the same offense he did in 2008, probably why they haven’t sniffed Hershey since.

  407. Mike F says:

    D10 Insider says:

    “He still runs the same offense he did in 2008, probably why they haven’t sniffed Hershey since.”

    I am saying ECP being extremely talented and well coached is the reason why TJ hasn’t sniffed Hersey the past 3 years. I really believe ECP could have competed for the state title in 6A the past 2 years.

  408. Jeff H. says:

    @ Mike F – TJ would be better prepared for the state playoffs if they played a few quality 5A or 6A WPIAL teams in their non-conference schedule, they don’t have to travel outside of southwestern PA for much better competition. This year they played Connellsville from 5A, and Central Valley from 3A, which does absolutely nothing to prepare them for the state playoffs, if you’re going to play a 5A team why not play McKeesport, or better yet Gateway or Penn Hills. I realize the WPIAL makes the schedules, but if Cherpak went to the WPIAL and asked them to schedule games against a 5A or 6A power team I am pretty sure they would do everything they could to accommodate his request and would be better for them in the long run.

    I personally think TJ was affected the most by the move to 6 classes, as it greatly watered down their competition, 4A is arguably the weakest class in the WPIAL, and has been for the last 3 years, the bigger 3A schools under the old classification like West Allegheny and Franklin are now in 5A, so TJ dominates in 4A and are on the verge of winning their 4th WPIAL title in a row, which is quite an accomplishment, but their level of competition does not prepare them to take on the Erie Preps, or Berks Catholics or Bishop McDevitt’s they need to beat to get to Hershey.

  409. sausmann9 says:

    “but their level of competition does not prepare them to take on the Erie Preps, or Berks Catholics or Bishop McDevitt’s they need to beat to get to Hershey.”

    Could you all imagine (well D10insider might have an issue here) if Cherp could pull kids from the same size area around TJ as do Prep throughout Erie and south into Meadville I’m sure, from all over a county like Berks does, or even a city the size of Harrisburg as does McD. Cherp could reserve a room every season in Hershey if that were the case.

    One is a fool to think you go to WPIAL championships on a regular basis, win it, and then run into a school like those above mentioned and lose in close games. TJ and Cherp are one of the best public school teams and coach in the state on a perennial basis. what he does with the kids in that district is pretty impressive unless you can tell me the last time he brought in size or skill when he needed to fill a hole to graduation.

  410. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    Yes and no. Like you mentioned the WPIAL controls the schedule outside of game 1. I must admit I never thought of TJ petitioning for better opponents so yes that could be done. But that still does no good in my opinion. Last year’s Pine Richland team is the only team that I think could have competed against ECP. I still thing last years ECP would have beat PR 6 or 7 times out of 10, that is how much talent they have, plus great coaching. Would have playing NA or PCC prepared TJ better for ECP? Yes. Would that have allowed TJ to beat those ECP teams? No.

    ECP this year is not the super power of the past 3 years. They are beatable. Will they be the best team a 4A WPIAL team faces this year? Yes but the WPIAL champ can actually compete against them this year. The past 3 years, if ECP would have been in the WPIAL, they would have won WPIAL 5A and 6A imo. This year they would be playoff teams in those classes but semi finals at most. In 4A we will see what happens this year in the state playoffs. Again this is all hypothetical. There is no way to prove or disprove any of this. So if you think I am talking out of my a**, feel free to, but I truly believe what I stated right here.

  411. D10 Insider says:

    Sausman9 CASH and Grove City knocked ECP out of the playoffs before. They didn’t need to recruit or pull kids from the surrounding areas to beat them. They looked across the field, saw and excepted the challenge of battling a storied program like ECP and outplayed them, probably even outcoached them. Cherp never gives his guys a chance agaisnt Prep and always plays the victim. Maybe 10 years ago you’re man could have his own room in Hershey but not anymore. Maybe one of the hotels by Heinz Field though.

  412. sausmann9 says:

    D10 – I’m not saying it can’t/won’t happen on the rare occasion, heck even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in awhile. Again if Cherp played by the same rules/system/etc.. whatever you want to call it (I call it an even playing field) and you put Cherp in Mischlers spot at ECP, you would have Cherp at Hershey w/ ECP. The guy does everything he can with what he has and his results speak for themselves.

    Again, get the schools out of the PIAA that are not public. Easy as that and then you see Cherp at Hershey every other season. I’m done dancing around with you. Either you are an ardent ECP supporter or just too ignorant to see the CLEAR advantage Prep has over schools like TJ, Grove City, and CASH. When TJ needs a quarterback or runningback, they can just advertise in one of MANY ways to let the area backs know there is an opening. We see it here all the time. When Cherp needs a back, HE HAS TO DEVELOP ONE WITH WHAT HE HAS IN THE DISTRICT!!!

  413. sausmann9 says:

    sorry meant when ECP (NOT THOMAS JEFFERRSON) needs a back they can just advertise in their own special ways and get word out.

  414. D10 Insider says:

    Are you referring to Damion Terry (Blessed Sacrament Grade school in Erie) who played freshman football then started as a sophomore for varsity? Or Billy Fessler (Our Lady’s Christian Grade School in Erie, who replaced Terry) who started on the JV team as a freshman then sat all the way until his senior year? Or Billy Norfolk (St. Luke’s, who replaced Fessler) waited until his Senior year to start? Joe Mischler (Blessed Sacrament who replaced Norfolk) who played JV as a freshman and started as a Sophomore? Must be Collin Johnson (OLCS, who replaced Mischler) started as a freshman and sophomore for the Freshmen and JV teams?

    One could argue those guys were all developed within the district and by Mischler and his staff. You’re right about one thing Sausman9 this dance is 100% over.

  415. me888 says:

    From where me sits (and me in person saw CP, TJ, PR, and CC at least 3 times…and some, more than 3 per year). Prep would not have won WPIAL 6A in either of the past 3 years (Joe Mischler’s last 3 seasons). PR (with Jurkovec) was definitely better. CC and PR (before Jurkovec got hurt) were both better than Prep the previous year. And the year prior to that, there were another 2 6A’s in addition to PR and CC that were better than Prep. Of course, all this subjective crap could have been moot if CP played up to 6A. After all, ya’ gotta play/beat the big dogs if you want to be considered the biggest dog!!!

    Prep would have been a strong candidate to win WPIAL 5A the last 2 of the Mischler QB years, but in Mischler’s soph year Prep wasn’t really much better than 4A TJ. They beat TJ at Vet’s Stadium in a game that could have gone either way for 3 quarters. TJ left some plays on the table in that game that could have been the difference maker. Neither CP or TJ were going to win 5A, yet alone 6A, that year.

    Jurkovec was a better passer and runner than Mischler. Field generalship was about equal. PR’s receiving corp was better than CP’s, and PR’s defense was better. Prep probably was better at the rb position, and coaching was about equal. Advantage Pine Richland last year.

    The previous year CC’s defense would have been the difference vs Prep. QB’s were about equal. CC’s rb’s were better. Prep’s wr’s were better than CC’s. Coaching advantage to Prep.

    But that’s just me, as always!

  416. Jeff H. says:

    @Mike F – ECP was great the last couple of years, no question, but I don’t think they were better than PR last year, would have been a great game, but think PR would have outscored them, I also don’t think they would have won the WPIAL 6A title in 2016, agree they would have won 5A last year, but not sure if they would have beaten West Allegheny in 2016 in 5A, that would have been a great game.

    I agree with me888, TJ definitely had a chance to win the 2015 game in Erie and lost by a final of 28-21, they also had a chance in 2016 in the game at Baldwin but made too many mistakes, they had a handful of D1 players that year and matched up reasonably well with ECP. Last year was a different story, they were totally over matched and had very little chance of winning. I do agree with you they have a realistic chance this year, obviously ECP is not the same juggernaut they were last year, and I think Cherpak is an excellent coach, but he does his team no favors by whining about how ECP can draw talent from wherever, line up and play and inspire your kids to rise to the occasion and knock off a traditional power, he sets the wrong tone for his team by complaining about how unfair the system is and his kids go into the game thinking they have to play a perfect game to have any chance to win, which was definitely not true in 2015 and perhaps 2016 as well.

  417. D10 Fan says:

    2015 TJ/CP could’ve gone either way and I feel TJ was the better team on paper. CP had a WR playing QB most of the year and Mischler played the entire playoffs with 2 bad hammys and a knee injury. In 2016 the talent gap wasn’t that wide either, TJ dug itself too big a hole to climb out of in the 1st half but still rebounded to mount a comeback. Eventually, a soph billy Lucas sealed the deal in the 4th qtr with a big run. So all the non-boundary advantages CP had didn’t amount to that much of an advantage until last year and we all know how dominant a senior class CP had. Anyone who says being non-boundary is not an advantage is either naive or lying. But the amount of its advantage is overblown imo.

  418. Sausmann says:

    LOL, the advantage is there. If ECP is down ANY season, it’s not anyone’s fault but the staff’s and surrounding cast. At ANY time, that means anytime they want/need, they have the ability to bring someone in. That’s the advantage. Now how well they exploit it is on them. You name a lot of kids that are parochial but how many aren’t. We deal with schools and clowns like you in the east with Becahi all the time. Its old, and only a matter of time, lol.

  419. Billy Splain says:

    I can name 7 “pub” teams who, in the last 2 years, made deep runs in the playoffs with players who weren’t there as sophomores, all players that made big differences.

    As for TJ and competition, the WPIAL hamstrings them. Their system is old and ancient and is showing. The bigger teams love that they now have a slot early in the season to schedule different teams. TJ chose to use it for another scrimmage. Their choice.

    I agree with the D10 guys about CP in 6A last two years. I like Cherp, he’s a great guy and a good friend. That said, Berwick won many a game based on reputation alone. Coach has to let them know they CAN win, and I believe they can this year and should have a couple years ago.

    Cudos to Fort LeBoeuf for sticking to 4A.

    The rest of the playoffs are going to be interesting. I believe “pubs” have a chance to take 4 again. Maybe even 5. Some usual teams don’t look as strong, and some others look stronger.

    Next topic for PIAA isn’t separation, it should be eliminating a week of playoffs. I think the 4 class holdover people really forget how many blowouts there were with 4 classes in the beginning rounds. They also cry about byes now…how quickly they forget:
    Browse around….no different than today

    Enjoy the football games on the field guys, let the debates for after the season, some great football about to be played

  420. D10 Insider says:

    Sausman let’s not resort to name calling. I’m sure the guys who run this site don’t want 6th grade banter, also no one wants to read that garbage. Speaking of clowns:

    Last year the QB, 2RB, FB, C, LT, RG, 2WR, NG, both DEs, 2/3 LBs and 3/5 DBs were all parochial, Catholic grade school kids and they were the ones leading the way.

    This year the QB, 4/5 OL, 2/3 DL, 2/4 WRs, and 3/5 DBs are all parochial, Catholic grade school kids.

    Keep trying Sausman. Clearly you have no idea how Cathedral Prep works. We do things differently then Becahi. Probably why were able to beat Imhotep. We did that by they way with parochial, Catholic grade school players.

    You’re wrong, dude.

  421. B Powell says:

    D10 Insider is right.
    ECP has always been transparent and has open books and a gold standard reputation for both academics and athletics.
    They care – and it shows (and I was raised and educated in the public school system).
    One other thing I’ve noticed is, they have excellent coaches and admin people.
    I go to church in Erie and see many Prep and Villa kids and they are respectful young men and women. So are the McDowell kids.

    Even some little side things. Such as. a few years back, one of the Prep golfers invited all our FLB kids to his father’s golf course every weekend for practice rounds. Free…so they could work together and maybe even build a friendship?

    I dunno, I just have to tell what I can see and for some sports, thank goodness ECP is in D10 because, that’s all we have to compete with.
    I love it when they can keep going and get D10 some press time.. lol.

    My only thought at the student count this last round was, “How did Prep stay under 4A?
    How did FLB go over 3A?”
    Both were +/- about 5 or 6 students either way.
    I just knew…ah ohhhhh…lol. Oh nooooo!

  422. B Powell says:

    Maybe I could say, the private schools are better organized with a unity of purpose?
    It sure seems that way to me.
    Is that an advantage? Sure is, but it’s created from within.

    The public schools who know this also are also doing quite well.
    -A unity of purpose- all working towards a common goal.

  423. B Powell says:

    I forget to mention, but it also needs to be said – Mercyhurst Prep is also a very fine school in Erie and doing things the right way.
    Their kids are also very respectful and coaching staff and admins are on top of things.
    Good luck to them this week vs Sharon and I hope they get over the hurdle this year and get to play Grove City.

  424. Jeff H. says:

    @Billy – agree with you the pubs have a chance to win 4 and maybe even 5 titles this year, expect pubs to win 1A and 2A, and have a good shot in 3A as well as 4A if you consider Imhotep to be a pub, Wood is still the team to beat in 5A imo but expect the WPIAL winner to have a legit chance to knock them off in the semi-finals, and Manheim Central from D3 will be a tough out as well in the eastern bracket, Coatesville has a chance against SJP in the 6A final, would be very surprised if its not those 2 teams in the final because I think both are significantly better than the rest of the 6A schools. Expect some great games the next several weeks, also think the state finals will generally have more competitive games and fewer blowouts than in the recent past, with the possible exception of 2A, where Southern Columbia is head and shoulders above the rest of the field.

    Also agree with you about the WPIAL scheduling model being outdated, and think TJ would be much better off scheduling a tough opponent in week 0 instead of having another scrimmage, just my opinion, obviously Cherpak feels differently and hard to argue with a guy who’s had the success he’s had.

  425. Mike F says:

    WPIAL playoffs


    Seneca Valley at North Allegheny – NA in a close one
    Mt Lebo at Pine Richland- Pine Richland in a blow out. Again the number 2 seed having an easier path


    Franklin Regional vs Gateway at Norwin Gateway too many weapons and too well coached, but FR and Botta will come to play
    Woodland Hills vs West Allegheny at North Hills West Allegheny in a close one
    McKeesport vs Penn Hills at Fox Chapel Penn Hills though I could see an upset happening here. Close game
    Penn Trafford vs Peters Twp at West Mifflin Penn Trafford going with the guys who been here before

    Blackhawk vs Thomas Jefferson at Peters Twp TJ by a couple TDs
    Belle Vernon vs South Fayette at Ringgold Belle Vernon I just have a feeling they pull this off

    Beaver Falls vs Aliquippa at Ambridge Aliquippa nuff said
    North Catholic vs Derry at Hempfield Derry they really did build something nice there over the past few years

    South Side Beaver vs Shady Side Academy at Montour SSA they are the favorite for a reason
    Mohawk vs Charleroi at Moon Charleroi I believe they are the dark horse in this class
    Freedom vs Burgettstown at Central Valley Burgettstown
    Washington vs Steel Valley at Elizabeth Forward IDK- toss up. Does EF still have that great concession stand?

    Rochester vs Jeannette at Cannon Mac Jeannette wins without doubt but a hard fought game none the less
    OLSH vs Clairton at Dormont Stadium Clairton by a few TDs

    Other Western PA games. I lack knowledge about a lot of these teams but why not give it a try.

    Westinghouse vs Bedford at Somerset Bedford LOL 2 teams that are .500 or worse in the playoffs. Disgraceful.
    Bellefonte vs Clearfield at DuBois Clearfield by everything I hear they have a team this year
    University Prep vs Erie Prep ECP vs a city league school, ECP every time. Against a 4-5 city league school, Mercy rule with 4th string in
    Forest Hills at Bald Eagle Forest Hills no reason other than I am just more familiar with them
    Penns Valley at Richland Richland no reason other than I am just more familiar with them
    Bellwood Antis vs Ligonier Valley at Johnstown LV has been on a roll lately. i know BA is a proud program though
    Saltsburg at Northern Cambria Northern Cambria based on record since I know so little
    Claysburg-Kimmel at Juniata Valley Juniata Valley based on record since I know so little
    Homer Center vs Bishop Guilfoyle at Altoona Homer Center I liked that power offense they run. Will it be enough?
    United at Portage Portage proud program at home
    State College vs McDowell At St. Francis State College has a good team this year
    Hollidaysburg vs Oil City at Franklin Oil City 10-1 vs a 7-4 in what basically amounts to a home game.
    Farrell vs West Middlesex at Wilmington Farrell as that are my pick to be the Western Rep in Hershey
    Wilmington vs Sharpsville at Hickory Wilmington is the only team that may beat the WPIAL rep not name SCA
    Grove City vs Slippery Rock at SRU Grove City is on a roll
    Mercyhurst Prep vs Sharon at Meadville Sharon has a lot of good football players

  426. Mike F says:

    Billy is their a way to format the look of a post? I made it look like a chart so it could be somewhat easy to read and then when I submit the format is gone and the words bunch together making it harder to follow. Anything can be done?

  427. Billy Splain says:

    Mike F….not much I can do on this end. Take a screen shot and insert image

  428. D10 Insider says:

    Mike F great information and insight either way.

  429. Jeff H. says:

    @ Mike F – agree with most of your predictions, but think Lebo is going to give PR a much better game than the first one, which started off 28-0 for PR in the first half and ended up 42-24, I think PR eventually wins by a couple of scores, but expect this game to be closer throughout. .

    I will be at WH vs. WA and I too think that will be a very competitive game that could go either way, my heart says WH but think WA will find a way to pull it out, they have had Woodland Hills number the last few years winning 5 out of 6 games, although the last 2 were very close and WH had chances to win. If I wasn’t going to that game I would take the short drive to West Mifflin to watch Peters vs. Penn Trafford because I think that is a very evenly matched game, I too lean toward PT due to the experience factor, also think McKeesport will give PH a battle tomorrow night but PH has too many weapons and will end up winning by a few scores.

    In 4A very even game between Belle Vernon and South Fayette, I like BV to pull out a close one, but very close

    In 3A I agree Aliquippa and Derry in conference rematches, both won the first meetings this year and expect both will win again tomorrow

    TribLive reporting Shady Side Academy may be without their QB for tomorrow night due to a sprained ankle, they squeaked by Serra Catholic last week when he got hurt, and they may be able to get by South Side Beaver tomorrow night, but if he is plagued by the injury I don’t see them winning the WPIAL title because there are too many other good teams in 2A, agree Charleroi is a dangerous team, and I think Wash High will beat Steel Valley and they are also a dark-horse.

    In 1A I have Clairton on upset alert against OLSH, would not be surprised at all if they beat Clairton tomorrow night, think Jeanette beats Rochester in a fairly close, hard hitting game.

  430. D6fan says:

    Being from the district 6 area and following those teams closely, I believe 1A BG will get revenge from getting beat by Homer Center last year. BG beat a good Chestnut Ridge team and have been on a roll after getting some players back from not being healthy early in the season. They have a very good chance to make the 1A final but I do believe they lose in Hershey to Farrell. In 2A Ligonier Valley should beat Bellwood-Antis pretty handily as BA plays in a weak conference and was only able to put up 14 points to a mediocre West Shomkin team. Richland and Penns Valley will be a shootout but expect Richland to win by 2 scores. Ligonier should be able to win D6 although will be a very good game against Richland. I don’t believe anyone will beat Southern Columbia or even get close. Southern Columbia could probably win in 3A. Also I watched Clearfield and believe they can

  431. MikeFLN says:

    D6fan thanks for the insight. I know Ligonier Valley has been a strong program so I do expect them to come out of D6. Your right that SCA is the top dog in 2A, which is a shame because so many teams are worthy this year but SCA is just in another stratosphere than The rest.

    The rest I was just going by traditional powers but Homer City I picked because the full back in me loves the power running style I saw last year in their losing effort.

  432. D10 Insider says:

    1) Valley Veiw 35
    4) West Scranton 14

    2) Dallas 21
    3) Berwick 27

    1) Imhotep 42
    2) Bartram 14

    1) Cardinal O’Hara 28
    2) Archbishop Carroll 21

    1) Becahi 49
    4) Pottsville 14

    3) NW Lehigh 35
    2) Saucon Valley 32

    1) Jersey Shore 21
    2) Selinsgrove 14

    1) Bishop McDevitt 56
    8) West Perry 14

    4) Conrad Weiser 24
    5) Gettysburg 28

    3) Milton Hershey 14
    6) Susquehanna 16

    2) Berks Catholic 56
    10) L. Strausburg 7

    1) Clearfield 49
    2) Bellefonte 21

    1) Cathedral Prep 42
    1) University Prep 7

    1) Thomas Jefferson 42
    4) Blackhawk 14

    2) South Fayette 34
    3) Belle Vernon 31

    While you guys are going through my 4A predictions, notice how many public vs private schools are left. Enjoy the weekend of games everyone!

  433. Jeff H. says:

    @D6fan and MikeFLN – completely agree with you guys about Southern Columbia, they are the biggest favorite in any class, also think they would more than likely win 3A, there are a lot of really good 2A teams this year, especially in the western part of the state (and I include LV and Richland in the west even though they play in the east bracket) but SoCol is head and shoulders above the field

  434. Jeff H. says:

    Just got back from a thrilling West A vs. Woodland Hills game, and for the 2nd time this year WA wins a squeaker 14-13 on a TD and extra point with 1:16 to go in the game, WH drove to WA 30 with about 40 seconds left but receiver fumbled while trying to get extra yards. I expect WA to get rolled next week by Gateway and will do well to keep it within 3 touchdowns. Just checked the scoreboard and some shockers in a lot of different classes.

    In 1A OLSH beat Clairton 27-7, which didn’t surprise me, but Rochester shutting out defending state champ Jeanette 27-0 is a shocker. In 2A Shady Side went down 32-16 to South Side Beaver, guessing the QB didn’t play or was severely hampered by the ankle sprain. Steel Valley and Charleroi won big and expect them to meet in the final, Freedom also upset Burgettstown 7-6.

    Chalk in 3A and 4A, surprised South Fayette beat BV as bad as they did, 28-10, TJ rolled as expected.

    In 5A all the higher seeded teams won, great game like I anticipated between Peters and PT with Peters winning 38-35.

    And in 6A undefeated and #1 NA got handled by SV 31-14, and PR rolled over Mt Lebo, not all that shocked SV won but very surprised by the final score.

  435. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Whaaaaa? Say it ain’t so, NA goes down to Seneca Valley. Earlier in the year I referred to SV as a beast, somewhat lightheartedly. Heck, as it turns out maybe they really are; my prescient commentary had some merit. The sky is the limit now for them if they remain very hungry. On the other hand maybe PR was the WPIAL alpha all along and was laying low for a little while. Whatever the case, just want the best D7 rep to make it to Hershey. I like that PR played IMG Academy earlier in the year — for practice and even for psychological reasons. Remember a few years ago SJP would get hammered at the beginning of the year by Don Bosco only to win the state title in the same year.

  436. New2PA says:

    @artist SV is a tough senior laden team. I like your comment about IMG. Play as many good people as possible to get better. I think it will be a battle. SV offense is going to have to try and score 21 points on a very talented P-R defense. Flipping sides, SV needs to contain the pass game and make P-R one dimensional like NA did a couple weeks ago.

  437. Jeff H. says:

    @New2PA – I agree, think the game will be a battle, and I think SV will score more than last time, but I like PR by a TD or maybe less, the question is how much does SV have left in the tank after a comeback win against PCC and their big effort against NA on Friday, I wonder if maybe it finally catches up to them in the final.

    @the artist – the WPIAL winner is going to have a battle next week with State College, they were solid last year and are even better this year, and then SJP awaits in the semi-finals, I just have a hard time seeing either PR or SV beating SJP, certainly hope I’m wrong, but I don’t see it happening this year.

  438. D10 Insider says:

    I can’t say I’m surprised Sharon knocked off MPS. Will somebody tell Sharon it’s not fair to play against private schools that “recruit” I mean come on, theirs no possible way a group of kids from the same community, same block, could beat a team that can pull in talent from all over the country. Well they did. Two years in a row. Trumping their perfect seasons. Sharon has better coaching, and the kids are put in positions to compete during the regular season not just steam roll every opponent. Those two things are the difference makers.

    Oil City with a valiant effort against Holidaysburg. I bet Oil City would have beat McDowell this year. Speaking of McDowell. Another private school in the way of the Trojans state football championship. They just can’t get by the private schools in the playoffs, it’s just not fair. Oh wait, State College is a public school that has beaten the hell out of you guys 3/4 years. The off year they didn’t get to beat you guys because Erie High (public school) knocked them out of the playoffs.

    Ramblers and Bison are going to play that one at Clarion. Still no Johnson for ECP at QB but Lucas looked like he’s ready for the next few rounds. Hopefully the weather is nice, but this one feels an awfully lot like that ECP vs CASH game in 2014. Not sure who is going to pull this one out after hearing all of the great things about Clearfield. Like MPS, a lackluster schedule could be the difference here. Who has Clearfield played that can compare with anyone on ECPs schedule?

  439. sausmann9 says:

    @D10 insider – I guess since you bring it up I will have to educate you on it. Your numbers were off by one w/ your ECP player “acquisitions” list but using YOUR numbers, can you imagine if Cherp or any other public school coach could pull 25% of his offensive players from “outside” the district (ie from other schools)??? Yeah exactly what I thought. That’s 3 EXTRA PLAYERS if you couldn’t put it together. Not 3 tuba players, not 3 glee club members, not 3 chorus members – 3 quality, starting football players.

    Also, you should check your other info you post (East scores), you have a few incorrect both score and winner.

    And by the way its not a matter of telling public schools they are not allowed to beat privates, as a matter of fact its really great when it happens. Its the point that it doesn’t happen enough to believe there is a level playing field. Again give Cherp just 3 picks from other schools around him for offensive players and you might see a different outcome on a regular basis. I almost find it funny that I even have to explain that but fact is; its not that funny that you don’t understand it.

  440. D10 Insider says:


    1) Those scores were my predictions, not the actual scores. Comprehend time.

    2) The other offensive starters were inner city Erie kids. But if you count Erie as out of district for Cathedral Prep than you’re right………..

    3) I could actually imagine if Cherp was able to get a few kids from out of district to come play for him. They’d go undefeated or lose one game in the regular season, win the WPIAL, and then cry about having to play Prep, and then cry after losing to Prep. If he does beat Prep, he’ll cry because he has to play Berks Catholic or Bishop McDevitt, then he’ll cry because he lost to them. If he does beat BC or BM he’ll cry because he has to play Imhotep or Becahi.

    The dudes a crybaby. Typical front running yinzer. Solid coach for Southeastern Pittsburgh though.

    4)You have no idea what you’re talking about. Please stop trying to educate me. I know how it all works. Hence the name insider.

  441. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Does anybody know if the ECP – Clearfield game will be live streamed this weekend. Generally I’m more into the 6A and 5A tournaments, but this game is intriguing. The conventional thinking is that it’s going to be the same old same old — Ramblers in a romp. But maybe just maybe this Clearfield bunch is a special group that can keep it rolling. Seems that a lot of people have been talking them up, Billy included. I’m going to have to break out of my big school tunnel vision and check this one out. Yeah, it’s gotten The artist’s attention.

  442. D10 Insider says:

    The Prep-villa website usually announces whether they are streaming it or not during the week. I think it costs money at this point. In the past they have had someone donate it or cover the bill so they could. I haven’t heard of anyone doing that this year.

  443. Jeff H. says:

    @d10 Insider – I get that you don’t like Cherpak and obviously he whines incessantly, I’ve knocked him on this board before on numerous occasions, but the guy has won 3 state titles, and that’s a helluva lot more than the vast majority of other coaches in this state. You can dislike him all you want, but he’s got a pretty impressive record, there’s no denying that.. When George Novak retired at Woodland Hills a few years ago I talked to a few members of the school board I knew to see if anyone had thought to put a feeler out to Cherpak to see if he would have any interest in succeeding his mentor, but the board was determined to hire from within with the blessing of Coach Novak and the idea was never seriously considered, you could do a lot worse than Cherpak for building and maintaining a program and I for one would have loved to see him come to Woodland Hills.

  444. D10 Insider says:

    Cherp did a lot of that damage in the late, maybe all of that damage before 2010. When I saw them in AAA with Prep when they redid the cycles 4 years ago I was definitely not happy about having to go through TJ year in and year out because of the Jaguars and Cherps reputation. The 2015 game was incredible. Both teams evenly matched in a spirited competition. The respect kept growing. Then, you read comments he has in the paper, and in interviews on how unfair everything is. Then the following 2 years after that he did nothing but complain about having to play the “all-stars” from ERIE. He gave his kids outs and excuses, but not a game plan or confidence. That’s where the respect for the great Cherpak was lost. Credit is due to a 3x champion, but in today’s society, what have you done for me lately?

  445. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    @ D10 Insider — Thanks, what about audio streaming, maybe there’s a radio station that broadcasts the game online?

    In regards to Cherpak, TJ’s head coach, I think you guys are being hard on him and making too much about his complaining. What’s he supposed to do, say nothing. He’s already dealing with the unfair advantage and you’re going to steal his blues on top of it? I don’t think he’s psyching out his players to lose. Didn’t you ever see that documentary on Mike Pettine’s last season with CB West? They had a big time state semifinal against Bethlehem Catholic (1999) and he got his team fired up by using psychology. He referred to them as a ‘Prep team, they think they’re better than you.’ His team responded well.

  446. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – can’t disagree with anything you said, I’ve stated on this board many times he’s done his kids a big disservice the last few years by whining and complaining about the unfair advantage Prep has, I’m with you, quit whining and prepare a game plan to knock off the mighty Prep. Fact is they certainly could have won the 2015 game and had their chances in the 2016 game at Baldwin, last year was a different story, but how many times is Prep going to have a senior class like they had last year, once in a generation? The guy is a great coach, but he and his team would be better served by figuring out a way to slay the giant than complain about how unfair the system is.

  447. D10 Insider says:

    Absolutely. All this could be a moot point as neither ECP or TJ are big time favorites. A buddy of mine from Pittsburgh are saying if their was a spread it would be TJ -6.5 but they think SF had as good a chance as ever. I caught some stuff on Clearfield and they are as advertised. If I’m doing that spread I would say Prep -13.5. I don’t think either teams cruise, and wouldn’t be surprised if one or both w re upset. That’s why football is so great!

  448. B Powell says:

    I believe today is the direct, face-to-face meeting with the PA school superintendents and the PIAA officials.
    To be discussed are issues with boundary vs non-boundary schools, mainly for football and basketball.
    The superintendents are suggesting (4) classifications for public (boundary) schools and then (2) classifications for private/charter (non-boundary) schools.
    We shall see what becomes of this – it’s not going away-
    But at least they are talking.

  449. Mike F says:


    The problem with 2 classes for non boundary schools is that there are not enough schools for 2 classes at least football wise. Being the “State Champ” of either division will mean being better than what? 15 teams in each class in football maybe 30-45 in Basketball? You can’t have them in one class because it would be stupid to have Canevin, OLSH, Seton, Elk Catholic, Bishop Guilfoyol , etc etc play ECP, PCC, Wood, St Joes, etc etc. Honestly a much better thing to do is a multiplier like 1.25 or 1.5 or even 2 for success factor for every boy in a non-boundary school if they really want to take an action.

  450. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – I agree with your buddy who would have TJ as a 1 TD favorite, SF definitely has a realistic chance to beat them, they are the best team TJ has played all year, Joe Rossi is an excellent coach and they have a very good passing attack that may give TJ problems, and I wouldn’t be surprised if SF upsets them. I also agree ECP is going to get a challenge from Clearfield although I do see them winning by a couple of scores. There’s a lot more balance in 4A than in the last few years when it was pretty much a foregone conclusion that Prep and Tep would meet in the final, I think there’s a handful of teams that have a legitimate shot at the title.

  451. M says:

    ECP “Facebook Lives” it’s games. I watched McDowell vs ECP at home this way earlier in the year. I assume they are still doing the same now.

  452. M says:

    You need to go to the Prep-Villa Facebook page to watch.

  453. D10 Insider says:

    M – those were regular season games. PIAA doesn’t allow live streams of the playoffs for free. They would have to pay a fee of $1500 if I’m not mistaken. Good ole boys of PIAA want you there live!

  454. M says:

    As far as I have heard, there are no regulations on Facebook Live as it’s a person at the game on his or her device. There are no laws restricting it as far as I’ve know. Not sure “rights” matter in this case. I’m not sure the PIAA has a say at all. If I’m not mistaken (and I could be) I thought I watched a ECP playoff game this way last year as well.

  455. D10 Insider says:

    Last year they paid the fee. I’m sure anyone could stream it live on Facebook but I know it won’t be Prep-Villa unless they pay the toll. I could be wrong, but I’m usually not. Ala insider.

  456. M says:

    Seems the PIAA would benefit from expanding the audience. There is no possibility for a vast majority of fans to make the trip to watch live for whatever reason. PIAA puts the championship games on tv, but what about all the great games leading up to that point? Some of which are far better match-ups than the actual championship games.

  457. D6fan says:

    Really looking forward to the Richland vs LV game. At first I was leaning towards LV but after Richland dominate Penns Valley last week I’ve changed to lean towards Richland. Both teams have very potent offenses but the edge goes to Richland on the defensive side I would have to go with LV. That sets up a great matchup when Richland offense against LV defense. LV has the experience in the playoffs which could play the decisive edge. I still like Richland 28-27 in a last minute great ole fashion “barn burner”. I don’t expect Chestnut Ridge to win but it will be interesting to see how closely they play Wilmington. It will show me if BG has a chance against Farrell in the 1A champion if BG can get past Lackawanna Trail or whoever it may be as they will blaze through D6. I watched Clearfield this year and they are for real. Really good O and D lines very good QB and good offensive schemes to utilize there athletic QB. They haven’t played near the schedule of Prep but still and their conference was kind of down this year which scares me alittle that they haven’t been tested yet so it’s tough to say how a team plays under those circumstances but I’m still going with Clearfield over Prep 38-35. Hopefully all are great games and with the price of admission, good luck to all teams

  458. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    @ D6fan — I’m with you on the Clearfield game, pulling for them all the way. When I first looked at your commentary I thought you might have been talking about Pine Richland – SV, but I had to take a closer look. So there’s just a plain old Richland as well — that’s what’s up. One thing I learned relatively recently that I thought was cute (for lack of a better word) is that in Pittsburgh area there’s an E, W, N, and S, Allegheny High School.

  459. D10 Insider says:

    Talks in Erie and interviews seen from the Prep players is all business and respect for Clearfield. They know this is a team that can beat them. Hell, one could argue that 6 or 7 of the remaining 16 can knock off the champs this year. That being said I see Mischler and his staff having these guys ready to roll on Friday night. Fool me once, underestimating Grove City in 11’ (33-0 GC) fool my twice underestimating CASH in 14’ (14-7 CASH) hopefully the lesson was learned.

    Strength of schedule will kill ya in the playoffs. Ask Mercyhurst Prep.

    42-21 Prep.

  460. Jeff H. says:

    @D6Fan – I wouldn’t necessarily assume Farrell will be the western rep in the 1A final, the WPIAL winner will have something to say about that, think the winner of that game is the favorite in Hershey even if BG gets there. 1A in the WPIAL has been brutal this year with consistently having 4-5 teams ranked in the top 8 in the state, and the WPIAL winner has a bye after this week while Farrell will be playing next week, so the coaches have 2 weeks to game plan for Farrell, which I think is unfair and something the PIAA should address but it’s the way the draw is set up.

  461. Jeff H. says:

    @ the artist – yes, Richland is a 2A school in Johnstown, which is about 90 minutes east of Pittsburgh, they have a big time game for the district 6 title against fellow unbeaten Ligonier Valley, both are ranked in the top 5 in most state polls, should be a heck of a game, I give the slight edge to LV only because of the experience factor, but could go either way.

  462. Jeff H. says:

    Predictions for the WPIAL final and semi-final games this weekend, starting at the top and working down

    6A- if you like good, old fashioned, hard hitting, battle in the trenches type of football this is your game, both teams with excellent lines and very good defenses. SV has opened up their offense a bit in the playoffs going to more 3 and 4 wide sets with a single running back and led to their comeback win over PCC 2 weeks ago and their convincing win over NA last week. They will need to continue that trend against PR if they are to upset them, I think this game is going to be pretty tight the whole way and the first team to 21 may win, PR likely needs to throw the ball some in this game to be successful, and I think they’ll they do enough to win a close one 21-17.

    5A – saw West A play twice against WH and struggle to move the ball consistently against Woody’s defense, which is very solid, but Gateway on a whole different level allowing a ridiculously low 4.2 pts/game, WA will struggle to score, and Gateway will score 4-5 TD’s, I’ll say Gateway 35-10, sending the great Bob Palko into retirement.

    Penn Hills vs. Peters – think this will be a very competitive, high scoring game, Peters is loaded with underclassmen, and will likely be preseason #1 in the WPIAL next year, or at worst #2, I think PH outscores them 38-31, setting up the long anticipated final with Gateway.

    4A – finally get TJ vs. South Fayette at Heinz, had anticipated them getting there in the first couple of years of playing in 4A but got upset in the playoffs the last 2 yrs. I think their passing game is going to give TJ problems, and wouldn’t surprise me if they pull the upset, but hard to go against TJ at Heinz, I’ll take TJ 28-24.

    3A – amazing comeback by Derry last week against North Catholic, scoring the final 29 points in the last 17 minutes to win 36-29, Aliquippa rolled over their arch rival Beaver Falls. Can Derry continue the Cinderella story and win first WPIAL title in school history, I think the Quips have too many play-makers and overall team speed and they win 40-21.

    2A – top 2 seeds lost last week, I like Charleroi and Steel Valley, who beat Washington a lot easier than I or a lot of other people expected, to advance to the final at Robert Morris next Saturday.

    1A – not surprised OLSH beat Clairton last week, very surprised at Rochester shutting out defending PIAA champ Jeanette who was riding a 27 game winning streak. OLSH gave Rochester their only loss of the season in week 4 in a 37-8 victory, think their passing attack is way too much for Rochester to handle, this one will be closer, but OLSH wins their first WPIAL title 34-20. And looking ahead OLSH vs. Farrell in the western finals in 2 weeks will be a tremendous game.

  463. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Upset alert this weekend: Northeast over St. Joe’s Prep; just a little joke there. If their 5 star recruit didn’t transfer at the beginning of the year maybe they could have battled a little. Anybody know what’s up with D11 6A? Seems like they’ve kind of been going through the motions the last few years.

  464. M says:

    Does anyone have an internet based link, not a tv channel, that the WPIAL Championship games can be streamed from? Thanks!

  465. B Powell says:

    The Erie paper is confident and has their prediction at 31-14, ECP over Clearfield.
    I hope it inspires both teams and fanbases and the game is a good one.
    But, something has to give…Either the paper and D10 fan will be right, or Bill Splain and his rankings will be with his Clearfield at the top.
    One thing for sure with rankings – they are a topic of discussion and tend to sort themselves out and –
    the only one that matters is the final one.

  466. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    I watched a bit of HUDL film on Clearfield this week. QB is talented, but I don’t think they have enough horses to get past ECP. The secondary play of some of the teams Clearfield played was atrocious. I dont think that will be the case tonight, Preps secondary isn’t stellar, but probably on another level compared to most Clearfield has seen this year. I think even if Johnson isn’t back at QB for Prep but they get Billy Lucas back, Prep wins by at least 3 scores. Preps depth will end up being to much for Clearfield to overcome.

  467. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Just heard that the Clearfield vs ECP game has now been moved to Saturday.

  468. D10 Insider says:

    That is correct. The game has been rescheduled for tomorrow night at Slippery Rock U. Not sure the reason, no where on social media or the internet could I find a reason why. I know the middle of the state got a lot of snow last night but its supposed to be high 30s and clear tonight in Clarion. Anyone know why this was rescheduled, and at a different place none the less?

  469. Jeff H. says:

    @M – Triblive has the streaming rights to all WPIAL playoff games, you can watch at . #WPIAL #TribHSSN, they are showing the Gateway vs. West A 5A semi-final tonight, and pretty sure all 4 games tomorrow.

  470. M says:

    Thank you!

  471. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    I’m reading that Clearfield cancelled school today, which is why the game has been postponed. I believe by PIAA Bi-Laws, If school is cancelled, they wont be able to practice today/tonight either.

  472. Jeff H. says:

    @ECL/Metro Fan – you may be right about the PIAA rules, but that still doesn’t answer the question as to why it was moved from Clarion, too much snow there and can’t clear the field/stands? Very strange to change sites at the last minute, although apparently the same thing is happening out east in District 1, North Penn was supposed to have a home game against Downingtown West tonight, but game was moved to Wissahickon earlier in the week, I just read a few minutes ago the game is now being played at Downington because apparently too much snow at Wissahickon.

  473. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    I’m assuming something else was previously scheduled to be played on the field at Clarion on Saturday, hence why the location was changed.

  474. me888 says:

    Clarion U. just installed new turf and did not want to use heavy machinery to clear the snow.

  475. Jeff H. says:

    Just got back from Penn Hills vs. Peters at Norwin, surprised the field was snow covered except for yard lines and hash marks Peters dominated the first half and had 14-0 lead until Penn Hills scored on 4th and goal from 7 yard line with 38 seconds to go on a great catch and 2 point conversion made it 14-8 at half. Penn Hills carried the momentum into 2nd half and after several punts by both teams finally scored on a nice TD pass to tie it with 6 minutes to go in the game, but excessive celebration penalty pushed them back to the 18 and the 2 point try failed and game was tied 14-14. PH held and forced another punt, then PH had to punt, and on next possession Peters threw an int that was returned to their 30 yard line to set up game winning touchdown run with 2 1/2 minutes to go, final ended 22-14. Not all that impressed with Penn Hills although they did dominate the 2nd half, give their coaching staff credit because they made some adjustments at halftime on defense and shut down Peters in the 2nd half.

    Totally shocked West Allegheny beat Gateway 42-28, and even more shocked they scored that many points, as Gateway had given up 50 all year, and West A had trouble moving the ball consistently against Woodland Hills last week. That may be one of Palko’s best individual game coaching jobs ever, and think they will give Penn Hills all they can handle next week and may beat them because they are a lot more disciplined, PH had several personal foul and unsportsmanlike penalties tonight and were definitely rattled in the first half.

    For the state playoffs in 5A I think that means Archbishop Wood handles whoever wins next week because I don’t think either WA or PH can stop their running game, and the only team that may prevent AW from a threepeat is Manheim Central from D3.

  476. D10 Insider says:

    Something didn’t fit right with the CP/Clearfield cancellation yesterday. Poses a few questions:

    Why would PIAA schedule it at Clarion if they aren’t prepared for snow?

    Why is District 9 allowed to host, if they don’t have ANY playing surface that can handle snow?

    The game got postponed real early in the morning. Makes you wonder how long D9 knew they were going to cancel.

    Also, I witnessed an entire community shovel out Veterans Stadium in Erie PA 18 years ago so Prep and Altoona could play. You’re telling me in 2018 you can’t get a field cleared in 6-8 hours? Something isn’t right about this. I know the Rambler faithful were not happy about this decision. Whoever it was in D9 who finally made the call may have also just signed Clearfields death certificate.

    SAFE TRAVELS for anyone going to games today! I’m taking the Ramblers 42-20!

  477. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    That’s weak dude, what’s up with Gateway getting trounced? People were saying they were even the best overall team in the WPIAL. So much for that, eh. I was hoping that somebody would step up and kick Wood’s bootox and stop the insanity. It’s the second year in a row that a seeming legit team bailed (last year Harrisburg) midway through the tournament. Based on what Jeff H. was saying, seems like a classic spoiler role that WA has played. Didn’t exactly instill any confidence that WA will take the baton to the finish. Oh well.

  478. Billy Splain says:

    Let’s address a few things:
    First, there’s nothing suspicious about the clarion field change…this happened all over the state yesterday. Teams didn’t want to clear their turf fields because of the ice build up, they didn’t want to damage their turf. What happened yesterday was an anomaly. NOBODY expects a major noreaster in mid november. I don’t ever remember it happening. 18 years ago that field was grass….there was no conspiracy theory…

    Dont crown wood the champs just yet. West A is apparently a great team….and there’s a whole bunch teams on the other side of the bracket can win too. Wood isn’t as strong as past years…

  479. Jeff H. says:

    @the artist – I have seen WA twice and Penn Hills last night and I can’t see either team stopping Wood’s running game, would expect them to run for about 400 yards against either team. WA might have a punchers chance because they have one of the best coaches in the state in Bob Palko, and he clearly out-coached Don Holl last night by a wide margin, he’s retiring at the end of the season and his kids are clearly inspired, but this team is not nearly as good as their team 2 years ago that got trounced by Harrisburg in the semi-finals, and then Hburg got bombed by Wood in the final. I do think Manheim Central from D3 has a better chance against Wood than either of the WPIAL teams.

  480. Jeff H. says:

    @ Billy – I’m aware Wood is not as good as past years, but they just got their QB back last week and are rounding into form. Based on what I’ve seen in person I would not consider WA a great team and not nearly as good as their team 2 years ago, they are very solid and Palko is a tremendous coach, which is why I give them an outside chance, because they would have a huge advantage in coaching, but I just can’t see them beating AW, then again I didn’t think they would beat Gateway. If last night was any indication I think Penn Hills is too undisciplined to beat Wood, they obviously have a lot of great athletes but took way too many stupid penalties, if they play like they did last night in the first half against Wood they would get rolled. Like most of the rest of the state I would love to see someone beat Wood, I just don’t see a team in the western bracket beating them now that Gateway has been eliminated.

  481. Billy Splain says:

    jeff……have you seen wood? I’ve watched their film. They can be beat.

  482. Jeff H. says:

    @Billy – I’ve seen some of their highlights, I’m sure you’ve watched a lot more, and I agree they are not nearly as good as the last couple of years, but they are still really good, and even though their O Line is not as big as in previous years their technique is tremendous. They played quite a few games this season without their starting QB Jack Colyar, and my understanding is he’s healthy now, that’s why I think they are going to be a very tough out. They are certainly beatable compared to the last 2 years, but given their draw they won’t get challenged until the semi-finals, and I just don’t think the WPIAL winner is going to be able to slow down their running game, but I would love to be proven wrong!

  483. Jeff H. says:

    So much for TJ vs. ECP round 4, as South Fayette just took down the 3 time defending WPIAL champs with a thrilling 31-24 victory, coming back from a 21-10 halftime deficit, and sealing the victory with an interception at their 2 yard line with a minute to go with TJ attempting to tie and force OT.

    I haven’t seen a score on the ECP game yet, but assuming they win I think South Fayette gives them all they can handle next week and may very well beat them, sophisticated passing attack, very savvy QB, excellent coaching and their kicker/punter is a serious weapon, all his kickoffs are touch backs and he booms punts too, TJ had terrible field position most of the 2nd half.

    The earlier games went as expected, Aliquippa has some serious athletes and a much better passing attack than in recent years and I don’t see Sharon keeping up with them, assuming they win next week, and I like Aliquippa’s chances in Hershey

    Was also impressed with OLSH, their QB Tyler Bradley throws a nice ball and they have a very well balanced and sophisticated offense for a 1A school, I know Farrell is loaded this year, but as I stated yesterday I think that will be tremendous game that could go either way, and the winner will definitely be the favorite in Hershey.

  484. D10 Insider says:

    Clearfield, just out physicalled, out played, out coached tonight. Told you so.

  485. B Powell says:

    I told them so a few weeks, ago D1. I’ve seen so many years go by and know most of the demographics and historical trends.
    It also didn’t surprise me -much- when Sharon won last night because, how many years have they played their best in Nov?
    D10 holds their own and all you had to do was look at Maxpreps schedules and rosters to figure out the ECP s Clearfield game. It was that easy.

  486. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    One of my simple philosophies in life is to give credit where credit is due. Without a doubt the Pittsburgh area has the best high school football in PA. The history, tradition, and organic community support is impressive — that’s why I love the WPIAL. I think the way you can really tell is by how many quality public programs the area has. Sure, Philadelphia may have more state champs (higher classifications) but that’s because of a few super teams that are bogarting the titles. Truth is, most of the public teams in D12 and D1 are about as mediocre as a Nilla Wafer, or even a saltine. With a few exceptions, the WPIAL is defending the honor of big time PA public ball. That’s why it was a shame N. Allegheny, Gateway, and TJ did a curtsy, then exited stage right with the elegance of a ballet dancer. Big shout out to Pine-Richland and Coach K, nice win.

  487. D10 Insider says:

    The Clearfield vs Prep game wasn’t even close. Clearfield looked like they could swing with the champs for a few minutes of the game but after the interception and a 90+ yard touchdown pass that confidence dwindled rather quickly. Clearfield didn’t stop Preps offense the entire night and the defense FORCED 5 turnovers, Clearfield wasn’t “giving the ball away” like some local writers would make you believe. Yes, they did make it 21–14 almost to halftime but the experience and killer instinct that Prep has instilled in them by traditions steamed a two minute drive that lead to a TD and a pick 6 before halftime making it 35-14 at the break. 42-14 wasn’t far behind and you could hear a pin drop in the home stands as the entire town of Clearfield sat in silence watching the defending champs suffocate their great team.

    Yes, injuries happened to some of Clearfields best players but no one is healthy in week 13. Preps back up QB scored 6 touchdowns, Coach em up.

  488. Mike F says:

    The past 2 weeks saw a lot of great football with a lot of nice upset surprises. My track record for picking this year is as broke as can be. I am enjoying how the season is playing out and looking forward to the next few weeks.

  489. Jeff H. says:

    @d10 Insider – Not really going out on a limb here but expect South Fayette to give Prep a much better game than Clearfield did and better than TJ would have, they are clearly the underdog, especially since the game is in Erie. For one I don’t think Joe Rossi is going to get out-coached, and I say that with all due respect to Mischler because he’s obviously a great coach, SF may get beat, but he’s not going to get out-coached, the guy does a tremendous job in developing HS quarterbacks, and also is very adept at making in game adjustments. If this turns into a field position game the advantage goes to SF, because their kicker is really good, any time SF scores Prep will be starting their next drive on the 20, because all of his kickoffs are touchbacks, and he can flip the field with his punting as well. Should be a good one, at least we don’t have to hear Cherpak whine this year!

  490. D10 Insider says:

    Prep has had trouble defending the pass this year. I’m expecting a good game. I also won’t be surprised if Prep handles them. How many tough games has SF played? Although it is always fun hearing Cherpak cry and whine about playing Prep, it will be nice not having to hear it this year. Maybe Rossi will give his guys a chance against “the Erie all stars”

  491. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – I would be shocked if Rossi makes any mention of playing the “Erie All Stars”, and I think he’ll have his team ready to play, with that being said I still see ECP eventually winning by a couple of scores, something like 35-24. SF presents a different challenge than TJ because their passing game is much better and their offense is a lot more sophisticated, and as previously mentioned their kicker could potentially put Prep in poor field position, which was a big factor on Saturday, TJ had terrible field position the whole 2nd half. Agree with you about their schedule, TJ was the best team they’ve played this year, no question ECP has faced much tougher competition, and that often is a big factor when you get to this point of the playoffs as you and others have pointed out.

  492. B Powell says:

    Then, a good story from Western NY –

    Clymer/Sherman/Panama combined their football teams with a co-op and still qualified for the NY smallest school division, Class D.
    They are playing for a state title this weekend in the Carrier Dome!
    Very good to see this because otherwise, Sherman and Panama were going to fold.

    But you talk about Farm Boy Power! This is it.
    One of the most rural areas in NY and they made the state title game.

    Now they need to finish.
    Nice to see (3) school districts can get along and work together for common goals?

  493. Realist says:

    D10 Insider, on November 17th, 2018 at 10:13 pm you wrote, “Clearfield, just out physicalled(sp?), out played, out coached tonight. Told you so”. You left out that they also (wer able to ) “out-recruited” Clearfield. Call a spade a spade, man.

  494. D10 Fan says:

    The term “recruiting” when referring to CP or any private school is comical to me. All the public school apologists act like these kids had stacks of offers from private schools and they held signing ceremonies at the grade school gymnasiums. The fact is CP and 99% of private schools all get their kids the same way public schools do. Through feeder grade schools and grade school sports leagues. As i’ve stated before being non-boundary gives them an obvious advantage but all these people throwing around the term “recruiting” is laughable and lazy. That term is just being used to imply that all non-boundary schools are cheaters. And non-boundary/boundary had nothing to do with Clearfield’s QB throwing an INT into double coverage on the opening drive; a ball being snapped over his head; and then throwing another INT at the end of the half, that he probably should’ve thrown away.

  495. Jack1234 says:

    @phillyboy funny you put that about NA, one of the main reasons they were so dominant this year was from the contributions from all the north catholic transfers on their team. Also won states in 10 and 12 after loading up with steelers kids as well

  496. New2PA says:

    Its funny you bring up NA. I’ve not been here long enough to go way back, but since Coach K has taken over, here is how 4A/6A has stacked up.

    State Championships: P-R 1, PCC 1
    State Runnerup: P-R 1, PCC 2
    WPIAL Championships: P-R 3, PCC 3

    Going deeper, here who’s made the WPIAL 4A/6A championship game since 2013:

    PCC: 5x
    PR: 3x
    Seneca Valley: 2x
    Woodland Hills: 1x
    Penn Trafford: 1x
    Butler: 0x
    Shaler: 0x
    Hempfield: 0x
    Canon McMillan: 0x
    Norwin: 0x
    North Allgheny: 0x

    That begs the question – has Walker ever won by developing kids from 7-12? People tell me the 2010 championship team was mostly home grown kids, but the 2011 and 2012 teams relied heavily on Leftwich and Kugler. In watching NA, they always looked very well coached, but its also like watching teams from the 70’s and 80’s on offense.

  497. D10 Insider says:

    @Realist I love how you say you’re a realist but have ABSOLUTELY know idea what you’re talking about. I didn’t put that because it wasn’t a fact. All of the other statements I made were true. Yours was lazy, played out, and ignorant. Erie has better football than Clearfield guy, check your schedule too while you’re at it. I’m with you D10 fan. Also, good call coach trying to make something happen with 30 seconds left in the half so instead of 35-14 with Prep getting the ball after half it’s 28-14 and you can atleast try and convince your kids to keep swinging. Time for basketball in D9!

  498. Jeff H. says:

    @New2PA – the short answer is no, Walker has never won a WPIAL title without some transfers/coaches kids who moved into the area, at least at NA, he did win a state title with PCC in 2004 with a team that was loaded and I believe mercy ruled all of their opponents in the state playoffs (and was PIAA runner-up to North Penn in 2003) . He’s certainly a very good coach but I wouldn’t consider him a great coach, and one could argue his teams have underachieved the last several years in the playoffs…how has a school like NA with their size and tradition not made the WPIAL final at least once in the last 6 yrs?

  499. LackTrail says:

    Hey guys. Any info on the United/Juniata Valley game? Know nothing and never even heard of United. Who should win and any info? Thanks.

  500. Jeff H. says:

    I think PR vs. State College in Altoona on Saturday is going to be a very competitive game and wouldn’t surprise me if SC wins, although I’ll take PR by a touchdown. I was at the game last year at Hempfield and SC hung with them in the first half and score was actually tied 14-14 at half before an ill advised onside kick to start the 2nd half by SC gave PR the ball at midfield and the floodgates opened as PR scored 5 straight TD’s. SC has a veteran, senior dominated team and I think their passing game will give PR some problems, their receivers created some match up issues last year and they are both back along with their QB. Wish the game wasn’t so far away because I think it’s going to be a good one.

  501. Jeff H. says:

    @LackTrail – I don’t follow D6 that closely as I’m a WPIAL guy, but if you’re asking if Lackawanna Trail has a chance to beat the winner of that game next week I would say they would be the favorite, based on a look at the schedules and power ratings for each team. Juniata Valley did beat Bishop Guilfoyle last week that surprised some people.

    With that being said Farrell from D10 and Sacred Heart from the WPIAL are significantly better than every other team in 1A, and the winner of that game next week will be a big favorite in Hershey, imo that’s the real state championship game because I expect the winner to beat whoever comes out of the east by 3 scores, they are that much better than everyone else, take a look at MaxPreps power ratings and there’s no comparison between those 2 teams and the rest of the field.

  502. Realist says:

    Insider and Fan, I see that your bias overshadows your collective intelligence. Here is one article that outlines the “recruiting”… there are PLENTY more…

    I would also love to know your extent of football knowledge to include coaching experience above the pee-wee level? You’re views make it seem like you haven’t much experience in real football situations accept when the game was out of hand and your coach finally decided to put you in…

  503. D10 Insider says:

    So are you saying that Prep coaches or Prep coaches sent someone to go recruit these players?

    If you are you’re wrong.

  504. B Powell says:

    I’m glad the two Seneca kids got approved because what they left from — 0-9 team who had a FF and I think (2) other stoppages in the 3rd quarter?? Plus the former coach was outed, so it was a bad situation.
    I think with the new transfer rules they would have to decide this earlier in their career, what – after the SOPH season now??

    But, the voting panel removed all private school members on that panel and the McDowell kids got approved -easily- then so did the two Seneca boys.

  505. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    @ Realist — Nicely done man, way to come to the table with proof. Read your exhibit, your story checks out. I rest your case. St. Joe’s Prep has a sophomore wide receiver (son of a former NFL player) who played at LaSalle for his freshman year. It’s totally cheesy, by rights, SJP and others should have to struggle a little the year following the graduation of key players. But it tends not to happen because there’s always somebody running to help the ‘damsel in distress’. It almost reminds me of New York City; how there’s a never ending infusion of young adults from other areas to replenish those that have moved on. Huh, that almost seems like the template for a Ponzi scheme.

    @ Jeff H. — Yeah I live streamed that PR – SC game last year. It was concerning me for a moment, think they had a big tight end who tied up the game with a long TD reception right before the half. At any rate, they can be dangerous. They have the community support like Clearfield albeit with more talent.

    Have to decide whether or not to check out the SJP – Freedom game this Saturday at Northeast High. I used to always go to that game, was a no brainer because D11’s best is nothing to sneeze at but doggone it, I don’t know how many times I’d be there in the 2nd quarter shaking my head after Prep goes up 28-0 or so. It starts to get old. Anybody know anything about Freedom? Do they have a snow ball’s chance in hades of pulling out a W?

  506. D10 Insider says:

    Down goes South Fayette. Yet again, another year ECP knocks off the WPIAL Champ and sends the pride of western PA onto the hardwood. If they are arguably the best “public school” on 4A, could you really call them a state champion? Come on now. To be the best you have to beat the best. Just like Ric Flair said. On to the final 4 against McDevitt, who got their by being a good football team and having tradition. Not cheating and recruiting like everyone thinks.

    Bethlehem Catholic beat Pottsgrove by 40 and we’ll see what happens in the Imhotep game today, but if you can tell yourself that one of these teams deserves to be a STATE champions you’re on a hole other level of consciousness.

  507. B Powell says:

    That was a good win, D10 and never really in doubt for Prep.
    I’m not sure how the new success factor will work in a few years, but seems like it will move Prep to 5A, without a doubt? I believe it was a points system for each round of playoff advancement.
    In that case, Prep would be the only 5A school in D10 and for sure will have a few bye rounds while they wait for opponents.
    I guess it’s something not to worry about or to look forward to, but it’s out there and I can’t see how Prep avoids 5A and Farrell would be 2A in no time. Wilmington will probably get moved up to 3A, too.

  508. M says:

    I watched the entire Prep game last night on Facebook Live along with 400 other people. Just an FYI. I wish every school did this for people that can’t get to games.

  509. D10 Insider says:

    M – another example of how and why private schools take better care and show more attention to their athletes than some public schools. Take the time to do things right, with character and teaching and maybe some day you can receive the spoils.

    4A speaking this year, Valley Veiw, South Fayette, and Pottsgrove were the last 3 public schools left. You want one of these 3 teams to be a state champion? Give me a break.

    The other genius idea: Separate public and privates in the playoffs, then have them play each other. So VV from the East (hypothetically speaking) and South Fayette from the West play. Then get wrecked by CP or Imhotep in the championship of champions.

    Not everyone deserves to be STATE champs.

  510. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    @ D10 Man — Although I’m total pro public, what you said was pretty fair actually. Each of those last 3 public teams in 4A were not true state champ material. And the privates do tend to show more personal attention generally speaking. Also agree that public and private schools should NOT have separate tournaments. I think Ohio sets the example of how to do it. Their system seems so solid and consistent. And although the privates usually take the state championship at the highest classifications, occasionally a public takes one. Speaking of that, GO Colerain, baby!

  511. D10 Insider says:

    For months, maybe even year now public school parents, administration, and adult fans have done nothing but complain of the unfair advantage Private schools have over public schools. An “equity summit” that featured a bunch of losers across the state even met to discuss why their teams aren’t receiving state championship medals.

    2018 Final 4 in all 6 classes:
    1A 3 Public vs 1 Private
    2A 3 Public vs 1 Private
    3A 3 Public vs 1 Private
    4A 1 Charter school vs 3 Private
    5A 3 Public vs 1 Private
    6A 3 Public vs 1 Private

    All you Private school wannabes and haters…Oops, their goes your argument!

  512. B Powell says:

    Do you have your calls for our teams this week? (Before Protime Phil does his).
    It’s much tougher going now — and two years ago, it wasn’t pretty when Steel Valley and Wilmington played.
    Give us some hope! The only teams I’ve seen in person this year are Prep and Sharon.





  513. D10 Insider says:

    Farrell will beat OLSH. I think one of OLSH best players got banged up pretty bad in the game last week and those smaller schools don’t go to deep. Farrell is so fast. Saw OLSH in 7 on 7 vs some good competition. QB will keep things interesting.

    Farrell -10.5

    Steel Valley was special last year, and rightfully so but Wilmington has some horses up front and have been as dominant as anyone in their class, respectively.

    Wilmington – 20

    The Quips are LOADED. Sharon has knocked off back to back giants and show now sign of slowing down. I want to pick Sharon in the upset here.

    Aliquippa – 6

    Prep and McDevitt have had some pretty memorable games in the last few years. 24-21, 38-3, 47-42, and 38-34 or something along those lines have been the games with Prep winning 2 and McDevitt winning 2. This is what’s great about 4A is the 4 best teams in PA are duking it out for a shot at Hershey. I’d love to take the Ramblers here too, but think this round will go to an experienced McDevitt group.

    Pick em.

  514. New2PA says:

    D10 – I think that the final talley on the public private issue isn’t about who made the quarters, its who wins it all. If that is consistently balanced, then the discussion goes away. If its not, then it continues. No one wants to be the 3rd runner-up anyway!

  515. D10 Insider says:

    No. The argument is that these public schools don’t have the opportunity to win state championships. They have the majority here, and best opportunity statistically. So it’s only fair if a public school wins states? Super lame.

  516. New2PA says:

    D10 – I don’t want to argue about it, but at least to me it was never about the opportunity. They have always had the opportunity. Its about outcomes. Proof is in the pudding kind of stuff.

    Having said that, I have seen first hand that public’s can compete both with and without generational type talent. P-R is a 2 time state champ if DeAndre Swift wasn’t a generational talent. But, the level of program that P-R has is way way way above what most coaches and programs will commit too. And I get that too. Its HS football and not supposed to be a business. But for teams and players that want to embrace that mentality, all is not lost against any school.

    Also, I really don’t even count games like SJP vs. P-R. Those games are SUPPOSED to happen. Who wants to see either of those guys vs. the minions.

    At the more local level, when publics elevate themselves and hold themselves to a high standard, its all possible. A great example of that is P-R vs. PCC and P-R vs. NA. Since Kasper took over at P-R, he took very good to great talent and more or less broke the aura of both those school. The Chain Gang is another City School and NA is the little sister to the south. P-R kids aren’t afraid of those guys anymore because they see what they are about and know what they have done to work. Take it too them.

    So, I guess what I’m saying is I see both sides of the argument. Before I was around people said PCC and NA dominated because of size and “recruiting.” Well, someone said: “That’s not an excuse.” And the kids believed it.

  517. Chris says:

    I’ve been following the debate re: Public V Private for a while on here and always get a chuckle. I looked over the 5 years prior to a 6-tier classification system and then post 6-tier classification regarding teams appearing in and winning championships. Overall the numbers are as follows:

    “Pre 6-Tier(1A to 4A)”
    – 50% of all State Championship Game appearances were made by Public Schools
    – 40% of the State Championship games (2011 – 2015) were won by Public Schools

    “Post 6-Tier (1A to 6A)”
    – 58% of all State Championship Game appearances were made by Public Schools
    – 50% of State Championship games (2016 – 2017) were won by Public Schools

    Looking quickly at these numbers (and to argue statistics is funny), and using the amount of public schools in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, there is a “discrepancy” amongst the programs. There are numerous differences to account for the overwhelming number of State Championships being won by non-public schools. To argue they are equitable overlooks the differences.

    I’m not arguing for or against the debate, but to look at the amount of money in budgets of programs is a great starting point where many non-public schools have an advantage (whether better equipment or the ability to pay coaches more).

    Frankly, 50% of schools are not non-public in PA, however, that is who wins State Titles. I would venture to guess that the split is probably closer to 9:1 Public : Non-Public. Therefor, non-public schools are winning State Championships that exceed the representation of schools throughout PA.

    Hopefully this sheds some light for some people on this topic.

  518. Jeff H. says:

    Regarding the 3 WPIAL vs. D10 games this week, I think all the games will be pretty competitive and don’t see any blowouts. Agree with D10 insider the OLSH QB will make that game interesting, I like Farrell due to their overall team speed but think OLSH will put up some points on them, they have also had 2 weeks to game plan for Farrell, these are the 2 best 1A teams in the state and the winner will be a very big favorite in Hershey.

    In 2A I give the edge to Wilmington, but it’s a bit of a stretch to say they have been as dominant as any team in 2A, are you forgetting about Southern Columbia. I think Steel Valley keeps this game close, winner will be a huge underdog in Hershey to SoCol.

    In 3A Sharon has been playing well, but Aliquippa has too many playmakers to contain and I see the Quips winning by a couple of scores, assuming the Quips win they will be the favorite in Hershey.

  519. sausmann9 says:

    D10 says – “No. The argument is that these public schools don’t have the opportunity to win state championships. They have the majority here, and best opportunity statistically. So it’s only fair if a public school wins states? Super lame.”

    Its actually said you believe this yourself.

    First off your numbers are off when looking at percents, take a look at the numbers of privates and then look at the percentage of wins.

    Second, its not the opportunity to win one, its playing by the same set of rules. Again so sad you actually believe its a numbers thing. I can tell you are young and naive and havent been around PA football for as long as some of us. Also sad you talk so much but know so little about football around our Commonwealth.

    You know what they say, can’t educate iron-ore into gold. Same way you can’t coach a kid up from 5’9″ 165 to 6’3″ 225 in a season or two.

    Lastly, I knew those were predictions but dang man, you weren’t even really close. For being an “Inisder” I’d have figured they would have been a bit closer, lol.

    Oh yeah you never did adjust Prep’s numbers when referring to their “homegrown” talent on offense but I’m not surprised. I was checking out their defense as well, that Scaribino is one heck of a player. Which diocese/church group is he from??? tx.

  520. B Powell says:

    I think if they look at it from a “happiness” standpoint there can be a solution.
    The non-boundry schools are content and don’t want to see changes so, why not give them the (2) separate classes for post season and let them battle it out? A big school and a small school division.

  521. B Powell says:

    They can crown their champions and the winners are happy.
    The public, boundary schools who favor some form of change are then happy, too. Lol.
    Hey… it could work.
    Remember, the non boundary schools are already content.

  522. New2PA says:

    Here’s a crazy idea. Go with the 4+2 classes called Public and Open. Allow the public schools to “play up” into the corresponding Open bracket. Only Publics in publics division. Non-public and anyone that wants to could be in the open division. That would be interesting.

  523. B Powell says:

    I like that idea, New2PA.
    By calling them Open Classes, it takes a sting of the finger pointiing, too.
    Let’s go with it…to the PIAA.

  524. D10 Insider says:

    Sausman: It’s so sad that you think percentages are what’s fueling the argument. This weekend 15 public schools have a chance to punch a ticket to Hershey so spare me that BS. Fact is private schools spend more time and effort on athletics than most public schools do. That’s what makes them better. It also takes a certain type of kid to practice and play into early December in PA. Everyone sitting at home “wishing” they’d still be playing have NO IDEA what it takes.

    Also, Scarabino went and graduated from Blessed Sacrament School. It’s in the Erie Diocese.

    You also keep saying this thing about coaching up certain sizes to certain sizes. Stop re-reading your garbage posts and check out Preps roster. Not a lot of guys that are physically imposing. Mischler and his staff must have the Midas touch because they have produced state championships with rosters littered of 5’8-6’1 and 160-175 lb stars. I actually love when you post. You have no idea who I am.

  525. D10 Insider says:

    Not a terrible idea. Although I don’t see many public schools mustering enough courage to play in the “open” classes. Doesn’t seem to be a lot of toughness being instilled in some public schools now a days. They’d rather go on social media and complain with the ignorant.

  526. Jeff H. says:

    I think New2PA’s idea has some merit, although not sure about the 1A and 2A private schools playing in an “open” division, even the small one.. I personally favor a multiplier for the private schools to help level the playing field, I’ve stated on here numerous times in the past that ECP should be playing in 5A and not 4A, as should Bishop McDevitt, Beth Catholic and perhaps a few others as well. Archbishop Wood has a lower enrollment than ECP yet they play up in 5A, although I think part of the reason is to avoid Imhotep in their own district, the last time they were in the same class in 2015 Tep beat them and subsequently trounced ECP for the state championship.

    Make the traditional power private schools play in one of the top 2 classes, which would give the public schools a better chance to compete, privates would still likely win 5A most years, but would be better competition going up against larger public schools, the 5A WPIAL champ is almost always better than the 4A champ, and the same is typically true in other districts as far as public schools.

    D10 Insider forgot to add that in addition to private schools spending more time and effort on athletics they also typically spend a lot more money than most public schools, and the PIAA needs to do something to help level the playing field a little bit before the state legislature feels compelled to act and totally screws things up.

  527. Chris says:

    D10 Insider, I’ll ask it… Who are you!?

  528. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    So in this hypothetical 4-Public Classes, 2 Open Classes, Would you consider ECP a “Small Open” or a “Large Open” school?

  529. Jeff H. says:

    ECL/Metro Fan – surprised you asked that question, maybe you meant it tongue in cheek, ECP would be in the large open class and not small. And of course their supporters would whine about that because that would mean taking on SJP and the other big schools.

    ECP has one of the premier programs in the state and as such should be playing at a higher classification than they are currently, their enrollment is at the top end of 4A, and even their fans admit the non-boundary schools have an advantage, so time to move up and take on bigger schools, and if they won’t do it themselves time for the PIAA to force their hand.

  530. Deo says:

    Does anybody know if the Pine Richland game will be live streamed or whatever on Saturday?

  531. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    In addition to Deo’s question, anybody know when and where the PR – Prep game will actually be played?

  532. Jack1234 says:

    Its at Altoona at 1pm saturday

  533. Chris says:

    I highly doubt anyone will live-stream it. Attached is the radio broadcast fees for this year. I imagine the live-streaming fees are double. PIAA needs to get their money for the student-athletes…

    Here is District 3’s fees:

  534. Chris says:

    I highly doubt the game will be live-streamed. PIAA Radio Fees are in this link:

    District 3 (Though neither team is from) live-streaming/broadcast fees are at this link:

    PIAA needs to get their money!!!

  535. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Jeff H.- This is my concern, I believe ECP should play at the 5A level, based on their size and history. It was never an issue when they where a 3A school playing up to 4A. Not all agree with me, but this is my personal opinion. My concern is if something like this passes and teams are forced to whatever classification, then coaches get desperate and we actually see a true “recruiting” issue. I think for the most part as a whole, “recruiting” isn’t bad in PA compared to a lot of other states. I feel like locally at least, a lot of the hate for ECP/Privates comes from kids leaving their “Home School” to have an opportunity to better themselves with more resources. People feel like because the kid grew up in a certain community or a certain part of the community, they have rights to the kid. I just think there is a big difference numbers wise between high level 4A/Low Level 5A and a high level 6A schools. I think the changes would appease some, but I also think it would create more issues. Here is a glimpse of my personal scenario and why I am pro-private schools:

    My son will be an 8th grader next year. His “home” school doesn’t have a 9th grade team, some play J.V. while most don’t develop and stand on the sideline every Friday night. The current Varsity coach is 4-16, plays one of the weakest schedules in the district, has no college connections on any level and does the bare minimum to survive as the coach. The overall staff is a hack job of alumni and guys that are in their 70’s that the game has surpassed. Nice guys? Love the game? I’d bet, but sometimes you have to know when its time to hang it up. The same Head Coach has also coached Basketball, Baseball, Softball, Wrestling and possibly Track and Field. Either he is Bo Jackson or he is padding his pension. With minimal effort from the A.D. and school board, I don’t see anything changing in the next 5 years. On top of it, last year as a 6th grader, the same varsity coach asked me where my 12 year old was planning on going to high school. As a varsity coach, if you are worried about a 6th grader enough to reach out and text their parents about what school they may go to in 4 years, you have bigger problems.

    On the flip side, I could send him to ECP, Where he could play on a freshman team that plays a solid schedule, while continuing to develop and build camaraderie with his future teammates. Play for one of the best coaches and staffs in the state, who have connections through out all levels of college. Could also play one of the top 10 schedules in the state and learn to compete. Compete in practice everyday and for his spot on the field rather then be handed everything at his “Home” school. Play in 7v7’s and actually make the play-offs. Oh and did I mention he would get a top notch education too. Seems like a pretty simple decision right? IF the public’s want to keep the better kids from leaving, they need to start to do more. You don’t hear of many kids leaving Pine Richland or on a small scale, Wilmington or any other public school that that does things the right way.

  536. Mike F says:

    The following information comes from:

    This may not be 100% accurate as I cannot verify every schools “boundary”. Basically if it had a Catholic/Christian /Prep/ Charter/Academy/Vo Tech in the name or something off the wall like School of the Future (that just has to be a charter school am I right?) I added it to this list with district and enrollment.

    I included Vincentian Academy since it was listed even though they disbanded the team before the season. I didn’t verify if others disbanded either. I listed them in the order they showed up on the list which went by enrollment. But if a school played up a class they would be listed first even though schools under them have higher enrollment.

    Assuming I captured all the Boogie Men, I mean non-boundary schools, that complete in the PIAA for football there are 63 schools (taking Vincentian off) that make the list. If they were broken into a small class and a big class that would leave 31 and 32 teams per class. So the cut off would be Pope John Paul II from D12 with 260 boys, competing against the likes of schools up to 868 boys with many schools (12 in total) in the 395+ range. Also, in the big class that would mean of the 32 teams 28 of them would be in D1/D3/D11/D12 with only PCC, ECP, University Prep/Obama as the only schools in the west as the 4th school is a Vo Tech school in D4. In the small class it is more evenly split, with 16 teams in the east and 15 in the west. Yet we are still expecting Imani with 31 boys to play schools up to 244 boys with 15 schools being 150+ boys.

    Olney Charter D12 868
    LaSalle D12 813
    Roman Catholic D12 722
    ST Joe D12 660
    Pitt Central Catholic D7 635
    Father Judge D12 622
    Pickett Mastery Charter D12 546
    Academy at Palumbo HS D12 550
    Mastbaum Vo Tech D12 492
    Simon Gratz Mastery D12 500
    Academy Park D1 483
    Archbishop Ryan D12 395
    Murrell Dobbins CTE D12 371
    University Prep Obama High D8 326
    Bishop Shanahan D1 384
    Erie Cathedral Prep D10 382
    Milton Hersey
    Columbia Montour Vo Tech D4 317
    Boy’s latin Philly Charter D12 362
    Glen Mills D1 325
    Archbishop Carroll D12 324
    Caridnal O’Hara D12 315
    Msgr Bonner & ABP Prendergast D12 292
    Bishop McDevitt D3 290
    Allentown Central Catholic D11 283
    Berks Catholic D3 282
    Bethlehem Catholic D11 269
    Imhotep D12 231
    Notre Dame D11 263
    School of the Future D12 215
    Pope john Paul II D1 260
    Lansdale Catholic D12 244
    Prep Charter D12 244
    Scranton Prep D2 241
    Mercyhurst prep D10 213
    Lancaster Catholic D3 224
    Pittsburgh North Catholic D7 217
    SS John Neumann & Goretti D12 215
    Kipp Dubois Collegiate Academy D12 206
    Conwell Egan D12 201
    Holy Redeemer D2 200
    Bishop McDevitt D12 191
    Mid Valley Center D2 190
    Shady Side Academy D7 180
    West Catholic D12 163
    Seton LaSalle D7 153
    Delone Catholic D3 146
    York Catholic D3 146
    Summit Academy D7 144
    Serra Catholic D7 174
    Bishop Carroll D6 88
    Vincentian Academy D7 116* folded team before season
    Valley Forge Military Academy D1 129
    Holy Cross D2 121
    Marian Catholic D11 119
    Bishiop Guilfoyle D6 118
    OLSH D7 113
    Bishop McCort D6 111
    Bishop Canevin D7 96
    Greensburg Central Catholic D7 92
    St Joe D6 75
    Elk County Catholic D9 82
    Belmont Charter D12 37
    Imani Christian D7 31

    Basically what I am saying is that there has to be a better way then splitting the public schools from the “non-boundary” schools. Using a multiplier like 1.25/1.5 even make it 1.75 for a success factor if you like. To me those ideas make more sense in my mind then just separating and then spiting between small and large class.

  537. Mike F says:

    Very well said ECL/METRO FAN. I agree. I always hated when I hear people talk like the school district owns the rights to the kid. Chances are my 5th grader (who currently is in public school) will stay in his home district, but it is nice knowing that I have options.

  538. New2PA says:

    University Prep and Obama are Pittsburgh City Schools (Public). Leaving PCC and ECP in the big class out here.

  539. Mike F says:


    I could be wrong but it is my understanding that any kid in city can attend university prep and they co op with Obama for football.

  540. New2Pa says:

    Mike – that may be true. Have not idea about how that works.

  541. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Mike F- From my understanding, you are correct about University Prep and Obama.

  542. Jeff H. says:

    @ECL/MetroFan – can’t disagree with anything you stated, very well put. My argument is a lot of traditional powers play up in class, but ECP is one of the few exceptions that doesn’t. Imhotep has 231 boys and is 3A but plays 4A, Wood has 351 boys but plays 5A, Bethlehem Catholic has 269 and could play 3A but plays 4A. On the public school side Aliquippa has 110 boys and would be 1A but play 3A, and McKeesport has 335 but plays up in 5A.

    ECP has the 2nd largest enrollment in 4A, bigger than any school except Bishop Shanahan from D1 with 384, but they aren’t even the best 4A team in their district, so I don’t really consider them a factor. Prep is a big fish in a small pond in 4A, and in my opinion they should be playing 5A, they will still win their share of state titles at 5A, the games would just be more competitive which would be better for everyone involved. Just strictly a guess on my part but I suspect many of the Prep players and coaching staff would prefer playing 5A and not 4A, I may be wrong, but think the competitive instincts in the kids who play at a school like Prep would relish the challenge of playing and beating bigger schools, just like Wood does.

    One thing for certain is more changes are coming one way or another, I truly hope we don’t split into public and private divisions because I think that would have negative consequences for high school football in this state, I’m a fan of my kids school but a bigger fan of the game in general, and going to separate divisions would not be good for the game in my opinion.

  543. D10 Insider says:

    I don’t think it’s an issue of ECP not wanting to challenge themselves. Look at their regular season schedules the last few years. Canisius, St. Ed’s, PCC, Detroit De La Salle, and Glenville all have great programs and with the exception of Glenville now a days the other are state championship contenders every year. Wakulla from Florida a few years back too. Prep stays in 4A because that’s where they belong numbers-wise and when it comes to the state playoffs the challenge is there. Classic match ups between McDevjtt and CP every time (except 2012 38-3) Imhotep crushes them in states, and the Berks Catholic rivalry is just getting started. The BC/CP game was one of the most hyped up games in the state last year and was an incredible one to watch. CP belongs in 4A, they are 4A talented and 4A sized. The last few years they had “generational talents” it will be hard for them to consistently play with 5A/6A schools/sizes. The only ones who would be punished are the weaker classes that followed these supreme classes. Prep will always be good, but that senior class last year isn’t coming back anytime soon

  544. B Powell says:

    Don’t forget to figure in the girls sports, too. In the original study-
    They mentioned the Fort LeBoeuf girls volleyball team from about five-eight years back that made the state finals game (4) years in a row and won (1) title- with the three losses to private, non-boundary schools.
    FLB obviously had the #1 public school AA team in the state -for (4) consecutive years- and unlike the Buffalo Bills, they did win (1).
    But there were girls from NJ on the Beth Catholic team and girls from Maryland on the Delone team, so I dunno…level playing field?
    The FLB coach said she had NO answer when the private school teams had 6ft girls across the front line and nothing could be done about it.
    In a state title game, 4 consecutive years…probably not and where was a public school to find 3 or 4 six foot tall girls?
    Coach them up?

  545. B Powell says:

    I don’t want ECP to HAVE to get moved to 5A any more than D10 Fan does. Not until they go over the student count limit.
    They are our D10 mercenaries! Go get them Prep.
    Seriously, Erie needs the notariety!

    In fact, I wish FLB and General McLane could still play in the 4A-6A region with ECP, McDowell and Erie High. I do…but D10 decided against it and we now have (2) Erie County schools they didn’t know what to do with, lol.
    Because we weren’t quite good enough to make the cut.
    It is way more fun playing the big boys than when the fed us AA schools.

  546. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    @D10insider-Never questioned you before, but I’m starting to now a little bit. I’m guessing you haven’t seen the talent in 7th and 8th grade on the Erie Diocese Knights teams. That generational talent pool you think only existed in last years graduating class, is coming back and its coming quick. I’ll throw you a couple names. Ask around, kids are legit: Wakeem Page, Demario Crawford, Kristian Muldrew, Carter Barnes. Plus all the talent that is already in the 9th grade class.

  547. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider and B. Powell – we agree to disagree on this, because I think ECP would compete very favorably in 5A and would still win state titles, just not every year. They are at the top of the enrollment in 4A, and given their tradition and history of success they should be playing in 5A, all of their opponents in 4A are smaller than they are, BC enrollment is 282, McDevitt is 290, and as previously mentioned Imhotep is 231.

    If Archbishop Wood with 351 is willing to play up in 5A so should ECP at 382, because they are very similar schools with similar traditions who play very tough schedules including a handful of out of state opponents.

    Change is coming and I have a feeling ECP will be forced to play in 5A in the next 2 yr cycle starting in 2020 if they don’t agree to move up voluntarily, in my opinion there’s no logical reason for them not to play 5A, and to say they don’t have 5A talent is simply not true, they would be a state title contender at 5A virtually every year, just like Wood. And the cynic in me thinks the Prep administration massages their enrollment to make sure they stay just under the 4A limit, there may be no truth to that whatsoever, but kind of ironic they have been just a few kids under the limit for 4A the last 3 years.

  548. B Powell says:

    Guys in the wpial know:
    Does this Steel Valley team really have a (21) man roster like Maxpreps is saying? If, so… my gawd, you talk about Ironmen.
    How could they be playing both ways like this and dominating this late in the season?
    I get they have speed, but they also must have great coaches and a top notch conditioning coach.
    Do they run the spread offense to get their stars the ball more often?
    Also, Farrell such a tiny A school but has (3) D1 kids moving on.

  549. New2Pa says:

    I have heard in the news Steel Valley has 16 players at this point. Not really sure of anything else except they have a good player named Todd Hill.

  550. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    One thing I was wondering about — if they ever implement the ‘success factor’ rule, would teams that voluntarily moved up a class be temporarily immune to the consequences for one cycle until such time they meet double the criteria? Would is an example.

  551. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Wood, Wood is an example, lol, still drinking my coffee man.

  552. D10 Insider says:

    ECL/Metro fan man. I actually have seen the Knights. I’ve seen them practice and play games. What I didn’t see out there though was a Bauer, or a Mischler, or. Scruggs, a Roberts, or an Oedekoven. Haven’t seen guys like that since 2012, and we didn’t see guys like that since 2000 so we’ll have to agree to disagree. One thing I do know, if the Erie Knights have any kind of talent and go to ECP they will be coached up, and taught football and life lessons the right way. Not sure if all of those guys are going to Prep either. MPS is throwing money at these guys to go win 10 regular season games, lose in districts, then watch Prep on the news for 3 weeks.

  553. ECL/METRO says:

    @D10insider-I think if any of them go to MPS it will be Barnes. But after watching his brother bow out in district play the last 3 years, I don’t know if he will follow in his foot steps. I feel like there is more talent in the Erie area now in 7th, 8th and 9th grade then there has ever been. Well just have to wait and see where they all end up. If the core group of kids that are at McDowell now, stay there, they will be a really tough team in 3 years (Santiago, Vogan, Hardik, Moore, Lunger). Crawford and Page are both better then Roberts and Oedekoven where at this point, not a knock on either guy as high school worked out for them. Roberts was tiny until 10th grade. They have also played in National tournaments across the country showcasing there skills, don’t believe Roberts or Oedekoven did. Muldrew is as big and as dominant as Scruggs was in 8th grade. Actually might be bigger. Those are just a couple kids that I could see playing at the D-1 level in 5 years. A lot can happen between now and then thought, we all know how that goes. Not sure if they have a gun slinger like Mischler though and Im sure there is a LB in the county somewhere that is similar to Bauer.

  554. New2PA says:

    Guys, start reading this thread from Gang $$ Green’s comment on down until the end.

    Is this how it works at ECP and PCC?

  555. Mike F says:


    That is a good read. I never knew that about the PCL. I know PCC/Oakland Catholic are Diocese’s schools as are North Catholic, Seton LaSalle, and Bishop Canevin, meaning the Diocese oversees them. I am not sure of the status of OLSH, Serra, and non football playing HS St Joe’s and Quigley. So the part where that Gang of Green states the PCL Diocesan schools must follow rules and send tuition money downtown to the Diocese’s while the independent Catholic schools didn’t, those Catholic schools I mentioned would have to do that here in Pittsburgh. There is no direct discount the school can make, like a kid is there without being counted type of situation.

    I have stated many times I am sure some athletes went to these Catholic schools at a discount if not outright free, but it is extremely rare. I think it is way more likely that little Timmy lives with Aunt Sue in X SD here in the west. Outside of PCC/Oakland Catholic, the other Pittsburgh Catholic schools do not have that kind of money behind it. Even at PCC, I highly doubt they have alum after alum donating for football glory.

    For the most part athletes choose these schools for the same reason the non athlete students choose them. They are the better option then the home school district. I went to both Seton LaSalle and Canevin. Yes a certain percent of the student body came from schools districts that were good, but the great majority came from Pittsburgh SD/ Steel Valley/Brentwood/Baldwin/ Ringold/ Charolroi/ETC. At Cenvin same story with small percent from good schools but the great majority from Pittsburgh SD/ Carlynton/ Sto Rox/Cornell/ Washington/Wayensburg/Etc. I didn’t go to North Catholic but I bet they had kids from Pittsburgh SD/Shaler/ Northgate. At Serra I am willing to bet McKeesport/ Duqueqnse/ Clairton/ Ringold/ Steel Valley/ Woodland Hills. Finally you have PCC which would be every district I named already plus Wilkinsburg/ Penn Hills/ Plum/ Gateway.

    I fail to see the conspiracy that many of you do. I think by and large it is parents sending their kids to a better option. Hell even coach Novak had his kid at PCC for a couple years before he transferred to Woodland Hills. Also PJ Fulmor played at North Catholic despite the fact his dad was the head coach at Wilkinsburg. I guess everyone wants to forget those tidbits.

  556. New2PA says:

    I don’t doubt any of that. The whole part about paying for part of an athletes tuition is pretty shocking though. That’s another level.

  557. Mike F says:

    That is where I think Philly and Pittsburgh is different. The part where he stated 15 schools scouting middle school football sounds insane to me. I know from my own experience and watching my nephews that some of the better kids in youth football/soccer/baseball wrestling were so bad in HS that they quit. And some of the bad players in youth sports became starters. I could not imagine being so much of a loser, that I would waste time scouting a middle school game to get an edge in a HS game. That is pathetic to me.

  558. Deo says:

    Pine Richland vs SJP will be broadcast live at the following: or via Armstrong and Consolidated Cable Companies.
    Armstrong Cable Subscribers may view it on digital cable channel 211. Consolidated Subscribers may watch PRTV’s programs on channel 404.

  559. Jeff H. says:

    @Nw2Pa & B. Powell – heard the Steel Valley coach say in an interview after the WPIAL championship game they have 17 players, but most of them are really good, and some of them are great HS players, two top notch running backs, Todd Hill has rushed for 1,600+ and Kam Williams 1,800 and an additional 400 in receiving yards, great overall team speed, they do spread it out to get their play makers the ball in space, both running backs can take it the distance on any play, despite their small numbers I think the game with Wilmington this week is a toss up and the power rankings actually favor Steel Valley. Winner of this game likely losses to Southern Columbia by 3-4 touchdowns in Hershey.

  560. Drew says:

    It’s good to see D10 well represented in the final 4s this weekend. I’d say Farrell is prob the biggest favorite of the 4, CP/MCD is a coin flip, aliquippa and SV maybe 7pt favorites? Just my opinion, not really familiar with Aliquippa or SV.

  561. Jeff H. says:

    @Drew – I know Farrell is loaded but they are going to have their hands full with OLSH, that game is going to be a lot closer than most people think, and I wouldn’t be shocked if OLSH upsets them. I think Aliquippa has way too many play makers for Sharon and they win by 3 scores, and think the Wilmington vs. Steel Valley game is a tossup, give the slight edge to Steel Valley, but could go either way.

  562. D10 Insider says:

    Farrell 33
    OLSH 21

    Wilmington 26
    Steel Valley 14

    Aliquippa 35
    Sharon 20

    Prep 31
    McDevitt 26

    I do my predictions for entertainment and conversation. I’m not oddsmaker but I know our boys in D10 pretty well. Good luck to them! Especially the ones playing the WPIAL schools!

  563. Jeff H. says:

    @Mike F – scouting 7th/8th graders is common practice in the Philly area as well as other parts of the country, it happens a lot more frequently than most people realize, there’s a big demand for blue chip players, and the competition among some schools for these players is cutthroat. Since some schools are doing it other coaches feel obligated or forced to do it as well or be left behind, so the madness feeds on itself, just a sign of the times.

  564. B Powell says:

    Another good night for D10 football. Cathedral Prep, Farrell and Wilmington with convincing wins.
    D10 Insider is going to be crowing, lol,, but he has that right to.
    I think it’s the 4th year in a row for ECP vs Imhotep?

  565. Jeff H. says:

    Very impressive performance by D10 tonight, not surprised they won all three games but margin of victory is a big surprise, especially Prep, but I thought the other 2 games would be a lot closer too,

    Penn Hills did save some face for the WPIAL by knocking off 2 time defending champion Archbishop Wood 20-13, I really thought PH would have trouble stopping AW’s running game but their defense obviously played very well in limiting them to 13 points, will take on undefeated Manheim Central next week, they rolled as expected in the east.

    And yes, round 4 for Prep vs. Tep, I thought this year one of them might get knocked off, Prep obviously peaking and that should be a heck of a game.

    Now if only PR can upset SJP tomorrow that would leave all Western teams from our half, knocking out D12 in the top 2 classes and Prep taking out D3 tonight. A month ago I thought PR would lose to SJP by 3 TD’s, but they’ve really turned it on after losing to NA, if they can limit SJP’s big plays and not turn it over they have a chance to beat them, and if it rains tomorrow as predicted that might help their chances.

  566. New2PA says:

    Its hard to believe that rain might actually help P-R. But I agree.

  567. Jeff H. says:

    @New2PA – certainly don’t think it will hurt PR, and might slow down SJP a little bit. I think that’s going to be a very intense game tomorrow and as long as PR doesn’t fall behind by 2 scores think they will have a chance to win, would be awesome to have all Western teams representing our half of the bracket.

    Also, for those of you whining about publics vs. privates, and fortunately they are the minority on this board, we now know 9 of the 12 finalists for next week, and 7 of them are public schools, and are guaranteed a public champion in 1A, 2A, 3A and 5A, and a private/non-boundary champ in 4A, with a definite possibility for public champ in 6A, SJP is going to have to beat 2 really good public schools to win the title. Maybe this will quiet some of the talk about a public/private split, but I won’t hold my breath.

  568. D10 Insider says:

    Is anyone from the WPIAL gonna beat a D10 team this year when it matters most? 4-0 this year so far. We’ll give you guys the “western pa vs the world” title in the beginning of the year but you all can enjoy watching the teams from the North on PCN next week. But hey, you guys did win WPIALs, and I’m sure you guys will get rings for that. But not States. The big one.

    Can’t say enough about the ECP team, but you guys already know that. An absolutely dominant performance as I’ve ever seen. This “rebuilding” year team has completely obliterated their playoff competition and is back in Hershey. Anyone wants to complain about big time recruits, and out of state players. Prep has 2 D1 kids, MAYBE a handful of D2 non-money guys and a lot of D3 impact players. At some point you guys need to believe me when I say it’s the character, coaching, and culture that has been instilled at Prep that is pushing teams like this one, and the one in 15’ to state.

    Imhotep is very talented.
    Prep plays together.
    Gonna be a good one.

  569. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    @ Jeff H. — Totally agree; PR has to limit turnovers and big plays, especially special teams plays. It seems like Prep always gets some ‘freebies’ every game — a kick off return or a recovered fumble on the other teams’ 5 yard line. That’s the last thing in the world a team needs to do against St. Joe’s, spot them a couple TD’s. Like giving welfare to the rich, lol.

  570. B Powell says:

    I’m thinking ECP also made the state team wrestling finals in this 2018 calendar year? I’m pretty sure they did and that is also quite a feat.
    For those who aren’t aware, PA is the #1 wrestling state in the country based on D1 qualifiers and all Americans in the NCAA tournament. By far!
    PSU is currently on a 6 or 7 year?? run on national titles and ECP just had one of their boys sign with them.

  571. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – you deserve to gloat, D10 did a number on the WPIAL this year, although I just got back from watching Aliquippa blow out Sharon, so score one for the WPIAL, we have 2 teams in Hershey, you guys have 3, congrats Not sure where you came up with 4-0, I only count 3 (Farrell, Wilmingtonj and Prep). We’ll see which district ends up with more Gold, both Farrell and Aliquippa are big favorites next week and would be very surprised if either of them lost, Wilmingon is going to get pounded by SoCo again, and Prep/Tep and Penn Hills vs. Manheim Central should both be very competitive games. I absolutely believe your statement about character, coaching and the culture, I’ve acknowledged for the last several years on this board that Prep is one of the premier programs in the state, your comments and their run through the playoffs this year bolsters my argument they should be playing in 5A, period.

  572. GaryZ says:

    @Jeff H
    Good points, not sure if D10 is taking a shot because they had success this year. Not so much in the past playing WPIAL Schools, but we will see who brings more Gold home. The Quips will absolutely roll M-Town, be their 3rd year in a row getting beat by a Beaver County team. I like PH chances, that game will be close though.

  573. B Powell says:

    And most know a man’s true character shines when times are tough and not when things are going great.
    Good luck to all Westernpafootball teams next weekend.

  574. D10 Insider says:

    Let’s all agree on one thing, let’s get all the titles in the West this year.

  575. B Powell says:

    St Edward’s, OH just won another D1 state title so perhaps ECP knew what they were doing when they scheduled them this year?
    The 3-35 loss doesn’t look so bad now.
    Both teams just kept getting better as the season went on.

    Now ECP has (3) years of Imhotep film to study and I’m sure they’ll have a good plan.
    I guess I’m glad I haven’t cut the cable cord yet, because we still have to deal with PCN and the lousy announcers and maybe not a true hi-def channel yet.

  576. D10 Insider says:

    Yes St. Ed’s did win their championship. They lost to Mentor and Ignatius, got a cruddy seed in the playoffs and rolled through to the ship. Im convinced that if Prep had a scrimmage in the beginning of the year (Mentor cancelled/communication error with Prep AD) that game is a lot closer than 35-3. St Ed’s was easily the best team anyone in our district faced all year. With that being said, these Ramblers that are playing now no way lose to PCC or Clarkson. Probably a good thing key starters were kept out of that game so they could heal and recover for the playoffs. And now they’re going to Hershey.

    I think D10 is gonna go 2-1 down there. Prep and Farrell are bringing home the gold. I wish I could add the Hounds in there too but I think SC is unstoppable. They have the #1 JR WR in the country and a QB whose walking onto Alabama I believe.

  577. WPIAL RULES says:

    It is so awesome that St. Joe’s Prep will be representing the western part of PA in Hershey even though Harrisburg is closer! Well, at least PIAA got what they wanted, Harrisburg in the State Chip!

  578. Mike F says:

    WPIAL Rules- I agree, it was bad enough when D3 was in the west. It is even worse now that D12 is in the west. You literally cannot get more east than D12.

    I have been horrible this year but lets see how I do the final week.

    1A- Farrell
    2A- SCA (Boy would I love to see Wilmington win this one)
    3A- Aliquippa
    4A- ECP
    5A- Penn Hills
    6A- St Joe’s

  579. Jeff H. says:

    @Mike F – agree with all your picks, unfortunately we don’t have enough teams in the west to make full brackets in the top 3 classes, so have to move one “eastern” district to the west, the reverse is true in the lower classes, with D6 teams like Ligonier Valley and Richland from Johnstown getting shipped out east, completely agree it’s ridiculous the PIAA did this just to appease D3 and to a lesser extent D1, no logical reason why D12 was moved to the west, just a lot of complaining and whining from D3 that was tired of getting beat up by the WPIAL

    My thoughts for this weekend:

    1A Farrell 48 – Lackawanna Trail 14 – too much speed, too much size, too much talent, could get ugly

    2A So Columbia 42 – Wilmington 7 – SoCo defense will shut down Wilmington’s running game and force them to throw, will have trouble moving the ball consistently, just like last year, this is probably SC’s best team in school history, and may be even better next year, I agree with Mike and everyone else I would love to see them lose, but unfortunately they are just too loaded for Wilmington. I’ll give you D10 and Prep guys a good laugh, there are SoCo fanatics on the eastern board who think they would give Prep a run for their money and maybe beat them, claiming they could win 4A, I think they are delusional, as good as SoCo is Prep would handle them.

    3A – Aliquippa 42 – Middletown 20 – see above for Farrell, Middletown will make it a game for a while, but too many playmakers, even if star RB Avante McKenzie doesn’t play again, they didn’t seem to miss him last week

    4A – Prep 41 – Imhotep 27 – could be one of the best games of the weekend, can’t go against Prep the way they’ve been playing, but Tep impressive last week against Beth Cath, didn’t think they’d beat them as bad as they did, still like Prep by 2 scores

    5A – Penn Hills 28 – Manheim Central 20 – probably the best game of the weekend, think MC will have some problems with PH speed, but they have a decent chance to win, appear to be pretty evenly matched, team that makes the least mistakes will likely win, nice to have 2 public schools playing for the title in 2nd largest class

    6A – St. Joes 42 – Harrisburg 14 – Harrisburg has the athletes to keep this close for a while, but SJP wears them down in the 2nd half, I thought Coatesville was the only public school this year that had a chance against SJP, and I still feel that way despite their upset loss last week.

  580. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – your are right about Southern Columbia junior receiver Julian Fleming, he’s a fantastic player who definitely has a chance to be playing on Sundays in about 5 years, he’s the total package, size (6’3″ 210), speed, great blocker, I watched him play earlier this year on PCN against their rival Mt. Carmel and he was dominant, their junior class is a special group of kids, just like Preps were last year, not as many D1 players of course, but similar type of class on a smaller level.

  581. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    Great analysis. I will say this about your comment on SCA and ECP. I think SCA could beat ECP, but I don’t think that is the question. To me there are 2 ways to judge teams when they do not play each other and you have to use hypothetical analysis to figure it out.

    The first way I view it is: if the 2 teams played 10 times who would win the majority and by how many more games. In this scenario, again I do think SCA would win games against ECP, but I think ECP would win 7 or 8 out of 10. So in this case I can understand SCA fans stating they believe they would win because they would have a chance, but a small one imo. It would need to be the day when all is going right for SCA and nothing right for ECP. Games like that happen all the time.

    The second way to judge teams is if they flipped schedules what the results would look like. I think we can all agree that ECP would have nothing but freshman playing the whole second half of every game on SCA schedule including the playoff including this week. So the question becomes: “What would SCA do against ECP’s schedule?” I do not see them winning more than 4 regular season games against that schedule. Plus for arguments sake lets say they did make the playoffs, they would probably be hurting real bad and not have the depth to be competitive in the playoffs.

    So the gist to my very long winded explanation is, in a one off game against ECP, yes they could pull something out if the star align. Are they the better team than ECP or could they compete at a 4A level and succeed like ECP, hell even TJ or SF? No not very likely. I do think they could compete very favorable in 3A. That would have been a great game between them and the Quips.

  582. GaryZ says:

    St. Joes 35- H-Burg 13

    PH 41 – MC 20

    ECP 28 – TEP 20

    Quips 49 – Middletown 6

    SoCo 42- Wilm. 7

    Farrell 42 – LT 6

  583. GaryZ says:

    Regardless of your best wishes too all, your shot at WPIAL Schools vs the rest was uneducated at best. Why don’t you do some research and see what the WPIAL has done in States since ‘92, tell me what you find out. Better yet why don’t you research what the WPIAL’s record is vs D10 “the North” in the playoffs. Good luck too all from the West!

  584. D10 Insider says:

    Gary I was talking about the playoffs this year, I’m also not trying to take shots at anyone:

    D10 was 3-1 vs WPIAL teams in the playoffs this year was the point I made, like a week ago. Also, I follow ECP mostly, they are what? 8-2 or 9-1 in the last 10 games vs the WPIAL Champ? I’m not gonna do that research when in the last 10 years it’s been this lopsided.

  585. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    @GaryZ-Welcome to the 21st century. 1992 was 26 years ago. How about we talk about this decade….

  586. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Several months ago during the off season I posited that Southern Columbia should have scheduled one of the big boys to quell this unnecessary controversy. Coach Roth and the Tiger faithful should have heeded The artist’s advice. You got to strike while the iron is hot, when the program is seemingly at its peak; a year or two later may be too late. I for one think they would have dogged the Ramblers.

  587. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Southern Columbia is also currently the #1 ranked wrestling team in AA in PA. Edging out D-10’s Reynolds who sits at #2.

  588. D10 Insider says:

    Their really is a discussion about who would win SC or ECP? Why? Artist, I respectfully disagree. I think SC is on the wrong side of the mercy rule in that one.

  589. GaryZ says:

    Fair enough, just thought you were dogging the WPIAL. I know you are an ECP fan, I want them to win as well.
    I Am aware of the century, my point was the WPIAL has won a PIAA Champ every year since ‘92. Plus the WPIAL has done very well vs D10, the remarks made were suggestive of D10 being superior to the WPIAL… which is not the case.

  590. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 Insider – some of the Southern Columbia fans think their team could compete with the big boys because they crush everyone in 2A, several of them stating they could easily win 3A and would be competitive and have a chance to win 4A, I do think they would likely win 3A, although Aliquippa would give them a very competitive game, and they could beat a lot of 4A teams, but I think Prep or Imhotep would likely handle them pretty comfortably.

    @Artist – I agree, wish SC would have scheduled a top 4A school in their vicinity like Bethlehem Catholic, they are loaded this year and next and now’s the time to schedule a game against a much bigger school, would have been good for their team and great for the game in general.

  591. Mike F says:

    WOW Farrell just pouring it own. I expected them to win big, but this was total domination.

  592. Jeff H. says:

    @Mike F – too bad Farrell couldn’t play Southern Columbia, think that would have been a very good game, I said on the eastern board this game would probably be a mercy rule, and some of the LT faithful got a little miffed, but I knew when Farrell blew out Sacred Heart last week this was going to be no contest. One of the downsides of going to 6 classes is we get some total blowouts like this in Hershey, it’s happened every year and will continue to happen, not that it didn’t happen occasionally with 4 classes, but it’s almost guaranteed there will be a couple of blowouts every year with 6 classes.

  593. Mike F says:

    Jeff H,

    I agree this is an extremely talented Farrell team. Defiantly very underrated. I think the broadcaster said the OL averages 6-2 290. That is huge for HS football. Then you have all those athletes, damn they are impressive. I think they would give SCA a game. Schools like them could play the big boys and win. But like I said in a prior post the problem with these small class teams is the depth won’t allow them to play at the 4A or higher level for a whole season.

    As far as 6A vs 4A goes, i have always been in the 4 class camp from the start and nothing I have seen has changed my mind.

  594. Jeff H. says:

    @Mike F – completely agree, in a one game situation Farrell could compete with the big boys, but not over a full season, due to a lack of depth they would get worn down, I too think Farrell would give SoCo a great game, and Farrell vs. Aliquippa would be a classic, they are almost mirror images of each other.

  595. Jeff H. says:

    Jeff H. – congrats to Farrell on a dominating performance today and tremendous season. I get the impression this may be one of their best teams in school history, which is saying something given their rich tradition that goes back a century. I know they’ve had some great teams in the past including back to back state champs in the mid 90’s when they were still in the WPIAL, any of you D10 guys who follow them closer than I do think think this team stacks up as one of their best ever? Curious as to what some long time Farrell followers think and where this team ranks in their storied history.

  596. GaryZ says:

    @Jeff H
    I am not from Farrell/Sharon area, but I have been coaching and playing in the WPIAL A long time. This years team is absolutely loaded with talent and well coached. I would put them 1A next to the ‘95 team. That was one heckuva team with Renny Gash at QB, Buck Newell on both lines, Newell went on too have a very nice career at Grambling. I remember watching them absolutely dismantle a highly talented Riverview team at three rivers in ‘95. Had so much speed and skill, plus they played in a brutally tough Conf. with W. Beaver when they were loaded. So between the ‘95 team and this team would be a toss up. Such a talent rich area, they were always crazy good in Hoops as well. They always played up in basketball and still dominated teams. Hats off to Farrell!

  597. B Powell says:

    ECP looked dang good last night and even though they have Lucas to give the ball to, they also played fundamentaly sound on defense and special teams.
    D10 Insider is right when he says those kids respond to the coaching and their tradition they’ve built.
    Seem like they didn’t even need to pass the ball and I kept forgetting how good Imhotep was to be at this game, four year in a row with Prep.
    But you could also see the Prep kids knew how to deal with the size imbalance on the lines and worked through it. Thank you, Cleveland St Edward and Clarkson North (Ontario) for getting us ready, eh? Eh! Prep was ready.

  598. sausmann9 says:

    Congrats Farrel on a great win!!! D10 Lawrence and Mercer love you guys! Wilmington up next – rock on with your bad self Big Dawgs.

    Also love the way the announcers confirmed where a few of ECP’s starters and major contributors came from and it wasn’t the Diocese schools. I think there were a total of seven NEW starters from other schools that came into Prep and filled those holes due to graduation. Like D10 says – they do it right up there, lmao.

  599. B Powell says:

    Too much winning. That’s just too much. 😉

  600. Jeff H. says:

    Congrats to Prep on a dominating win last night, I thought the goal line stand and subsequent 99 yard drive might have changed the momentum, but Prep answered and took it to them the rest of the game. I can’t understand why more schools aren’t recruiting Billy Lucas, I know he doesn’t have great speed, but he’s a hard nosed, shifty runner who gains a lot of yardage after initial contact, know he has an offer from Bowling Green, but I would think the rest of the MAC schools like Akron, Kent, Toledo, Miami, Buffalo, etc. would be all over him.

    Now the big question, how many titles in a row does Prep have to win at 4A before you D10 guys finally agree it’s time for them to move up, they will definitely be the favorite again next year, and at this point I’m not sure anyone is going to beat them. They would be very competitive at 5A, and quite likely could have won 5A this year, this was supposedly going to be a down year for them by their standards yet they beat teams by a bigger margin in this years playoffs than last years team that was loaded, seems like the competition in 4A is getting worse, not better.

  601. New2PA says:

    So, using the new PIAA success factor, ECP has 4 points. If they get 2 more next year and have 5 transfers, they have to move up. Likely they will get the two additional points (state quarters in 2019). Not sure about the 5 transfer over the 2 year cycle though.

  602. Mike F says:

    Alright Wilmington 6-0 mid 2nd. They came here to fight. Hopefully they keep it up. That is a proud program they aren’t going to cower because us if its on the internet say they have no chance.

  603. Mike F says:

    14-14 at half. This is exciting football. Both teams playing their hearts out.

  604. Jeff Hoener says:

    @Mike F – thanks for the updates, I’m still at work and will definitely be catching the replay when I get home, sounds like a great game, go Greyhounds!!!

  605. GaryZ says:

    SO IMPRESSED WITH WILMINGTON. Regardless of where it goes from 14all, big up too Wilmington. So tired of hearing how SoCo would destroy Penn St. on Saturday and then the Steelerson Sunday. Hats of too the Hounds.

  606. B Powell says:

    Now 28-14 Southern Columbia near start of 4th.
    Southern taking control and stopping Wilmington and then getting the ball in Gage Garcia’s hands on screens and inside runs.

  607. B Powell says:

    Another interception by thrown Wilmington and Gavin Garcia 38 yard TD on next play.

  608. B Powell says:

    Another stop and then, grinding Wing T offense and Gage Garcia TD.
    Boy oh day, they are on a roll now.

  609. B Powell says:

    Gavin Garcia 33 yard TD run. Now 49-14.
    4:35 left.

  610. D10 Fan says:

    It’s hard to argue that point after this year. CP has definitely elevated itself head and shoulders above the rest of 4A

    Are public schools not allowed to accept transfers? Theres nothing wrong about accepting kids that want to play for your program and it doesn’t matter if youre boundary or non-boundary. And I dont know where the 7 new transfer starters came from. Schleicher, Scarabino, & Ervin Williams were the only transfers that were starters. Darius Williams was a contributor but was not a starter. Shelby Wiley the other transfer barely played. So I don’t know how the 5 total transfers turned into 7 starters.

  611. Jeff H. says:

    Penn Hills up 18-7 at half, their speed is giving MC problems as expected. Evan Simon is a talented QB and I can see why he has D1 offers but I don’t think he’s seen too many D1 cornerbacks in district 3. Should be a good 2nd half, MC better stop PH on the opening drive and flip the momentum or they will be in trouble.

  612. Jeff H. says:

    @D10 – I knew Prep had a pretty good chance to win it again this year, but I was shocked how they demolished all their opponents in the playoffs, I think even you guys wouldn’t have predicted the way they romped through the competition. With the new rules in effect they will be playing 5A starting in 2020, and they will be very competitive. Mischler and the entire staff are fantastic, I was at the first game this year against PCC, and the amount of improvement they showed last night compared to that game is pretty dramatic, i know they had a scrimmage cancelled prior to that game and it definitely had an impact, but still the improvement is quite impressive, which is the mark of a great coach, if they played PCC again today they would handle them easily.

  613. GaryZ says:

    How good is PH, they are so Athletic. MC don’t see speed n athletes like that. Aliquippa will put on a show with their athletes as well. I would love to see St. Joes and PH play this year, maybe me being biased from the West, I’d like PH.

  614. GaryZ says:

    Daequan Hardy May be the best player in Hershey this week. We will see after tomorrow when the crew from Aliquippa plays, Will Gipson, MJ Devonshire and Avante McKenzie May have something to say bout that. Also Lucas from ECP is just a flat out stud! I think Hardy is having one of the best, if not best performances ever in Hershey. Wow Hardy is just on another level, everyone else looks like they are in slow motion compared to Hardy!!

  615. D10 Insider says:

    The move to 5A may be inevitable at this point. Maybe the 4A schools are getting weaker and CP is still the same old machine. Congrats to the Ramblers.

    D10 Fan, Sausman uses funny math and funny facts. Ross Tucker isn’t the brightest commentator he’s been wrong plenty of times, this was just another. You are more tha correct about the transfer players. I loved how you provided the names and facts and didn’t spew trash from some moron who got his information from ignorance.

    Sausman, that’s 3 in a row buddy. Tell me the 7 new starters please, I’ll hang up and listen.

  616. D10 Insider says:

    Jeff, couldn’t agree more

    Gary, with this performance tonight and Lucas last night Saturday is fixing to have an amazing solo act as well

    QB – Schleicher (Transfer)
    C – L’Amoureux (rising JR)
    RG – Janicki (RJR)
    WR- Oedekoven (RJR)
    WR- Neely (rising SR)
    WR – Baldi (RSR)
    WR – Williams (Transfer)
    TE – Scarabino (Transfer)

    So 3 on offense, Williams was the 4th WR and played roughly 25% of snaps on offense. Also, if Johnson doesn’t get hurt he leads this team to gold just as easily as Schleicher did. Not taking anything away from him but Johnson could have orchestrated this also.

    DE – Scarabino (Transfer)
    LB – Sittinger (RJR)
    LB – J. Williams (RSO)
    LB – Kubiak (RSR)
    CB – Carson (RJR)
    CB – Robinson (RSR)
    FS – Howard (RJR)
    SS – Kelly (RSR)
    SS – E. Williams (Transfer)

    So that’s 2. Nice math man. One of those 2 players is the same actual person too. Good job, again. Schleicher and Scarabino made major contributions, Darius and Ervin Williams were good pieces who made massive plays down the stretch, but ya those starters lost last year were replaced mostly by program players. Check your facts, guy.

  617. GaryZ says:

    If the Quips win today, which would be a monumental upset if they did not, would give the West 4 outta 6. That would definitely send a strong message that West is best, 2 for D10 and 2 for WPIAL.

  618. GaryZ says:

    I give all respect to SoCo. However if they are so confident they can play and beat anybody even multiple classes up, why don’t they give it a try. Like Jeanette always did when it was 4 classes, they were a Small A program and played up in 2A for competition. Like Aliquippa does now, and always have, one of the smallest Class A enrollments who chooses to play 2 classes up because they would get no competition in A or AA. The SoCo fans who claim they would beat ECP, Penn Hills or blow the Quips off the field are seriously mistaken. Just to remind the legion of SoCo fans, you have a losing record vs WPIAL teams. Play up a class or two and prove how superior you are. Once again, I do give them all the respect possible for their accomplishments. But play up and see how dominant you are.

  619. GaryZ says:

    Just wanted to give credit where it is due, the Aliquippa 12 year old Youth Football program won the National Championship in Florida this week. Not sure if it is 11-12 year olds or 12-13, I am not from their so don’t know for sure. Still an awesome accomplishment, and probably sign of things to come. Also dispels the comments I heard on other sites that the Quips have all kinds of kids move into the district.

  620. Jeff H. says:

    @Gary Z – I’m a WPIAL guy and have been following HS football for 45 years, PH has a great team and their skill kids are tremendous, but I wouldn’t like their chances against SJP, I think they would lose that game by at least a couple of scores.

    If the Quips win today as expected that would give D10 and the WPIAL 11 out of the 18 championships since the move to 6 classes, pretty impressive showing by the west.

  621. GaryZ says:

    I hear you, but St. Joes and their fine QB would have some problems with that Secondary. It would be a good game, especially if PH could be disciplined. I know St. Joes is a great team, the best in the State. Just think it would be interesting to see the matchup.

  622. WPIAL RULES says:

    Congratulations to the Western Part of PA for bringing home 5 out of 6 PIAA State Championships….. Yes I am including 6A St. Joe’s Prep because they were in the western bracket this year!

  623. GaryZ says:

    YES TECHNICALLY they were considered a West team, however no way do I include em in the 4-6 remark. That was the PIAA wanting to get a team from H-burg in the finals, so they put St. Joes to our side. #WESTISBEST

  624. WPIAL RULES says:

    @Gary… I’m well aware of it… Just making fun of the PIAA!

  625. GaryZ says:

    YOU and I both brother. Such a joke their decisions and “logic.”

  626. D10 Insider says:

    I can’t believe after all the garbage about how it’s unfair for public schools, crying about recruiting, non boundary, boundary, Private, charter, blah blah blah you have 6 state champions and 4 of them are public schools. Spare me the percentages talk, I don’t care the ratio of public to private schools because the champions ratio is 4-2. I can promise you those 4 public school champions aren’t complaining about why they lose, they find ways to win. Just like St Joes and Cathedral Prep.

  627. sausmann9 says:

    @D10 – youre just too funny! We can tell you are young, lol.

    two of the four MAJOR contributors in all your games this season are transfers; ie take away your quarterback and TE/DE and lets see what happens with the backups that were suppose to start this season. Not to mention the other TWO on defense in your title game. Please spare us the ECP righteousness, its just not there, lmao.

    And when you guys did face equal competition you barely won the first game and lost the other two to Eds and Ont. We’ll see how the 5A schedule treats you all, or maybe not if ECP staff can manipulate some more numbers.

    Your championship ratio is ONCE AGAIN wrong but how dare you let the truth get in the way of a great story ending, lol.

    shall we venture a guess to how many new names appear on the starting roster at ECP that appeared on other rosters this season??? With all ECP can do, its really not all that impressive on what you all actually get done. 3 losses with a team like that, uhhh???

  628. B Powell says:

    Success factor?
    Can’t some of these teams like ECP, Farrell and Southern Columbia stay down where they are if they choose to?
    Even Wilmington could get moved up, your saying, if they finish 2nd place a lot?
    If they’re under the student count, I don’t see why they should have to move up. It should be voluntarily like Aliquippa in football and 1A Kennedy Catholic does 6A in basketball.

    I mean, my FLB team played and lost to ECP for the D10 4A title, but that’s life. Prep was better.
    I wouldn’t even think to suggest they should move up to 5A.
    I have to be fair about things, too. ECP starts their lifting program in January and I don’t believe FLB does that until June, for the next season?
    So, ECP outworks us in the off-season and I’m supposed to cry foul? Nope.
    No, I won’t.

  629. D10 Insider says:

    Sausman you still haven’t named the 7 new starters from transfers that you were spitting back from something you heard on the television. The QB got beat out during the year and only played at the end because Johnson was injured, so that argument is beat. Scarabino was a big help, but not the reason why. Billy Lucas could argue that.

    How is my champion ratio wrong? Then again you don’t know the difference between 7 and 4 so I can’t expext an explanation here.

    The 3 losses also show that they played a tough schedule, and are getting rings because of it. Another thing for you to hate and another thing for you to be wrong about. My age has nothing to do with how dumb you are.

  630. D10 Insider says:

    Also, please name the 3 starters on defense who transferred in:

    DL – Scarabino, Carson, Lupo
    LB – Sittinger, Williams, Kubiak
    DB – E. Williams, Lucas, Kelly, Carson, Howard

    Hmm, wrong again, I only see 2 transfers in that mix. Two transfers that weren’t recruited from their public school programs. How many times do I have to correct you? Now, let a few people respond, so my comment isn’t visible anymore and regurgitate something you saw on Facebook, or heard in AM radio.

  631. New2PA says:

    For the success factor, if you get 6 points and have 5 transfers (for football) in a 2 year cycle you move up. If you don’t reach BOTH thresholds you don’t have to do anything. State Finals Appearance is 4 points, Semi Appearance 3, Quarters 2. Points are not additive – just where you finish. Applies only to football and hoops I believe.

    Winds of change are blowing harder than anytime in last 8 years. I think there is a good chance something major happens in the 2020 realignment.

  632. Jeff H. says:

    @GaryZ – I agree it would be interesting to see Penn Hills play SJP, you mentioned if PH could be disciplined it would be competitive, but that’s a might big IF, they have not been disciplined for years, going back to the prior coaching staff, I have seen them play at least once every year for the last 6 years and every game I’ve seen in person they’ve been undisciplined and take a bunch of stupid penalties, do that against SJP and they would likely get beat pretty handily imo, but it would be an entertaining game.

    Also, regarding Aliquippa, I think the primary reason they play up in 3A is because all their rivals are 3A schools, if their rivals were 1A or 2A they would probably play in that classification. Because the WPIAL is still in the dark ages by putting all teams in the same class in a conference, and don’t mix classes, Aliquippa has the choice of playing up, or traveling significant distances to play either 1A or 2A teams, and my understanding is that’s the primary reason they play up, not necessarily for better competition, although obviously that’s another benefit.. Regardless of the reason making the WPIAL final 10 years in a row is phenomenal and I doubt any other school will do it in our lifetimes regardless of class.

  633. Jeff H. says:

    @Gary Z – completely agree with you about Daequan Hardy, he’s a tremendous player, and his performance on Friday night was very reminiscent of Darelle Revis for the Quips back in the 2003 state final.

  634. Jeff H. says:

    @New2PA – the success factor rules are in effect for the 2018-2019 seasons, and will be implemented for the 20-21 reclassification, correct? I posted the same thing on the eastern site and someone said those rules don’t go into effect until the 2020 season, but everything I’ve read stated they went into effect back in August, which means if Erie Prep makes at least the quarterfinals next year, which is pretty much a given, they will be playing in 5A starting in 2020 if they have 5 or more transfers, I believe they had 4 this year, so one more transfer would put them over the top.

  635. New2PA says:

    The “counting period” is this cycle for points and transfers and the move up part of success factor formula begins in 2020. Note that its not “Transfers who played” but overall transfers. Can be a bench warmer.

  636. GaryZ says:

    @Jeff H.
    We agree on those points, PH does take some highly dumb penalties. Especially for trash talking, late hits and taunting. Eliminate those and that team could compete with anybody. You are exactly right though, that goes back years and multiple staffs. It’s almost a part of the culture, the Coaches really do not seem to come down on them too hard. I guess with that team in that area, you have to pick and choose your battles. Not that it’s an excuse but they did keep talking about how LeDonne is a “Players Coach.” Which usually means they allow the trash talk, taunting Etc. Regardless they are a great team and Hardy had one of best most dominant performances ever in Hershey. It was very reminiscent of the Revis performance.

  637. river runner says:

    D10 insider still sounds a lot like ole Tommy Boy from the Erie Times

  638. Jeff H. says:

    @Gary Z – absolutely agree with everything you stated about Penn Hills, it has become a part of their culture. Another disturbing thing about their culture is their student sections penchant for chanting bull s— every time they disagree with a call, that’s been going on for years too, both in football and basketball, I was at the 6A basketball final last year at the Pete with PR playing PH and their student section was out of control and chanted that numerous times, where’s the principal or other administrators to reign that in, I’m all for enthusiastic students, but think it’s improper for high school kids to be chanting that at sporting events, if my kids ever did that they would get a lecture from me and wouldn’t be attending any more sporting events for awhile. Someone on another board also made the same comment about their student section in Hershey. That does not in any way diminish the accomplishments of their sports teams but would be nice if they would clean up their act a little bit, it looks bad for the school and reflects poorly on the administration.

  639. Jeff H. says:

    Anyone out there know if Pitt is recruiting Hardy or Cephas from Penn Hills, if I was Pat Narduzzi I would be all over both of them. I know Will Gipson from Aliquippa has made a verbal to Pitt, and they offered MJ Devonshire, although I noticed during the game on Saturday he was wearing a WVU hand warmer, which would lead one to think he’s headed to WVU. You can never have enough athletes with speed like those 4 guys and I would be heavily recruiting all of them if I were Pitt, I think they unfortunately miss out on too many of the local kids.

  640. GaryZ says:

    @Jeff H
    Yes MJ is gonna go to WVU, his cousin plays their. Hardy is getting some big time attention now. I know he will be at a Pitt hoops game over break, a former College teammate of mine is an Offensive Quality Control Asst. They are very high on him now, rightfully so. Plus I heard from some Coaches that PSU is interested because they practiced their Thurs. before the game. Tank Smith the RB is the Nephew of Terry Smith the Asst HC at PSU. Speaking of the behavior at PH on field and in stands, I am not sure if you know the area? Probably do, and we both know that is a very difficult place to grow up. Not the whole town, but those kids really face some challenges. High crime rate, bordered by Homewood. No disrespect AT ALL TO ANYONE WHO MAY BE FROM THE AREA. Just making the point that it is a rough place to come up and I do not think the school puts an emphasis on academics, prob due to a very low tax base. However that does not excuse some of the behavior on field and in stands. I think LeDonne turns a blind eye toward it, I know they are fond of walking through opposing teams side of field for warmups. A fellow coach told me they walked right through their pregame when they hit the field, talking trash the whole time to players and COACHES. So I guess it is what it is.

  641. sausmann9 says:

    @ river runner – you’re too funny!!! He’s young and naive to the scene outside of Erie Prep. He’s called out on most of his crap and he dances in circles. Its excuse after excuse but what I admire most is the fact he doesn’t let the truth get in the way of any good Prep story.

    I’d just like to know if Cherp could have added Schleicher as a quarterback, Williams as a wideout, and Scarabino as a tightend JUST ON OFFENSE, I wonder how TJ would have done, or if Wilmington or Clearfield, or McDevitt (oh wait they could have), or Saucon Valley, or any other team in the 4A classification.

  642. ECL/METRO FAN says:

    Sausmann-You do realize that in PA, you can pay tuition to go to any school in the state? It doesn’t have to be a private school. All public schools accept tuition. Just because parents don’t want to pay tuition for there kids to attend those schools doesn’t make it ECP’s fault.

  643. D10 Insider says:

    Sausmannunnnnnnnnnn no dancing here partner. Speaking of called out.

    You still haven’t backed up your “7 transferred in starters” comment with names and positions.

    You still haven’t backed up how my public to private champion ratio was wrong (4-2) just like last year. All u public babies have nothing to cry about. The percentages!! Wah

    Aaaaand If you took Scarabino and Schleicher and gave them to Cherp he would probably throw Scarabino the ball 4x a game off of play action and have Regan hand the ball off 30x a game. Prep would probably have just gone without a tight end (something they went without for the last 4 years) and started Johnson at QB. Prep would still be designing rings either way.

    My time is done for the year on this site. Another championship year for my Ramblers, and another year of crying for everyone who isn’t one!

  644. One more says:

    ECL/Metro fan – Sausmann has no idea what he’s talking about.

  645. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    ECL/METRO FAN — Here’s the thing, what has always seemed unfair to me is that these elite private programs give out scholarships or significant financial aid to the talented kids who they want to join their team. You literally got some really rich alumni paying for this — you bought a team, that’s weak. You might as well have a championship party with Jerry Jones and Robert Kraft as the guests of honor.

    D10 guy — You’re feeling a little too froggy if you asked me. The 2017 ECP team would have been creamed by PR or SJP and maybe by Wood as well.

  646. Clarkson North says:

    D10 Insider,
    We hope you’ll still be around here and aren’t leaving.
    St Ed’s

  647. D10 Insider says:

    Phillyboy – creamed??? LOL we’ll agree to disagree on that. Prep and PR played in a 7 on 7 over the summer and Prep won 33-0. Yes it’s just 7 on 7 but if you think pads and the line would have given PR the advantage you’re mistaken and must not know football very well. 33-0? Please.

    Clarkson North – if you think anyone is upset that we lost 3 games during the regular season, and then won states you’re as wrong as Sausman. How many teams would trade regular season losses for state championships. I hope u don’t coach. Also, if Preps scrimmage doesn’t get cancelled they beat PCC week 1. Still state champs. If they didn’t rest multiple starters for the playoff push they beat Clarkson by 3 scores. It worked. State champs. St. Ed’s won the biggest state title in Ohio. Beat the hell out of Prep 35-3. Lesson learned, STILL state champs. Private schools must teach adversity.

    I got Preps back, especially for all you haters.

  648. d6football says:

    Well here we are. 3 seasons with the new classifications and some data.

    MOV average for the past 3 years in the state title games:

    A 27.3
    AA 41.7
    AAA 23.3
    AAAA 16.0
    AAAAA 22.3
    AAAAAA 25.3

    An interesting point is that Southern had the biggest loss then followed it up with the biggest win in terms of final score in the 3 years.

    I can compare the A-AAAA levels further to see if the gap was as great back then as it is now.

  649. d6football says:

    I compared the years previous to the split to 6 classes. 2015-1988 in terms of margin of victory in the title game.

    A 17.2
    AA 15.9
    AAA 18.2
    AAAA 17.9

    Compared to the 3 years since the split to 6 the average MOV went from 17.3 to 26. About a touchdown worse in the spread across all title games since we split from 4 to 6.

  650. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    D10 Insider — So ECP beat PR during the summer of 2017 33-0 in a 7 on 7? On the surface that’s a pretty good counter point. I don’t know what happened there, Perhaps PR was just practicing their plays as opposed to trying to win the game. Was PR missing any key players? But as you acknowledged, big difference between that and a real game. I attended the North Penn scrimmage against Don Bosco Prep back in August of 2010 in Lansdale. NP went toe to toe with mighty Bosco, losing 31-27 I believe. NP was winning at one point 27-17 as I remember. If they had played a real game later in the year, NP probably would have had their hands full. You can also look at common opponents. They both played PCC in 2017. ECP won handily, I think PR fared better there. During the regular season PR was beating PCC something like 41-7 at the half or thereabouts. Wasn’t that the game where Crawford scored 7 TD’s? And we can check the results of the calpreps ‘project a matchup’ feature where it has PR beatiing ECP 41-27. Just some thoughts.

  651. New2PA says:

    Why you gotta go and bring PR into this….IIRC, that was at slippery rock and the first 7v7 was a 2 pt game and a TD game the second. Maybe I’m off by a score. But you arr blowing smoke if you thought it was 33-0. Falcone didn’t play because he was hurt and neither did Burns.

    Exactly how was ECP going to stop #15 in a real game when they couldn’t play their BS drop 8 coverage. Play 5 in the box to Jurkovec and Crawford?

    People indulge you here because your entertaining, but you are way way off base thinking that ECP was going to be PR in ‘17.

    Actually, I got an idea.

    Play up in 6A.

  652. D10 Insider says:

    New2PA – In 2017, Grove City, Prep, Ferrell and PR went to SRU. Mischler sliced up the secondary, they couldn’t cover Terry Roberts, or catch Tyler Oedekoven. In the 2 games they played that day Oedekoven had 3 40+ TD receptions with Kenny White covering him on 2 and Fessler had another. Prep played cover 3 the entire game, and all Phil did was check down.

    One could argue that Juice Scruggs and Matt Bauer could have provided some pressure on Phil? And maybe the 2 D1 corners and D1 Safety could have covered PRs WRs?

    Prep isn’t going to play up because of a bunch of crybaby parents like you think it’s unfair. They’ll play where the rules put them, and will be in 5A soon enough where they will be playing against much bigger schools than them. Hang in theeeeere!

  653. New2Pa says:

    Those kids were good players, but 4 TD in 2 games doesn’t add up to 33-0 in one. Yes, I assume other kids scored too…

    I wish I was still a crybaby parent!

    I think one thing that rubs people the wrong way is that when people challenge you and provide reasonable options that you don’t like, you call them names. It seems very reasonable to me that if you think ECP has these great teams year after year, and you compare them to teams in other classes, playing up to see is a reasonable thing to do. “Crybaby parents” and people who think reasonably can reasonably come to the same conclusion for different reasons.

    I don’t think anyone doubts what a solid program ECP has, so just be happy with that.

    In any case, I think this whole discussion will end one way or the other in the 2020 reclassification. No change for at least another 10 years, or, with legislative direction, non-boundary schools moved to their own playoff system.

    Honestly, it seems like for ECP, given how they schedule with privates and local rivals, and how 4a play playoffs play out, they may only play a couple different teams in the playoffs and then only in the early rounds. For teams like PCC it could become a problem unless WPIAL continues to make their schedule and forces teams to play them.

  654. D10 Insider says:

    I think what rubs people the wrong way is when they come on and think they have valid points and then get proved wrong by someone who is right. Ask Sausman about that. I’m not a name caller who compares Prep to other teams year in and year out I believe I’ve only compared 17 PR/CP. I was 100% off on the score, but that game was one sided and you can’t convince me Otherwise.

    What else rubs people the wrong way is when Prep, who doesn’t break any rules, does what their told by the administration, bites their tongues to all the hate and misinformation that is out there keeps winning.

    Believe me guy, I know how good of a program ECP has, back to back to back. Definitely happy.

  655. B Powell says:

    He’s right about that.
    ECP players, coaches and fans were nice to FLB at the D10 title game and in fact, nice to us in others sports we play them, too.
    It’s like they respect us for trying as best we can and FLB kids are friends with many Prep and McDowell kids. Travel ball and cell phone contacts. Lol. The kids don’t care about the politics.

  656. Jeff H. says:

    My deepest condolences to the family and friends of the great Bill Fralic, and the entire Penn Hills and Pitt communities. Bill was my age, I went to neighboring Churchill (prior to becoming part of Woodland Hills) while he was in high school, we never played in football because they were in AAA and we were AA, and PH of course moved up to 4A when the classes were expanded in 1980, but I remember watching him in some playoff games and just being shocked at a kid my age who was so big and strong and quick and would literally flatten guys and run them over, classic hard hitting, low scoring games against schools like Gateway and Mt Lebo, he was so dominant someone came up with the term pancake block to describe his technique, a great player and man taken from this earth far too soon, RIP Bill and godspeed.

  657. sausmann9 says:

    @D10 – you can throw my name around all you want, just goes to show you have NO clue. I’m grown so name calling has no affect on me. My points are as valid as you can get – PLEASE TELL US what’s not valid about your quarterback and DE/TE playing for other teams last season and getting starting spots this season as Prep??????????????????????? Please tell us!!!

    And you think your beloved Prep doesn’t break any rules, LMAO. Okay – you just went from naive to ignorant. Enjoy your regional all-star trophy and then get on it b/c you all need a quarterback, two recievers and an all-state DE/TE due to graduation AGAIN. lol

  658. sausmann9 says:

    @D10 – please stick to your promise, PLEASE!!!

    “My time is done for the year on this site. Another championship year for my Ramblers, and another year of crying for everyone who isn’t one!”

    yep now run along and go stroke that hollow trophy, get your flyers out in the mail, and get word going that graduation has opened up some starting spots on the greatest 4A that never was, lol.

  659. sausmann9 says:

    @ECL/Metro fan – no not all public schools in PA accept kids from neighboring districts. I know this for a fact and know a few schools in D11 area that will not accept kids whether from certain areas or at certain times of the year but I do know two or three schools that have not/will not accept students from outside their district. It is not law but up to the schools themselves as to who to who they allow, if any, to attend their school FROM OUTSIDE THEIR DISTRICT. Now if a kid lives within the district and the district has two or three high schools (ie bethlehem, allentown, etc…) then a student can go back and forth every other year if needed.

    I also know of a Catholic school in our area that is bulging at the seams (parents made comments to our local paper last year) but that school still accepted over a dozen new kids within the last four months. If you can pay and play, the privates will find a seat for you and nobody will dictate otherwise. Not so in the publics, taxpayers can force the issue of NOT accepting kids from NOT WITHIN that district.

  660. Mike F says:

    Just got back from vacation. I missed the 2nd half of the Wilmington/SCA game on and I didn’t want to come on here till I had a chance to watch it and the PH game. Not interested in the Saturday games as I knew the outcomes before the game happened.

    Damn shame that Wilmington couldn’t keep it up longer than they did. They gave great effort. Hats off to Roth and the SCA team/community. They do have a hell of a program there. They deserve all the accolades they get. With that said they should pump the brakes a little before all the bravado talk. I think Farrell vs them would be a hell of a game.

    Penn Hills making the WPIAL proud. Not saying they win but it would be a great game against SJP, but like others mentioned discipline would be key. I didn’t know this but the Late Great Bill Fralic picked up the teams tab for the trip to Hersey. He is surely to be missed as he was not just one of the best linemen ever to play, but he was also a great person as well.

  661. D10 Insider says:

    Sausmannnnnn, hahahahaha.

    Did you make a “valid point” when you said:

    “Also love the way the announcers confirmed where a few of ECP’s starters and major contributors came from and it wasn’t the Diocese schools. I think there were a total of seven NEW starters from other schools that came into Prep and filled those holes due to graduation. Like D10 says – they do it right up there, lmao.”

    And then named 2.

    Try and keep up with a private school graduate a little better than that, you’re embarrassing yourself in front of all your peers.

  662. D10 Insider says:

    This goes out to Sausman:

    All you have done is regurgitated thoughts of other people that you saw on Facebook or in the “letter to the editor” section on catholic schools and try to claim them as your own without actual proof of anything besides hearsay. Embarrassing.

    Proof? Listening to the state championship game (That Prep won, again) you heard they had “7 newcoming starters Transfer in that didn’t play for Prep the prior year” which is wrong, and then couldn’t provide the 7 names/positions.

    You don’t really know which schools are public and which are private. So how could your opinion hold any weight?

    Proof? You said the Public to Private school ratio of 4-2 (Public’s to Private) state champions is wrong. Prep and St. Joes were the only 2 Private school champs this year. Nice public school math.

    You ask about the validity of Scarabino and Schleicher starting at Prep but have no idea that Scarabino was 3rd on the depth chart at QB after getting beat out by Schleicher and A RISING JR QB AT PREP. Who in fact BEAT SCHLEICHER out for the job midway through the season. In the 4 games he played healthy he was better. So if #6 doesn’t transfer in, still sizing rings. Now Joe didn’t get the QB spot, or the MLB spot after being a 3 year starter and ALL STATE selection at both and couldn’t even start at Prep? Sounds like Mischler and co made NO promises to start to anyone. Also, both were APPROVED to transfer.

    We don’t send out flyers or any of that garbage you cats may do on the east side. Around here our reputation speaks for itself. Our social media coverage, and television coverage, and local community support does all the work flyers would do. Plus, the weight room program starts after Christmas and the staff will be busy doing that instead of designing pamphlets.

    You want to say transfers had major contributions in all of our games? You do know Billy Lucas and the offensive line are the reason why number 3 in a row is up here in the 814. Probably not thoUgh, because all of those guys have been there for 3/4 years. That doesn’t fit your tissue-filled rants.

    You’d like me to stick to my promise of not posting so you can litter this site with more of your nonsense and ignorant opinions. Question my knowledge of Prep, D10, the public schools in our area? I played at Prep, Coached at Prep, and a few public schools in our area, and can tell you FIRST hand that Prep does things the right way.

    Losers hate Winners Sausman. Which one are you and which one is me? Thanks for playing.

  663. B Powell says:
    ECP/Villa also have a very nice Events Center they are good about renting out to D10.
    For instance, they’ll have the D10 class AA wrestling sections there next spring – even though ECP is AAA wrestling.
    Seems like if they wanted to, they would keep this to themselves, but it hasn’t been this way.
    It’s one of the nicest places around for sports events and it isn’t a big money grab for ECP because this whole facility was built with private funds, I have heard.
    Their alumni give back and that’s a sign of a good school.

  664. Mike F says:

    All I will say about ECP, is they are a very well coached team and a fine institution. If I lived in the Erie area, there is no doubt that I would send my son/daughter to ECP/Villa or Mercyhurst Prep regardless if they played sports or not.

  665. Chris Barber says:

    What would be most impressive is if you keyboard warriors would use your actual names and not hide behind fake handles. To see how you are acting online is pathetic. Treat each other with respect. This is what makes America such a hostile country – idiots like you who are bickering back and forth. Christ, grow up and act like the grown men you think you are!

  666. Tyler Billson says:

    Chris Barber is easily the toughest guy on the Internet. This dude shows up on this forum, reads the back and forth banter by sports fans and then calls THEM idiots. Do you go to movies and make fun of the people watching them with you? Takes one to know one “Chris Barber”

  667. B Powell says:

    Getting back at it and unfazed by the banter…
    Did you guys notice there were a few teams in PA and OH who are winning, still, with an offense other than the spread? It seems at the high school level it can still be done and I’m old school and love defense so I find the pro style, 2-back set and a Wing-T enjoyable.
    Just don’t fall behind too far. lol.
    But still, even the Baltimore Ravens have strapped on the pads and have gone after it the last 5 weeks and have been pushing teams around.
    I get it, the spread offense is here to stay and works best for the teams with athletes and speed but I can’t seem to get used to it and the running game from the spread is…boring? I don’t know how to describe it any other way, but boring. A running QB and a RB on his shoulder with a few jet sweeps to X-backs and receivers and points, points, points, pass, pass…
    45-42. Big 12 .

  668. D10 Insider says:

    B – Their is something about watching a team run the hell out of the wing T. It’s almost poetic. I think these guys need to incorporate more pass plays from these sets or be able to spread it out if they have to. It’s disheartening to see solid teams like Erie High, or recent Meadville teams be handcuffed if they have to play from behind.

  669. B Powell says:

    You’re right.
    Also, how many teams seem to overthink and have trouble with 4th and 1 these days?
    I can’t remember it and what has happened to the standard, “Brady dive” where the QB just jakes a step back and looks for a hole and gets a push from the RB’s behind him. Tom would pick it up about every time in his younger days.
    But even watching the Steelers on 4th and 1 has been an adventure. I can’t remember them struggling so bad on 4th down.
    What has happened to the lead FB on 4th down?

  670. Mike F says:

    B Powell- I am right there with you. i hate the spread, i think it is boring football that is used to entertain the ADHD ( not a personal attack as I and my son both have it) crowd with more scoring. I love smashmouth football, hell I was a fullback. I love the grind. There are many sports out there for the fans of finesse, i like football for the physicality of the game. With the way rules are written and enforced now, it defiantly rewards passing the ball. Yet I think now is the best time ever to run the ball. Defenses are now made to defend the pass. They do not know what to do against a physical down hill run game.

    Look at what Pitt did this year. I was screaming at them against PSU because I saw every time they went downhill between the tackles they were getting 6/7 yards a pop. Yet they kept going east west or RPO that game. Once they figured out that they couldn’t pass the ball and the jet sweep had to be used at most 5 times a game, they started moving the ball and winning. Then in the Clemson game, yet again they are getting 4/5 yards a clip between the tackles against a dominate defense. Yet they try passing and edge rushing again.

  671. B Powell says:

    I think TX is having their state finals this weekend. Am I seeing (6) classes and (2) divisions and finishing on December 22??
    So, you’re one of two state champions. lol.
    Amd check this finalist out…think they have a numbers problem? I do.
    Roster size of 322 kids.,tx)/football/roster.htm

  672. The artist formerly known as phillyboy says:

    Just curious, how do you guys think ECP would fare against Duncanville, North Shore or Allen?

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